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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not see the appeal of Reform

421 replies

Reallyneedsaholiday · 01/09/2025 15:57

Sure, I can see the appeal of “reform” (with a lower case “r”), noone is under any illusion that the country is in a great way, at the moment, but not the appeal of the Reform political party. And I genuinely want to understand what it is that has so many people in thrall to them. All I’m hearing is “sToP tHE bOAtS”, but Reform will not do this, no matter what they are saying now. Simply returning anyone who arrives here on a boat, without following due process and considering their application, would see the country subjected to international sanctions, that we cannot afford. The only viable way to actually stop the boats, is to address why people are using them in the first place. WE have decreed that no one can apply from anywhere other than on our soil, and so have left them with little choice. France offered the opportunity to have a centre in Calais, Rwanda would have also worked, as a base where asylum seekers could apply without risking their lives on the channel. Those who are successful could be brought here safely, and anyone using unauthorised routes, could THEN be legally removed without appeal. It’s not a difficult solution, so you have to ask yourself “why” politicians turned down the opportunity. The only logical reason for this, is that they WANT the boats to continue. Again, you have to ask yourself “why”, and the reason for THAT is simply that they want the distraction, they need the scapegoat.
We’ve all seen the headlines, claiming that asylum seekers are living in the lap of luxury, with free phones etc, which is simply not true. Asylum seekers actually cost the country less than we lose through tax avoidance, every year.

But if we put immigration aside, as the distraction that it is, what appeals about Reform? I’ve asked many people and really struggle to find any Reform supporter who can even tell me what any of their policies are. Why are they so keen to sign away our human rights, leaving us to the whim of successive governments? Why are they so keen to introduce a private health care system (good luck getting any cover if your have any pre-existing medical conditions in your family)? Why are they so keen to introduce fracking? Or to scrap “net zero”? Tbh, I’m not completely sold on “net zero” myself, but overall, being more environmentally friendly strikes me as a positive move. Less pollution, less plastics, cleaner water, cheaper, safer energy etc, etc. you could scrap the title “net zero”, while keeping the important bits that would generally improve our quality of life, without throwing what we have achieved, to date, away.

I could go on, but I’d just like to ask anyone who is thinking of voting Reform, at the next opportunity, why? And how you see your own life improving IF they won a GE?

OP posts:
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GingerPower · 09/09/2025 05:08

This reply has been deleted

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WhereIsMyJumper · 09/09/2025 07:26

Reallyneedsaholiday · 09/09/2025 01:05

You're completely missing the point of thread. All ive asked is for people to explain what aspects of their life do they believe would improve under a Reform government. If anyone could actually answer that question, I'd take them seriously.

I’m really not.
It’s another chance to sneer and look down on people who make different voting decisions to you.

Someone could come along and list the ways in which Reform might make their life better based on their policies and they’ll be met with more vitriol.

Plus, some people don’t vote only to make their own lives better - they may vote based on what they believe would make society better.

My life has not changed one jot whether Labour or Tories are in charge and I doubt it would
change if Reform got in. I don’t know who I would
vote for, but it would be out of logic not emotion and it wouldn’t be to virtue signal, either. I just can’t stand all this political snobbery.

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 08:04

Reallyneedsaholiday · 09/09/2025 01:01

Well obviously they're hiding something, trafficking people is illegal and they do'tt want to be traced. The people being trafficked aren't breaking the law, but the traffickers are.

It matters not. Both parties know what they are doing.

MumOfManyAliases · 09/09/2025 08:16

Reallyneedsaholiday · 09/09/2025 01:05

You're completely missing the point of thread. All ive asked is for people to explain what aspects of their life do they believe would improve under a Reform government. If anyone could actually answer that question, I'd take them seriously.

I don’t think we will have all the reckless spending of taxpayer money like we have under Labour. Here are just a few examples:

Ending of the Rwanda Asylum scheme - without even giving it a chance and after £700m had already been invested. 280 contractors lost their jobs.

