The school run has put me off other women

[SueSuddio]

I used to have a woman problem. In my 20s I mostly sought out male friendship & thought I had nothing in common with other women save for a couple of female friends.

When I got pregnant and had children, my head spun and I felt ashamed of myself with all my internalised mysogyny. I was lucky to make some lovely friends - I gravitate towards women now.

However, I was then introduced to the school run. Tons of women, tons of cliques. And I had a flashback to the bitchy girls at school, the bullies and even my friends who were nice one minute, nasty or ignoring me the next. I'm not getting bullied now, but I'm often getting ignored.

I still think I had internalised mysogyny when I was younger, but I also think it was completely supported by the female nastiness I encountered, echoes of which I see at the school gate.

Hoping it passes but can anyone relate?

This is why you don’t understand if there are any problems. You’ve never engaged with it.

No competition, drama, no falling's out or exclusion of others. Cliques exclude and do not welcome new people into their group.

Like all things I think it obviously depends on who your peers are and if you’re someone who likes big female groups or perhaps is more into one on one friendships. I prefer mixed sex groups as a whole. Plus there were some almighty falling outs between mum groups at my DD primary school. It was the only village school in a large village. I was pretty pleased not to be involved as I’d kept my distance somewhat and therefore avoided it.

I’m sure it can be a thing , but I haven’t experienced it. Mostly because I didn’t want or need to be in the various groups. Just said hi or smiled to anyone and everyone, picked up my kid and left. They returned that basic politeness, all good. Got closer with some simply because our kids were really good friends. Didn’t with some , especially past the age of drop off and run , because we didn’t actually click as people. All polite, nice and civil though.

One question though, why is everyone complaining about the school run mums always go for the clique/mean girls/popular mums/ cool group/big group? Why not go for the mum on her own/the working mum /the smaller group etc.?

I don't prefer men as friends, I have very close female friends, but I have always hated the school run. It is cliquey and can feel bullying and intimidating.

I've done a lot of school runs in my time - my 4 x dc's are ages 36 to13 - and I've generally hated the school run, and always liked being a working mum so I don't have to do it everyday. And now I don't have to do it at all!!

I don't particularly enjoy the company of other women.

What's wrong with that.

This!

My own experience is that yes there are groups of women on the school run that are friends. They might have been at nct together, they might have met at playgroups, they may know eachother from school themselves. That can make it feel like there are cliques and it can feel very exclusionary and lonely if you’re not part of it. I don’t think it’s nastiness usually though. People on mumsnet get very defensive about it. Probably because they’ve never been on the other side of the fence.

My standard response to this is, what have you done yourself to cultivate friendships? I organised 2 or 3 Mums nights out for the class when DS was young ( my menopausal self cannot believe I had the inclination).

Not everyone has to get on. I heaved a sigh of relief when DS became a teen as his friends tended to be in a more well off social set where the DMs tended not to work. Then he got into the rugby first team and I was thrown into proximity again. I understand that I am not part of that group of DMs generally ( I hate the word clique with a passion) but I am chatty in passing and say hello to everyone.

I am certainly not some alpha female, but I have never come across this deliberate snubbing that some people apparently have.

It is much easier to make female friends at hobby groups than the school gates

most people make their minds up about someone within the first few seconds - that’s just humans - and at the school gates it will be a once over of your attire and face and a quick question about something - any of these are wrong and you will never be invited to find out that you both love def leopard

at the hobby groups that first words will be about the hobby not your job and you will be wearing the right t shirt you can’t fail that test so easily

people who don’t experience difficulties will find this hard to understand

I don’t understand the school gate issue. We’ve recently moved so I don’t know anyone. But I don’t view it as bitchy cliques that are ignoring me. I view it as people who don’t know me chatting to their friends.

Thing is, people are going to gravitate towards people they have stuff in common with and who they are friends with. I will choose to talk to my friends at school drop-off, maybe that looks like a clique but it’s just 4-5 of us who are friendly outside of school choosing to spend 3 mins or whatever talking to each other. There are other pockets of mums who I assume are also friends outside of school and obviously will gravitate towards each other in the playground too.

So, there's a group of children in the playground, all in their established groups, perhaps they know each other from nursery. A new child tries to join in, but the children aren't being cliquey they're just sticking with the people they know. Is that OK?

Ironically, so many women on this thread have resorted to bitchiness in a bid prove there is no bitchiness.

Is this the ‘female nastiness’ you mean?

See.. well maybe…

You may have made your point better if you hadn’t sounded so dismissive.

What characteristic do all women share that you dislike?

Possibly the responders that are verging heavily towards "of course no women hate you, you bitch" and "if they're excluding you then you deserve it!!" might want to have a bit of a rethink.

This is very true

I have 3 kids at school, have done 11 years of school runs and have genuinely never seen this ‘clique’ thing you describe.

I am always baffled by how much headspace people give the school run. It's nothing to do with your real life. Just get your kids and go.
It's like all walks of life, some people are nice, some people are less so.

It makes you feel this way towards women because it's predominantly women but if there was more of an even split a lot of the men wod be dickheads as well and some would be nice.

It’s pretty funny, isn’t it. Also adding the illuminating ‘it’s a you problem!’ 😆

@SomeOfTheTrouble I never mentioned anything about anything all women share.

That’s great!

😆

Copied form the OP:

'I was lucky to make some lovely friends - I gravitate towards women now.'

'I was then introduced to the school run. I had a flashback to the bitchy girls at school, the bullies and even my friends who were nice one minute, nasty or ignoring me the next. I'm not getting bullied now, but I'm often getting ignored.'

The OP's bad experiences at school are not her fault.