To not see the appeal of Reform

[Reallyneedsaholiday]

Sure, I can see the appeal of “reform” (with a lower case “r”), noone is under any illusion that the country is in a great way, at the moment, but not the appeal of the Reform political party. And I genuinely want to understand what it is that has so many people in thrall to them. All I’m hearing is “sToP tHE bOAtS”, but Reform will not do this, no matter what they are saying now. Simply returning anyone who arrives here on a boat, without following due process and considering their application, would see the country subjected to international sanctions, that we cannot afford. The only viable way to actually stop the boats, is to address why people are using them in the first place. WE have decreed that no one can apply from anywhere other than on our soil, and so have left them with little choice. France offered the opportunity to have a centre in Calais, Rwanda would have also worked, as a base where asylum seekers could apply without risking their lives on the channel. Those who are successful could be brought here safely, and anyone using unauthorised routes, could THEN be legally removed without appeal. It’s not a difficult solution, so you have to ask yourself “why” politicians turned down the opportunity. The only logical reason for this, is that they WANT the boats to continue. Again, you have to ask yourself “why”, and the reason for THAT is simply that they want the distraction, they need the scapegoat.
We’ve all seen the headlines, claiming that asylum seekers are living in the lap of luxury, with free phones etc, which is simply not true. Asylum seekers actually cost the country less than we lose through tax avoidance, every year.

But if we put immigration aside, as the distraction that it is, what appeals about Reform? I’ve asked many people and really struggle to find any Reform supporter who can even tell me what any of their policies are. Why are they so keen to sign away our human rights, leaving us to the whim of successive governments? Why are they so keen to introduce a private health care system (good luck getting any cover if your have any pre-existing medical conditions in your family)? Why are they so keen to introduce fracking? Or to scrap “net zero”? Tbh, I’m not completely sold on “net zero” myself, but overall, being more environmentally friendly strikes me as a positive move. Less pollution, less plastics, cleaner water, cheaper, safer energy etc, etc. you could scrap the title “net zero”, while keeping the important bits that would generally improve our quality of life, without throwing what we have achieved, to date, away.

I could go on, but I’d just like to ask anyone who is thinking of voting Reform, at the next opportunity, why? And how you see your own life improving IF they won a GE?

I guess they would try to justify it in some way. Personally, I believe that no political party actually wants to "stop the boats", including Reform. It is simply not in their interests to do so. The news is dominated with stories castigating "illegal immigrants" for simultaneously "taking our jobs and our benefits", despite the fact that, as I pointed out, noone who is here illegally can access either. Somehow, these asylum seekers have become the bogiemen of our time. The vulnerable minority and scapegoat that every government craves. At one point it was "coloureds" (I am deliberately using the terminology of that time, not intending to cause offence), the "Irish", the single mothers, look at the disproportionate hatred conjured up against trans people, the pensioners and the disabled are on the list. The headlines test the water for the politicians and they see how many bites they get. Look at how Labour changed tack after the winter fuel allowance fiasco (the reception was more negative than they hoped for) but "illegal immigrants" are an easy target and an easier sell.

You need to raise this with the government. Labour are using the term " illegal immigrants ". What did your m.p say when you raised the issue?

I'm not asking people to "justify their vote", I'm simply asking them what I am missing. I have read a lot about Reform, including their manifesto and try and I might, I cannot find one single idea that would improve my own life, in any shape or form, if it was to be implemented.

But do you not worry,for the future of the UK
Where will all these people live
So many UK people are waiting on housing lists for years
Suddenly there are houses to house new comers
The NHS dentist doctors,UK people can't get appointments
The country can't keep taking in more and more people

Of course I worry about immigration, but not because we are "full". We take less than most other countries, no matter which "measure" you choose to use. Less per % of population, less per square mile of land, less by national wealth. We need to look further afield at removing the NEED that is driving immigration, and creating a safe environment for people, frankly to stay "home".
The other issues are precisely what I am talking about. Sort out the NHS. Sort out the housing situation. Sort out the education system. Let people live/ work/ retire with dignity and a reasonable standard of living, and stop demonising those who are worse off than we are. Look at the REAL reasons why we are struggling. Do you think the billionaires printing this rhetoric are worrying about whether they can feed their children, or afford to get a tooth removed? Poor people do not make other people poor. Without immigration, the NHS and the care system, would have already collapsed.