£35bn on the Chagos deal - and yet apparently we can’t afford to give all our OAPs their winter fuel payment as we need to save the £1.3bn 😡

Part of a £1.6m grant given to a pop group that called the UK an “extremely racist s*hole”

£133 million in aid to Pakistan - a developed country with its own space programme and nuclear capability

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 08:35

MumOfManyAliases · 09/09/2025 08:16

I don’t think we will have all the reckless spending of taxpayer money like we have under Labour. Here are just a few examples:

Ending of the Rwanda Asylum scheme - without even giving it a chance and after £700m had already been invested. 280 contractors lost their jobs.

£35bn on the Chagos deal - and yet apparently we can’t afford to give all our OAPs their winter fuel payment as we need to save the £1.3bn 😡

Part of a £1.6m grant given to a pop group that called the UK an “extremely racist s*hole”

£133 million in aid to Pakistan - a developed country with its own space programme and nuclear capability

If the government can't be proud of its own heritage, why expect other countries to.

Alexandra2001 · 09/09/2025 08:42

Barbadossunset · 08/09/2025 12:19

Migrants refused asylum in EU, come here because they know we have no idea of their asylum status, no more have access to Schengen databases.

As migrants destroy their identification how would having access to Schengen databases help?

These databases also collect finger prints..... time and time again we hear of people refused asylum in EU but are here, going through asylm process, even given asylm.

Not being part of the EU is a huge disadvantage in fighting all cross border crime.

Alexandra2001 · 09/09/2025 08:48

MumOfManyAliases · 09/09/2025 08:16

I don’t think we will have all the reckless spending of taxpayer money like we have under Labour. Here are just a few examples:

Ending of the Rwanda Asylum scheme - without even giving it a chance and after £700m had already been invested. 280 contractors lost their jobs.

£35bn on the Chagos deal - and yet apparently we can’t afford to give all our OAPs their winter fuel payment as we need to save the £1.3bn 😡

Part of a £1.6m grant given to a pop group that called the UK an “extremely racist s*hole”

£133 million in aid to Pakistan - a developed country with its own space programme and nuclear capability

The Tories had 3 years to give Rwanda a chance.... even if fully operational, it was 5000 migrants over 5 years..... 1000 per year, 1000 cross in 1 day....

The 1st year was just 100....

The disputed 35bn is over 100 years, the WFA was 1.5bn per year, what is your alternative? close the base?

Reform want to send £7 Billion to Govts like the Taliban.....

Barbadossunset · 09/09/2025 09:35

I’m really not.
It’s another chance to sneer and look down on people who make different voting decisions to you.

This. The same happened on the Brexit thread. Posters would answer a question about why they were voting leave and fall straight into the trap. The regulars would then sneer and deride the poster between themselves on the thread - “haha, look another knuckle dragger/thicko/fascist/ old Etonian” or whatever.
This tactic was successful in removing dissenters from the thread but it was a less visited topic so trying these tactics on general political threads is less successful in removing anyone who disagrees.

WhereIsMyJumper · 09/09/2025 09:47

Barbadossunset · 09/09/2025 09:35

I’m really not.
It’s another chance to sneer and look down on people who make different voting decisions to you.

This. The same happened on the Brexit thread. Posters would answer a question about why they were voting leave and fall straight into the trap. The regulars would then sneer and deride the poster between themselves on the thread - “haha, look another knuckle dragger/thicko/fascist/ old Etonian” or whatever.
This tactic was successful in removing dissenters from the thread but it was a less visited topic so trying these tactics on general political threads is less successful in removing anyone who disagrees.

I agree.

If, for example, someone said they would vote Reform because they’ve pledged to scrap HS2 and their local area will be detrimentally affected by it, they’d be met with “well your mate Nigel won’t deliver on that/he doesn’t know what he is doing/he’s only telling you what you want to hear” and it’d be a pointless conversation and they will
make out that you’re stupid and ignorant. Way to win hearts and minds!

Thing is, some of Reform’s policies are sensible. Some aren’t. What else can we use to base our vote on when any and every politician is capable of over promising and under delivering?
Then, if we don’t vote because we say we don’t trust any of them, we get told we are wasting our vote that people have died for and we are in no position to complain in the future.

Politics has become far too emotional IMO. The discussions around it seem largely to bolster one’s self view of being a progressive or whatever rather than looking at the whole picture logically. I wish we could vote on policies rather than parties. Populism has completely taken over. I don’t want the PM to be someone I would choose to go for a pint with, I don’t have to like them, I just want them to be effective.

