Is being a family compatible with lack of freedom?

[bmosca]

For context: My wife (DW) and I have been married for over six years and have two young children — our son (DS) is 3, and our daughter (DD) is 6 months and currently breastfed. DW is on maternity leave and expected to return to work sometime next year. I work full-time as a software developer.

Recently, a friend invited me to play football after work.
It’s been a while since I’ve done any sport or had time for myself, so I accepted right away.
Around midday, I let DW know I’d be playing for 90 minutes after work. Her reaction caught me off guard — she was upset that I hadn’t “asked” her if it was okay for her to look after the kids during that time. I ended up cancelling the game.
Later, DW was emotional and said she feels like she spends the whole day without seeing me, and was hoping we’d go for a walk together with the kids after work. She also reminded me that maternity leave isn’t a holiday — which I do understand.
But I can’t help wondering: isn’t her day less stressful than mine?
She spends her time breastfeeding while watching TV, napping, and bonding with the children. We’re currently staying with her parents, so she doesn’t have to cook or manage household chores.
Meanwhile, I’m working full-time, attending meetings, and mentally drained by the end of the day.
After work, I still help with cooking, cleaning, bedtime routines, bathing, reading stories, calming DD when she’s unsettled, changing nappies, playing with the kids, handling paperwork, mowing the lawn, and washing the car.
The only things I don’t do are laundry and lunch prep.

I genuinely don’t mind taking care of the kids if she wants to meet a friend or take time for herself — I’ve told her that. But I’m struggling to understand why I need explicit permission to do something for myself, especially when I gave her notice well in advance.
If this is how things are, does having young kids mean I can never do anything social or recreational without it being a problem?

If the situation were flipped, and mum was the one who'd arranged to play football once a week with friends after dad came home from work, and dad was upset because she hadn't asked his permission first, everyone would be outraged on her behalf. It's once a week! A man needs friends as well as work and family. Surely he's not being unreasonable to think he can have two and half hours a week to himself?

I used to look after a new baby and a toddler all day long and I had help in the house the way DW does in this post, and tbh I did not find it especially stressful. Boring, sometimes. Certainly easier than my full-time teaching job.

He isn't unreasonable to want two and a half hours to himself. His wife's issue was that he just told her that he was playing football that evening, with no notice. She was looking forward to him coming home and them doing something together.

I also don't like the way he has implied that his wife is living the life of Riley, at home with a breastfeeding baby and a three year old and that he begrudges her watching TV while she breastfeeds.

If the situation were flipped, there would be no way on this earth that she would not be making sure that her DH was going to be home in time every week before making a regular hobby committment.

I have to say your wife currently has it good and yes you should absolutely be able to have the odd game of football! Could you have caught her after a particularly stressful day? And although you shouldn't need permission you can't just announce it last minute, she might have been looking forward to seeing you all day and to get out of the house together. So next time you need to break it a bit more gently to her.

I'm a stay at home mum without practical family support and my husband does our cooking, but is way less hands on than you are. So I'd say she definitely is having a great deal at the moment. But that's not to say that clocking off from the kids at the end of the day won't be a big relief for her and a thing to look forward to. Being full time with them is amazing but it can feel like a slog on certain days too

The problem isn't about who has the more stressful job - both jobs are necessary, someone has to do them. It's also not really about wanting 90 minutes to run around kicking a ball (though, it wouldn't be 90 minutes would it, it never is.)

The issue is that you have two children... and you assumed she'd be fine to continue being the 'active' parent for them for extra time in that day, without checking with her if that was ok.

I bet you also just up and walk out of a room for a shower or a shit without checking she's free to supervise the kids.

I bet you do all sorts of things each day without ever checking that she's ok to actively parent.

I bet she ALWAYS checks with you before she sods off for a shower or a shit or to the shops.

Thats the issue. One person ends up being the active parent, always on duty, the other flits about without a second thought because they are not the default active parent.

Comments like this are beyond idiotic, ignorant and designed to shut down any exploratory or collaborative doalog.

Just because OP hasn't carried ans birthed the children, doesn't mean he can't feel the deep impact of having them.

And I say this at almost 38 weeks pregnant.

Exactly this really - you have a point that you should both be allowed some time for yourselves sometimes. I think it's probably best just to say at least would you mind if I play football on x day?

I'm a single mum of a 2 year old and live with my parents who help out a lot and even my mum and dad say that to me and they're not the parents, but they know I depend on them since I work full time.

If anyone has my child on their own for the day (including me) we're desperate for respite and adult company by the end of the day so I'm guessing your wife just finding it hard and wanting your company which is normal. 6 months and 3 years sounds exhausting tbh and I doubt she gets much time to watch much TV?

