To be fuming DH left our 8yo to supervise the baby while he mowed the lawn??

[Erisheck]

So I popped to the shop earlier, only meant to be ten mins. Left DH at home with DCs.

Come back to find DH out the back mowing the lawn, all very pleased with himself. Meanwhile he had apparently told our 8yo DD to “keep an eye on” the baby while he did it. Baby is 16 months.

I walked in to find baby in the living room COVERED in biro scribbles. Face, arms, even a bit on her sleepsuit. DD said she was “playing schools” and DH thinks it is hilarious.

I do not. I am SO angry. Yes baby is fine but that is not the point. What if she had choked on a pen lid. What if she had fallen. An 8yo is a CHILD not a babysitter.

DH is saying I am overreacting and that it was “only 15 minutes.” I think he has lost his mind.

AIBU to be this furious?

I agree that he shouldn't have gone out mowing the lawn leaving the 8 year old in charge, but from your original post you said you 'popped to the shop earlier, only meant to be ten mins' so was the issue that he wanted to mow the lawn, you said you wouldn't be long but actually took a lot longer than you said and he therefore wanted to get going on the job he had already said he wanted to do?

I agree with previous posters that the 8 year olds behaviour is strange and I would want to know why they felt that was ok.
I agree that the shower is a similar situation, you say you have the door open and can hear, but what if the 8 year old closes another door or knows to be quiet - they could just as easily draw on their sibling during this time.. especially if the toddler thinks its a game and is funny. You might hear them laughing and think they are playing nice together but actually the 8 year old could be up to more mischief or encouraging the little one to do something naughty to get them in trouble.

What is the relationship usually like between the children?

Another mum blaming, child questioning post.

Did you read the social worker's post?
Yesterday 22.37

The problem with this thread is that the op only detailed her child is 8 and the comments have been based on that. But I teach 8 year olds (hundreds because I go from school to school specialist subject) and I don’t know a single one who would think drawing on a toddler is helpful. I would put that at development age of 4.

so I think going forward, you and your dh should make decisions only based on your own dd and how she’s developing, not on what is ‘normal’ for an 8yo.

what your thinking is a problem isnt the actual problem. an 8 year old should be able to keep an eye on the baby for 15 or so mins. drawing all over the baby, bit annoying but hey its a funny story to tell in a few years when there older.

And now you'll think twice - maybe three or four times? before you leave him to look after his children by himself.

Job done.

I think the big difference here OP, is that even when you leave the children unsupervised because you are in another room getting washed or doing chores, you are still very aware of them and what they are, or could be, doing. Your ears are always attuned to the noise they are or aren't making and you can instantly detect when, for example, a friendly game threatens to turn into a nasty spat. I think most mothers are like this and it's part of the never-ending background noise in our brains that goes along the lines of: "Buy birthday card and present on the way home for party on Saturday! Opticians appointment! Half term in three weeks - book holiday club! Bake fucking cake for school cake sale! Or should I buy one instead? Buy cake! Ring Mum back! New school trousers! Cancel Smear test and rebook! Car Insurance renewal! etc. etc. etc. All while we are also working, collecting children, making dinner and sorting out the washing.

Men, on the other hand, are perfectly capable of letting the 18 month old DD that they are supposed to be looking after, go into the kitchen and empty packets of flour and sugar all over the kitchen floor, play in it and wipe her floury sticky hands over every wall in the house, while they are engrossed in a game of Rugby on the TV! I really feel your pain and understand your anger.

I have 8 & 9 yos they are very capable of keeping an eye on their 2 younger brothers for a few minutes they know to shout/come get me if they need me and they definitely know better than to draw on their little brothers your dd is old enough to know better and it most definitely IS her fault so id be more concerned about that !

It's exactly the same ! You're happy to leave her supervising while you swan off to the shower which also isn't urgent and could easily wait until bedtime but your dh does it and you flip your lid ? Double standards much !!

Has anyone read the advice from the social worker?

You know, the professional from the organisation that you'd all insist needs to visit if this had ended badly, due to dad's neglect.

Yesterday 22.37

If posters haven't even read it or are ignoring it, then I'm even more concerned about the safety of everyone's DC...

Depends on the child I guess. My middle son was 8 when my youngest was born and he was very good with him, would sit holding him and reading to him etc. But my youngest is now 8 and sometimes does very silly things and I have to tell him off. He sometimes does stuff like a toddler would and can't tell me why just says sorry mum.

Social workers don't always think the same way for a start, anyone commenting on here could be a social worker who has agreed that OP is overreacting (and PP could be claiming anything because this is anon and there's no way to know)

There's a reason there isn't a legal age where children can be left alone. It's because it's down to parents to make decisions based on the child (although you're insistent that was can't blame the child, even though the child's behaviour is a concern)

Honestly, I don't see you having a shower as different if we are talking about similar time.

I don't understand people's comments. If everyone is "more concerned" about the 8 year old, why were they left in charge of a baby? They didn't change in a second, mum probably (rightfully) felt they weren't responsible enough to be unsupervised with a baby.

Also just because we all were left in charge of babies doesn't mean it was right then, or now. They are a child and if anything went wrong they would have to live with that for the rest of their life. I walked myself to school at 5, streets away, are you suggesting you would let your little ones do that too? No, you're not.