EasternStandard · 09/09/2025 09:50

Barbadossunset · 09/09/2025 09:35

I’m really not.
It’s another chance to sneer and look down on people who make different voting decisions to you.

This. The same happened on the Brexit thread. Posters would answer a question about why they were voting leave and fall straight into the trap. The regulars would then sneer and deride the poster between themselves on the thread - “haha, look another knuckle dragger/thicko/fascist/ old Etonian” or whatever.
This tactic was successful in removing dissenters from the thread but it was a less visited topic so trying these tactics on general political threads is less successful in removing anyone who disagrees.

The Brexit threads are total bin fires. Most avoid them now for good reason.

It's just the same group of posters flinging insults and not much else. And it's similar on other threads, although the Brexit ones got rid of anyone with another opinion.

MumOfManyAliases · 09/09/2025 10:53

Alexandra2001 · 09/09/2025 08:48

The Tories had 3 years to give Rwanda a chance.... even if fully operational, it was 5000 migrants over 5 years..... 1000 per year, 1000 cross in 1 day....

The 1st year was just 100....

The disputed 35bn is over 100 years, the WFA was 1.5bn per year, what is your alternative? close the base?

Reform want to send £7 Billion to Govts like the Taliban.....

The Rwanda plan was literally just being rolled out when Starmer binned it…

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 10:57

EasternStandard · 09/09/2025 09:50

The Brexit threads are total bin fires. Most avoid them now for good reason.

It's just the same group of posters flinging insults and not much else. And it's similar on other threads, although the Brexit ones got rid of anyone with another opinion.

I was cringing for those yesterday, trying to correlate holders of higher degrees with voting patterns. I don't care how many relatively small sample studies are carried out. When certain people cannot accept other people's political ideology and right to vote, I imagine a word that I can't type. They are everything they accuse you of.

WhereIsMyJumper · 09/09/2025 11:20

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 10:57

I was cringing for those yesterday, trying to correlate holders of higher degrees with voting patterns. I don't care how many relatively small sample studies are carried out. When certain people cannot accept other people's political ideology and right to vote, I imagine a word that I can't type. They are everything they accuse you of.

How embarrassing for them.
Above all the other bullshit about which party is right for the country and which policies are the best etc - the MOST important is people’s right to vote how they see fit. And yes, not vote at all if they so choose.

AlertLimeZebra · 09/09/2025 11:39

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jnh22 · 09/09/2025 11:52

MissedItByThisMuch · 02/09/2025 00:37

The appeal is the same as the appeal of any fringe party. Broadly the same as Donald Trump.

People are fed up with the mainstream parties and feel their viewpoint is not being represented. They feel ignored and disregarded and shamed for their concerns. They are worried for their future and don’t see anyone addressing those worries. Someone comes along and says “I’m different to them, I care, I represent you” and they feel heard and they don’t look too closely at the detail.

The rise of these “extreme” political movements is due to a failure of the mainstream to acknowledge and address people’s concerns as valid. That leaves the field wide open for extremists of various stripes.

I agree very much with this reasoning.

And until the main parties realise this is the reason people are flocking to the extreme parties - they will not change and more voters will move away. And the cycle continues.

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 12:10

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👏 ✌️

WhereIsMyJumper · 09/09/2025 12:33

@jnh22 I personally wouldn’t consider Reform an extreme party. Our political spectrum in this country is very narrow. Our most left wing parties are left of centre and our most right wing parties are right of centre. Especially when you compare to global politics and historical.

Cgar2018 · 09/09/2025 13:35

WhereIsMyJumper · 09/09/2025 07:26

I’m really not.
It’s another chance to sneer and look down on people who make different voting decisions to you.

Someone could come along and list the ways in which Reform might make their life better based on their policies and they’ll be met with more vitriol.

Plus, some people don’t vote only to make their own lives better - they may vote based on what they believe would make society better.

My life has not changed one jot whether Labour or Tories are in charge and I doubt it would
change if Reform got in. I don’t know who I would
vote for, but it would be out of logic not emotion and it wouldn’t be to virtue signal, either. I just can’t stand all this political snobbery.

I hear you - and for what it’s worth, it’s really not about sneering at people or looking down on anyone - disagreeing with a party or being critical of their policies doesn’t automatically mean people think less of the people who support them. That kind of attitude gets us nowhere.

