What do you think of this ultimatum from Fiance?

[Pladi]

Fiancé and I met in our mid 20s in London. He is Norwegian. I have always been completely upfront that I would never even contemplate living in Norway. Not even Oslo. I must have made this clear from around the 2nd month of dating. Fiancé accepted that as he hated growing up in a fairly small town anyway.

Since becoming engaged fiancé has requested that we live in Oslo for a year after we marry. Just as an experience. I have said absolutely bloody not. There’s a long list of reasons why I wouldn’t consider this. Fiancé is “confused” as I did spend 18 months in Seattle for work. But Seattle (where I speak the language and am somewhat familiar with the culture) is a very different proposition to Oslo.

Im not happy that he’s changing the goal posts despite the fact I have never been anything but brutally transparent.

Ideally we would live in London for a couple more years then make the move to the burbs.

I’m not being unreasonable, am I?

Yes, I think it's a pity the OP even told anyone it was Oslo. I do honestly worry about the comprehension skills and ability for rational thought of many people having spent some time on mumsnet, it seems they cannot get past their own feelings that they would personally luuurve Oslo. She'd have been better saying "I am not going to mention his home country and it's not relevant to the question so don't ask".

Saying that, there would still have been pickmes telling her she should just stand by her man and uproot her entire life and do what he wants, despite having been absolutely upfront with him from the start.

I also keep focusing on the fact that he's pretending to be "confused" and pretending he thinks she is unreasonable for sticking to the decision they made 6 years ago. This is coercive behaviour and quite unpleasant, and while I can understand him getting homesick and changing his mind, I don't like that he resorts to these sorts of tactics to try to get his way.

Sadly, I think the relationship is over.

Saying that in order for a marriage to work both sides need to make sacrifices for the happiness of the other is not being a pickme.

Lecturing a woman for not wanting to move countries to appease, please and keep a man when she has made it abundantly clear for six years that she would never move countries is indeed being a pickme. Endlessly wittering on about how great the country is in an attempt to over ride the woman's crystal clear choice to stay where she always said she will stay is being a pickme.

She didn't ask, at any point, if she SHOULD move. She stated she will not be moving. That's not the discussion. Trying to persuade her to make it a discussion to appease, please and keep a man is indeed being a pickme.

The only discussion is is she unreasonable to stick with what they have already discussed repeatedly and she made clear six years ago? The unequivocal answer is no, she is not unreasonable at all.

However, as I have repeatedly said, he is not unreasonable to change his mind but he is certainly unreasonable to feign confusion and pretend he thinks she is unreasonable.

She's not moving. He may well chose to. Neither stance is unreasonable. And never the twain shall meet.

Lecturing a woman for not wanting to move countries to appease, please and keep a man when she has made it abundantly clear for six years that she would never move countries is indeed being a pickme. Endlessly wittering on about how great the country is in an attempt to over ride the woman's crystal clear choice to stay where she always said she will stay is being a pickme.

She didn't ask, at any point, if she SHOULD move. She stated she will not be moving. That's not the discussion. Trying to persuade her to make it a discussion to appease, please and keep a man is indeed being a pickme.

The only discussion is is she unreasonable to stick with what they have already discussed repeatedly and she made clear six years ago? The unequivocal answer is no, she is not unreasonable at all.

However, as I have repeatedly said, he is not unreasonable to change his mind but he is certainly unreasonable to feign confusion and pretend he thinks she is unreasonable.

She's not moving. He may well chose to. Neither stance is unreasonable. And never the twain shall meet.

It's not me double posting, there's something up with the site.

I wasn't thinking it had anything to do with being a foreigner. It has more to do with the difficulty of turning your back on your roots, whomever or wherever that might entail.

Someone once told me that the longer he was away (from home), the stronger the elastic band was that drew him back.

Don't move a bloody inch OP. I say that as someone who married a foreigner, and I would say it to any woman in this position. If you have kids you will most likely pick up more childcare and domestic work than your partner- that's what happens to most people - and your career will stand or fall based on whether the job market is a good one for you and whether you have support and emergency childcare on hand. That is enough of a burden to take on - he can take the burden of living in a foreign country, since one of you has to. I also agree it's nothing like going to Seattle. Learning a language to the point where you can use it in everyday life is a huge committmrnt - fine if you were looking for an all consuming hobby for the next 5 years, but otherwise no. (And none of these buggers like your fiance or my husband actually had to do that, as they learned English in school already.)

He probably wants to do it after marriage because you could get a spouse visa. Otherwise you'd probably need a work visa with a job and sponsor to stay for a year which I'd probably more problematic.

If you don't want to do it then don't, just say goodbye now.

She's not doing it. That's not, in any way, the discussion. She simply asked if she was being unreasonable for doing exactly what she said she would always do and which he agreed to. And the answer is no, she is not being unreasonable.

And he is allowed to change his mind and move, that is not unreasonable. But what is unreasonable is him faking confusion and telling her she is unreasonable for making the exact choice she promised to make and has never wavered on.

Totally off topic but that is a really good example of a core belief that was instilled as a result of one (possibly repeated) sentiment that you believed. I wonder how you current dilemma would be different if you'd been told the opposite.