Parents are responsible for children's welfare, that includes 8 year olds.

I think it's fair to be open minded that I could be anybody, pretending to be a social worker. I respect your view and am not responding to challenge that. I also do not usually post on here however find it useful to develop my understanding of different perspectives in relation to parenting. I am also on leave right now so having a scroll and some extra time on my hands.

As many people have mentioned, all 8 year olds are different due to numerous factors, and of course parental judgement of their child will lead decision making in these situations which is why the law on leaving children at home alone is ambiguous. I mention the law regarding criminal responsibility as it provided some context regarding the expected legal age in which children can be held accountable for harming others which is 10 and over and this child was 8.

My point was, if you put personal views and experiences aside, regardless of parental judgement, if a serious accident happens to a child, in the UK, the responsibility will always fall on the adult who was supposed to be supervising the child and made the judgement that it was safe to leave them alone.

Here is a very useful quiz on the NSPCC website to help parents to determine if it's safe to leave a child alone if they feel unsure:

www.nspcc.org.uk/keeping-children-safe/in-the-home/home-alone/home-alone-quiz/?_ga=1.93651739.740386347.1433258561

A 16 month old child is at the prime age for having accidents as they explore the world, become steady on their feet and lack any understanding of danger awareness. This only lasts for a couple of years so as much as it is full on, it won't be forever.

I have worked with a number of great parents (similar age group of children who have sustained significant injuries) and have seriously regretted making similar decisions as mentioned in this post, not due to intentional neglect but a lack of consideration of the consequences. Lots of parents are not exposed to the variety of accidents that children of this age can experience unless it has happened to them, somebody that they know or work in a front line services.

If there is a main carer, who is looking after two children most of the time then they will work out a way of doing basic things like going to the toilet and having a quick shower whilst the children are in ear shot ect as part of the daily routine as that is a part of parenting, and accidents cannot always be avoided and are a part of life. However in this situation, if anything did happen to the child, would the Dad have heard the children over the noise of the lawn mower and would he be able to justify that the decision to leave them alone was necessary and proportionate if anything happened.

That will be my final message but I just wanted to share some insight that I thought may be helpful, and possibly save some avoidable accidents toward young children in the future based on my experiences in my role, and hindsight that parents in real situations wish that they had known sooner. You rarely hear about these situations in the media.

But I think that's the point most people are making

An 8 year old should know better than to draw all over their younger siblings. If this one didn't then there may be something that needs checking. And if there is something with them then they aren't able to be left alone with their siblings, even for Mum to shower

A 16 month old us a toddler, not a small baby

I don't understand the PPs saying it's no different to having a shower. OP made it clear they remain in earshot and keep DC in mind. DH was outside, wearing hearing protectors and operating a lawnmower. One is maintaining awareness and ready to respond, the other is negligent.

Therefore more likely to get into difficulties than a small baby who would probably just lie there.

They wouldn't SS are overstretched with actual abuse cases they wouldn't have time to entertain this. All that post does is feed into the ops paranoia. It's not helpful or realistic how does single parents cope with young children. It's neglect if you don't clean your house or wash your kids clothes. It's summer at the moment and lots of parents are hanging up their clothes to dry in the garden. If a parent has an overgrown garden that will be frowned upon, and people will assume you can't cope. Children deserve a clean home and tidy garden so they can play freely. SS will have a dim view if they see the opposite because it's neglect.

Being in the shower is NOT being in earshot unless the kids have to play in the bathroom

You can't say whether the dad had the kids in mind or not.

He may have been glancing up constantly to check the 8 year old hadn't come running out for example, been tuned in to every unexpected sound in case it was them...

Just the same as being in another room, behind a shower curtain/screen with loud water running around you

Your 16 month old could get in to all sorts of danger whilst you’re in the shower. It really is no different. YABU OP

carrots are orange

Not all carrots are orange

He didn't "leave" them, he was in the garden. I'd happily leave my 7 or my 9 yr old to play near/with a 16 mth old whilst I did some chores and id expect them to keep them safe and happy with no drama, theyd quite like the responsibility and theyd take it seriously - suspect the baby would be very over attended too tbh. I suspect either your 8 yr old isn't v responsible or wasn't given good enough instructions because it's obviously not worked. Kids are different though, my friends 9 yr old can't and isn't left with her baby because he's feral and she'd be worried about the safety of her baby. So I guess only you and dh know the situation here and I'd be looking at what's going on with an 8 yr old that is in this position where they can't be responsible for 15 mins. That's not typical of that age. Dh would know their personality though so I can see why you're annoyed, it's just that most people here will know average 8 yr olds would be fine .

I agree with @Lalalalalala1992 who is a social worker.

▪︎16 month olds need to be supervised by an adult.
▪︎Accidental injuries are always the responsibility of the adult.
▪︎He should have just waited for 15 minutes until OP came back.
▪︎The amount of blame placed on the 8 year old whose brain has not fully developed in relation to consequential thinking is really sad to hear from so many adults.
▪︎in summary, it's just not worth it.

And to the posters pushing the social worker's opinion to one side, they need to give their heads a good wobble.

Safety should be paramount when it comes to our kids. Not a competion between which parent was right and who can hear and who can't.