To not see the appeal of Reform, just take a look at Labour?

-The Bond price is now as high as it was when Liz Truss was forced out and the budget in November 26th could start a run on debt if she can't find 44.5 billion through higher taxation.
Our debt is running at nearly 95.8% of GDP so if we need a bailout from the IMF they would not have the funds.
Labour can't be blamed for the debt but has slowed down investment and growth through more borrowing, higher taxes on business and has not found growth. Now the doom loop is higher taxes mean less growth.

-Our energy costs are now the highest in Europe due to Ed Milliband's net 0 targets; oil production used to raise the UK 1% of total GDP.
He is banning petrol and deisil cars in 2030 although we do not have the infrastructure to support electric vehicles, many who live in flats and terraced housing cannot charge from home (30%) or at least 6 million car owners and his heatpump rollout is costing £700m a year in subsidies.

-Free Speech -30 people a DAY are being arrested for speech violations for offensive online communications under laws criminalizing messages causing "annoyance," "inconvenience," or "anxiety" .Graham Linihan recently arrested by 6 armed police for tweets. The On-line safety act is cracking down on freedom of the press, Wikipedia may have to withdraw from the UK soon to avoid draconian fines.
They are going to bring in more laws against Islamophobia and digital ID which can use AI to track who you are, where you stay, what you say.
The Government

-Sleaze - cronyism,
Particularly in relation to Starmer's personal donor, Lord Waheed Alli, who had received privileged access to Downing Street and paid Starmer in gifts.
Rushanara Ali -housing minister left after evicting tennants by inflating the rent.
Tulip Siddiq, The anti-corruption minister resigned over claims that her family ties to her aunt Sheikh Hasina – the ousted prime minister of Bangladesh accused of corruption.
Louise Haigh resigned after it emerged she had pleaded guilty to a fraud offence.
Jonathan Reynolds,falsely claiming to be a solicitor on his CV.
Angela Raynor - tax evasion

Seeming inability to get a good deal for Britain:
Chagos Islands - The tax payers alliance has found the cost could amountt o £47 Billion, 12 billion more than planned.

That's all without immigration which is the top issue for most voters, and is why Reform are 15% ahead in the polls.

I think Reform know exactly where the psychological wounds of the nations lie and are doing a great job of exploiting that understanding.

In reality they might just find themselves in government but utterly unqualified to govern, and everyone is going to suffer unfortunately. Unless they just put up AI candidates again, in which case they'll have to fold, fast.

For me, it's got nothing about them taking our jobs - 'cos it's clear they have no intention of working when England will give them a warm cosy home for free.

It's the expense involved in dealing with it all.

How much it's costing for their accommodation.

How much it's costing to feed, clothe & tend to medical & health requirements.

How much it's costing (fuel, maintenance & labour) every time a Boarder Force boat goes out to pick them up.

How much the Government "donates" to the RNLI each time they go out to pick them up (even though they make some non-committal statement they're doing it out of the goodness of their hearts, from charitable donations)

How much is it costing (fuel, maintenance & labour) every time they fly the coastguard plane up and down the channel for several hours per night, most nights?

Meanwhile, British citizens are dying in corridors 'cos our hospitals are falling apart.

Schools are struggling 'cos they can't afford materials & resources.

We can't afford to pay our membership fee to NATO - leaving us... A) vulnerable and B) At the mercy of that nutcase in America.

We can't afford to repair our roads to a decent standard (or maybe this is intentional - Let our roads degrade so much that our new guests feel more "at home" with a pot-holed track?)

If things like these were sorted out first, and then we had a big pot of spare money left over - I'm sure a lot more people would more tolerant to the rate of influx.

Priorities and all that.

And for the last several decades - Consecutive Labour & Conservative Governments have done precious little to show that any of those things are a priority.

Yes, they've made lots of hot air about it, but both sides have actually done very little about any of it.