I notice lots of replies from presumably women jumping to suggest you compromise. Compromise is what probably needs to happen to anyone once they have children and in IMHO is by women’s lines are so impacted by having children. You have a choice now, before you have any children in the picture, to say you are not compatible.

why go to Norway to try living there if you already know you don’t want to leave your friends and family where you are now. If would change your position from your currently clear and consistent messsge to on the basic of one year you don’t want to stay. Otherwise why bother with a trial if you already know the outcome.

best case, he just transfers to you the problem he now is facing of having a family far away from his own family.

be glad you found out before you married, stick to your guns, you are not compatible.

Which I'd why I said she should say goodbye now and end the relationship. Let's face it she has her life planned out and he's not a major part of it. Couple of years more in London then out to the suburbs with her life based on family and friends not him.

What would happen if you went along with his new demand, moved to Oslo "for a year", still hated it, and got pregnant?

Probably the same as if they had a child and moved to the suburbs and he hated living there.

What I'm asking is if she would be stuck there if she got pregnant, had the baby there, and dad being a Norwegian citizen.

She doesn't know the language. She feels claustrophobic there. Finding work could be problematic so she would become dependent. But would she be able to move back to the UK if she had a baby there if the father didn't want her to.

Her fiance wouldn't have the same problems in the UK because he speaks the language and has a job.

I personally like the Nordic countries and speak a bit of Danish, so I would have been learning Norsk from the start and would go. But I'm not OP.

I studied German, French and Italian at uni and spent 6 months working in Switzerland and I cannot speak any of these languages. It's a long time ago now but I never could - I could decode them, written down, which was what you had to do in those days. But I cannot converse in them. I simply can't understand what people are saying.

Imo not everyone can learn languages. I was highly motivated and so upset to find out I just couldnt do it.

I am one saying compromise (because he's already compromising on his whole life).

It's fine to break up. That's an option but not what OP was asking for.

What's not fine is to say, "I want to marry you but I refuse to spend one year in your country, with your family, learning your language and culture."

My parents married across cultures (married 54 years). I married across cultures (married 22 years). There are lots of compromises needed. You need to get good at it. You probably also need to be quite flexible because of the nature of a marriage like this. One year of your life abroad, without kids, is not that major in a long marriage.

Thank you for this, I got as far as how lovely the bakeries were in Norway and I wanted to scream it's not the fecking point Sandra.

Posters on this site generally are all for women having clear boundaries, not being coerced by partners, friends and family but fantasies about clean air, good schools , lifestyle vikings and everyone crashes out .

I agree with this.

I actually think this should have been pushed to OP by her friends/family 6 years ago.

Cross-cultural marriages inherently have more challenges than an equivalent same-culture one. They might still be rewarding, or worth it for love, etc etc but there is just inherently a lot more effort you need to put in, which becomes easier over time but it lasts for your whole life: each new phase presents challenges as you realise the realities of how the other culture prioritises childrearing, or having dual careers, or taking care of the elderly. (My parents have a cross-cultural marriage.)

If you spend time immersed in the other culture early on you will go in with your eyes a bit more open: not just about what the cultural differences are (this is almost trivial, you can google it), but about how you yourself will actually feel when confronted with those differences day in and day out, and how you and your partner will react to those challenges.

He’s not compromising at all on anything! Why do people keep making that up?

He lived in England through choice. He has wanted to live in England for 100% of the time he has lived in England. He now wants to spend one year in Norway and then return to England. He’s demanding that exact thing happen. What is he compromising on?

Immigrants are not “compromising” by choosing to live in another country when they want to live in that country.

If I lived in England but want to spend 1 week of the year in France on holiday - am I “compromising” by not moving to France? No. Because I don’t want to move to France. He wants one year in Norway (apparently) and is demanding one year in Norway. That is not a compromise.

I doubt she's coming back so this is all hot air.

My view is she has her life mapped out and he isn't really part of it. It's London then the suburbs, her family and friends then perhaps him. That's fine and you can't argue with it. She needs to find someone who'll fit in with her plans. She may be better on her own as she'd be stuck if she married someone, moved to the suburbs and found her friends moving elsewhere.

the thing is, you could spend a year out there and then your dh doesn’t want to come back and you’ve wasted another year with him when you aren’t compatible

Neither of you bu, you just want different things

How do you know he wants to stay here forever? Clearly not if he's asking for one year back home. You are being deliberately obtuse some reason. Just because you travel to another country and live there for a bit and like it, doesn't mean in your ideal world that you would stay there for the rest of your life.

I imagine he came here for a while, fell in love with OP and when she said she wasn't going to move to Norway, he decided to stay in the UK with her. But in the (6 years) meantime he misses his country and would like a chance to show her his home and be there for a last goodbye (maybe secretly hoping she'll like it enough to stay but willing to sacrifice if not). He's asked for a year so i think it's safe to say he misses Norway and is sacrificing his desires in order to stay with OP in the UK for the long term. If that's not a compromise, I don't know what is.

The options are:

1. He wants to live permanently in the UK and have one year and one year only in Norway.
2. He’s lying to OP and wants to live in Norway permanently but is trying to trick her into going to Norway temporarily and then trap her there.
3. OP has lied about the entire premise of the thread.

As you’re absolutely desperate to make him a sweet little victim, pick whichever you like. There are no other options.