You should both be able to have time out to do social and recreational activities sometimes though - what you mentioned is certainly not an excessive ask. I'd sit down and discuss it with her and emphasize how much it means to you and how you think she should do the same.

Don't forget he said they live with parents so i imagine parents would step in from time to time so mum can do xyz

I think there are likely a few things going on:

She’s sounds desperate for more adult interaction and to feel like you are in it together. Spending your day with tiny humans who cant talk to you and are entirely dependent on you is pretty stressful for most women. And since she’s given birth in the last 6 months and is breastfeeding she’s likely pretty physically and mentally stressed by the demands on her body and changing hormones, along with increased anxiety and a feeling of being overwhelmed - both very common reactions to the physical and mental challenges of maternity. She isn’t doing the same thing she did before the child came along like you are. I know I was incredibly lonely when I looked after ours as babies. Compared to my life before and my DH, I spoke to way fewer adults, got very little positive reinforcement for what I was doing during the day and found it all incredibly repetitive. That dullness produces it’s own stress.

Also, the way you approached it was to treat her as the default parent. It’s not that you shouldn’t have 90 minutes to yourself to play football from time to time, it’s that actually you have children to look after and you didn’t make sure it was okay to pass off those responsibilities for a time. You assumed your wife would pick them up with next to no notice, rather than asking her. You took her for granted at a point in time where she likely isn’t getting much validation. As you get more comfortable with parenting together it may be okay to make some assumptions. You presumably already do when you go out to work each morning - an agreement you came to together than she would stay home and look after the kids so you could earn money to sustain the family. And you’ll find what you both find acceptable over time. But many women fall into the picking up all the pieces (and it’s mainly the dull pieces, all the drudge work, etc) during maternity leave and then finding themselves stuck in that role when they try and return to work. It leads to resentment and, not infrequently, divorce. So be glad she’s kicked up a fuss now and not just let fester.

You make it sound like she has a cushy life at her parents home watching TV all day and being waited on hand and foot, and maybe she does. Though I suspect parents, even if they’re really lovely, can be a bit suffocating. But even if she does, that doesn’t mean it’s okay to forget that it’s only because someone’s looking after your children that you are able to do anything without them at all. That’s something she’s likely never able to forget. So yes, you should ASK her, not just tell her what you’re doing.

OP, your current circumstances are favourable to you both in different ways. You also both add value to your partnership.

Bottom line is your wife has a lot of support. You're living with her parents and while she's on mat leave, doing what she rightly so should be doing; she's also being taken care of. I've done parenting completely alone with a toddler and young baby and the experience would have been much less challenging with someone else cooking and cleaning for me and there for me to pass a child to if and when needed

You don't need 'permission' to look after your health and wellbeing. If a man put that on a woman, there'd be cries of control and abuse.

I'd definitely sit and have a chat about it and set it as an expectation/regular part of your routine moving forward. It's also beneficial to have a shared calendar. Ask your wife how she'd like it to look when you're planning to play football or see family or friends after work. Also dicuss time for the 2 of you alone too. She may be missing that more than you realise.

Do not be guilted or shamed into not engaging with life outside of your DC's and wife, same goes for your wife. However, if she's choosing to be a martyr and decline, that's her decision. With open and respectful communication, you crakc on with yours.

Is she by herself though? As he says they are currently staying with parents so one could assume they are there in the house as additional helping hands when needed

It’s the mundanity of being at home with the kids that can be a killer. Knowing you get to for a walk with another grown up can be the light at the end of the tunnel some days. My husband always did what he wanted but would always check with me. Still does now they’re teenagers. I never say he can’t.

You’re more likely to get the green light for hobbies if you also make plans with her for other things so she has stuff to look fwd to so you’re at a hobby mid week but Saturday morning you get up with the kids so she can have a bath and tea in bed then you can go out for a walk and lunch together.

She will be able to tell that you think she’s just relaxing all day, when nothing could be further from the truth. You should try doing all night feeds and looking after the kids all day and see how relaxing it is!

Mentioning that you’re not coming home at the usual time at lunchtime isn’t advance warning, either.

We have a 10 month old DD. I took the first 6 months of mat leave, and now my DP is taking the second 6 months while I go back to work. So me and DP both have experience of looking after DD all day.

Crucially, that means we both respect each other’s efforts. We both know it’s exhausting and draining rarely being able to address your own needs.

My job is full on, but I can go to the toilet easily, eat easily, drink a hot coffee before it goes cold, talk to adults, and have no small humans relying on me to stay alive and entertained.