I completely agree that people vote for different reasons - logic, values, society, or even out of frustration with the status quo - and all of that is valid. It's not about virtue signalling or tribalism; it's about calling out ideas or policies that I genuinely believe are harmful or misleading, not the individuals voting. Criticism of a party isn’t the same as snobbery toward its voters. We should all be able to talk about this stuff without assuming the worst of each other - that’s how democracy is supposed to work, no? And freedom of speech (that Farage seems to be bleating out a lot about recently!).

As an American living in the UK and can vote in both countries - I can’t help but see worrying parallels between Reform and MAGA. Trump promised to shake up the system, but what did the US actually get? Prices up, inflation up, job market not good (and he's trying to censor the stats on that!) division deeper than ever - ultimately absolutely no real progress for ordinary people. Farage’s open admiration for Trump is honestly a red flag for me. It’s not about snobbery - it’s about recognising patterns, and I’d hate to see the UK go down a similar path thinking it’s something new or different.

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 14:04

Cgar2018 · 09/09/2025 13:35

I hear you - and for what it’s worth, it’s really not about sneering at people or looking down on anyone - disagreeing with a party or being critical of their policies doesn’t automatically mean people think less of the people who support them. That kind of attitude gets us nowhere.

I completely agree that people vote for different reasons - logic, values, society, or even out of frustration with the status quo - and all of that is valid. It's not about virtue signalling or tribalism; it's about calling out ideas or policies that I genuinely believe are harmful or misleading, not the individuals voting. Criticism of a party isn’t the same as snobbery toward its voters. We should all be able to talk about this stuff without assuming the worst of each other - that’s how democracy is supposed to work, no? And freedom of speech (that Farage seems to be bleating out a lot about recently!).

As an American living in the UK and can vote in both countries - I can’t help but see worrying parallels between Reform and MAGA. Trump promised to shake up the system, but what did the US actually get? Prices up, inflation up, job market not good (and he's trying to censor the stats on that!) division deeper than ever - ultimately absolutely no real progress for ordinary people. Farage’s open admiration for Trump is honestly a red flag for me. It’s not about snobbery - it’s about recognising patterns, and I’d hate to see the UK go down a similar path thinking it’s something new or different.

Edited

You will find this forum and the real world, are poles apart. Trump and Farage offer a recognition of nationalism - something which scares the hell out of those with saviour complex.

Alexandra2001 · 09/09/2025 14:13

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 14:04

You will find this forum and the real world, are poles apart. Trump and Farage offer a recognition of nationalism - something which scares the hell out of those with saviour complex.

Nationalism, or rather the version Farage/Trump offer, should scare the hell out of any normal person.

No, MN is more likely to be representative of what most in the UK want, 1 in 3 people say they would vote Reform, that leaves 66% in the Real World, who don't support him at all.

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 14:16

Alexandra2001 · 09/09/2025 14:13

Nationalism, or rather the version Farage/Trump offer, should scare the hell out of any normal person.

No, MN is more likely to be representative of what most in the UK want, 1 in 3 people say they would vote Reform, that leaves 66% in the Real World, who don't support him at all.

Most people in the UK?! So out of touch. Why do the polls show Reform getting in if a GE was called tomorrow?

Alexandra2001 · 09/09/2025 14:23

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 14:16

Most people in the UK?! So out of touch. Why do the polls show Reform getting in if a GE was called tomorrow?

Do you follow the polls, perhaps you don't live in the UK.... seems like it.

Google "uk voting intentions" and come back?

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 14:26

Alexandra2001 · 09/09/2025 14:23

Do you follow the polls, perhaps you don't live in the UK.... seems like it.

Google "uk voting intentions" and come back?

I just did.

Dangermoos · 09/09/2025 14:28

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

I wouldn't give it another thought. I left school bullies behind years ago. If people have a problem with your voting preference, that's exactly it - their problem.

EasternStandard · 09/09/2025 14:31

Alexandra2001 · 09/09/2025 14:23

Do you follow the polls, perhaps you don't live in the UK.... seems like it.

Google "uk voting intentions" and come back?

You seem to be out of date with this.

Swipe left for the next trending thread