I don't care about manifestos from any party - That's just more hot air & advertising.

It's only once they're in power that we get to see what they're really like.

It's no different to online dating - A fancy profile, a snazzy photo... But it's not until you give them a chance that you find out whether they're any good or not.

I've given Labour & Conservative plenty of chances and they've been no good.

Maybe, just maybe, Reform is that "nerdy guy or girl" that everyone ignores, but when given the chance turns out to be a person's soulmate.

Or that could turn out to be the funniest joke in history - we just don't know yet.

So, to answer your question - What will Reform improve for me?

Well, if they take their voters concerns on board...

They'll save me a fortune in vehicle maintenance & repairs caused by our knackered road network.

They'll improve & build hospitals to cut the waiting lists at hospitals so that myself & my loved ones can get prompt treatment, so they are not in pain & discomfort for longer than necessary.

They'll improve hospital technology so that I could have had the "better, but more expensive" operation, not available in my local authority, then I'd have been less likely to suffer complications and require further treatment.

Stemming the flood of immigration would help give me a chance of getting on the property ladder so I can have a roof over my head & support myself into old age.

Too late for me & my family, but there are always teachers on MN saying that schools don't have enough glue-sticks to last the year - So maybe, with some of the money saved on not buying or repairing wheels & tyres - I could afford to donate some glue-sticks to schools!

"...they might just find themselves in government but utterly unqualified to govern, and everyone is going to suffer..."

Or they might find themselves in Government and everyone is going to benefit.

The truth is, neither of us knows.

But we've seen that Labour and Conservatives have repeatedly proven themselves unqualified to govern.

So letting someone else have a crack at it can't make it any worse - The country is already on its knees, so there isn't much left they could wreck.

From small acorns...

Farage is also benefitting from two weak opposition leaders. I won't count the insignificant Ed Davey.

and a VERY small minority for nefarious reasons, which is why it is essential that we DO take the time to thoroughly investigate and vett all who ask to stay here.

How can we investigate and vet people if we have no idea who they are or from whence they came?

Then there are those who are forced to follow orders from the gangs they pay to help them reach "safety".

Op why would gangs make migrants destroy their documents?

Farage has barely done a day's work in politics. He hasn't got a scooby how government functions. If it ever happens, it's going to be carnage.

By all means wear those rose-tinted spectacles. I have no idea who to vote for either, we are all fucked as far as I can see.

Exactly. Most of us don't WANT reform, I certainly don't, but unless the majority are heard then that's what we'll get. As a former leftie, I have nowhere to go either.

I'll use my vote but I would never, ever put it in the direction of Reform. Obviously. As a leftie.

He's been in politics longer than that kid who's currently running the health service has been alive.

Ditto Labour's last deputy PM.

Yes, but not actually doing any work! Look up his record in the EU Parliament. Understand that his constituents aren't getting a service from him. He is fantastic at photo ops but he doesn't actually know how to do the nuts and bolts of political work.

Quite simply to avoid being traced themselves.

So you admit they are hiding something.

We never see our Conservative MP unless there's an election on the horizon.

"... He is fantastic at photo ops but he doesn't actually know how to do the nuts and bolts of political work...."

Same as all the others then.

£35 billion - wasted on the Chagos Islands deal. That’s enough to make me want to vote Reform.

These threads always go the same way. And so many get posted about Reform it’s tiring.
Many on MN are seriously behind the curve still.

On page one of this thread we had the tired old ‘all Reform voters are idiots’ bullshit and then someone else saying ‘now now, don’t call them idiots, we need to educate them’ and I just despair.

Well obviously they're hiding something, trafficking people is illegal and they do'tt want to be traced. The people being trafficked aren't breaking the law, but the traffickers are.

Tbf outer local Tory MP was brilliant as local MP, although he's now lost his seat. No idea who replaced him. (Amd no, I'm not a Tory voter and he knew it, but he's fought for ME personally, in the House)

You're completely missing the point of thread. All ive asked is for people to explain what aspects of their life do they believe would improve under a Reform government. If anyone could actually answer that question, I'd take them seriously.