I finish work on the dot, and take DD out for a walk to give DP a short bit of me time. He did similar when he was at work.

We’ve both been away overnight on our own 2/3 times since she was around 6 months. But we always discuss it and plan well in advance (longer than a week in advance usually) so the other person has chance to make their own plans.

You can of course do things for yourself, as long as it’s equal and there’s respect there. If your wife objected then it doesn’t currently feel like that to her. And from your post I can see why!

Surely it's the same day arrangement ,communicated at lunch time that's the issue. I think I would be assuming staying at her mum and dad's is a positive thing if I thought it wasn't an issue for you to be late home at short notice or without more consultation.

Its important for both parents to have downtime to do things they love or will enjoy. You both work hard and both will feel drained in different ways from what you do. In this situation you should of been able to go to football seen as you hadn't done anything social in a while, equally checking its ok with your wife first - as I agree with others thats how it should be done when your parents to very young children.
Maybe going forward you should have a talk and come to an agreement that you both get some free time each week to unwind and be social/do a hobby so its fair. It may not always go to plan but if you work as a team to help eachother have downtime im sire it will work out.

I work full time in a ‘big’ job and am the main breadwinner. My job is infinitely less difficult and less stressful than both my mat leaves were. Kindly, I suggest you try being in sole charge of both kids for a whole day and see how you find it.

1. When was the last time your wife had any "time for herself".
2. If you're staying with wife's parents so she "has no cooking or chores" why are you listing cooking amd cleaning after work. Surely that applies to you both?
3. Announcing at 12pm you have plans after work isn't "plenty of notice"
4. If you think work is so "draining" and being on mat leave with 2 kids is so easy maybe you should swap roles
5. Breastfeeding is also draining and if your wife is napping during the day she was probably awake multiple times in the night to feed
6. Funny how you've taken the time to list every minute detail of parenting/domesticity you do after work yet minimise your wife's day to "watching TV, napping and bonding"

You have a partner problem not a freedom problem. She might be overemotional still, breastfeeding and hormonal doesn't help. She probably feels trapped herself as there's literally a small person stuck to her.
Just be kind to each other.

I don't think it's fair to be comparing days however you're not unreasonable to want an evening a week to play football.

And in your question, family life can absolutely be compatible with having your own hobbies. I have a 3 year old and 3 month old and I'm already back to my hobby I do once a fortnight. My husband also has one as well and we are also out individually seeing friends once a week. As long as we check with each other it's no problem. I'd go a bit mad if my husband didn't go out, I love an evening to myself once the kids are in bed to watch what I want on TV!

Oh without bothering to read 9 pages of comments you are certainly going to get ripped on this one. I half think this must be a joke post

Three things:

• It’s healthy that you both have solo time, however this really needs planning in advance, not sprung on the other
• Secondly, when you’re the one doing the majority of the nights and mornings, it breaks you and you’re not functioning at full capacity
• Lastly as the primary parent, there is so many other things I need to think about and organise that my partner doesn’t even think of. I can imagine there is a bunch of things that she does regularly that doesn’t even get mentioned to you

Hahaha - I remember when I went back to work after maternity leave (and twice more when I also had young toddlers in the mix). Felt like a luxury holiday after days at home with babies and young children!

Your wife’s day will be long and more exhausting than yours. It would have been polite to say ‘do you mind if I’m home a bit late?’

Rest assured it gets much much easier. My kids are older now, and it’s never a problem if DH goes out after work (or I do). We juggle and compromise and work it out…

I think the problem here isn't that you want to do something for yourself, but that it was arranged last minute. Mat leave can be lonely, and if she'd had a tough morning and was looking forward to you coming home, going for a walk and having some adult conversation, then to have that delayed by two hours, and the nice early evening she planned being replaced by having two young children at witching hour and then straight into the rigmarole of bedtimes, then that probably did upset her. If it was pre-planned "do you mind if I play footy with John next Thursday?" then she can have got easy food in, maybe met with a friend for coffee in the afternoon to get some adult convo. I don't think either of you are unreasonable, life just takes more planning with children.

Swanning around an office having meetings is ai much easier than being at home with a baby and toddler. Get a grip. You both need time to yourself. Just don’t spring it on her next time.

Exactly. I can't imagine a woman booking an evening out and having her husband manage bedtime for 2 little ones without asking first.
How often has he done bedtime for both on his own? Judging by his description, zero.
It's OK to have an evening to himself, but I'd be fuming if my husband made plans without consulting me first (unless it's an important work event, or some sort of special event he has to accept or decline right away).