To not help my friend- passport fraud

[Ravenblue]

My friend and me are quite close. Two years ago she wanted a new baby and found a sperm donor on a website. This bloke got her pregnant but then he wanted access. She didn't want him to but the courts gave him access and now he has the kid a couple of times a month. My friend is now married and she changed her kids name to her new husbands name. The father has found out and is now going back to the courts. She also got a passport in the new name and the father nows this. The father is now going to the police as he says its passport fraud. I dont believe him as she has the right to change her childs name but it says not in the court order. Its like she cant do anything without his permission. Its not fair on her.
She wants my help in trying to get her out of this but I dont know how and also I don't think shes in the wrong.

AIBU?

I suspect you and your friend are stupid. If your friend didn’t make the appropriate legal arrangements beforehand then of course he has legal parental responsibility also and has the right to a 50:50 say. She has been stupid and created the whole situation for herself and now she is dragging you into it. If you have any sense you will stay well clear.

Why would anyone use a sperm donor from a random website rather than through a fully vetted medical clinic. Sounds like she didn't want him involved at all so why do something seedy like this where there was no protection for her? I also saw a Facebook page for this kind of thing too. All very odd tbh.

And this is why it's so important to go down the proper path if using a sperm donor... there are so many dodgy websites out there.

I sympathised with her for wanting another child but I didn't agree with her methods. I first thought it was a legit clinic but she told me she met through a website and they'd have sex until she was pregnant. There are contracts that you can download but their not legal. The dad was not on the birth certificate to begin with but he took her to court to be on it and after the dna test he was put on it.
I know that she got married and changed her and the kids name (all of them) she then got a passport in the new name. The kids name was her maiden name. The dad has not signed over parental rights and has not given permission for the name change.
I don't actually have a valid passport and she didnt have access to it so I'm in the clear there.
I think unfair was the wrong use. She's made really stupid mistakes and keeps making them. She runs into a lot of trouble and all her children are known to social services. She's called me since and ive blocked her number. It's not the bravest thing to do but I've enough going on without her crap. After she told me about the car accident and the police caution ive been trying to pull away anyway. I knew she had a passport but I thought she'd sorted it with the dad. I wouldn't have thought her stupid enough to break the law again. I get that she wants to play happy family's with the husband but it's chaos that I want out of.

She does make bad decisions and has told me she lost friends due to a joke she tried to play on the father

A joke? She got her friend to tell her child's dad that their son (and her) died in a car crash. How is that a joke?

This woman sounds absolutely horrendous and I'm not surprised social services are involved.

It's crappy what he done if the original agreement was sperm donation only, however if he has parental responsibility, on the birth certificate, has access etc, she can't just change the kids name without his approval.

She sounds utterly unhinged!! That poor baby being treated like a commodity to play with :(

The best help anyone can give her is pointing her at a lawyer with expertise in donor conception who can help her unpick the mess. If she can't afford it then there are crowd funding platforms specifically for legal work.

Donor Conception Network are a good place for resources on talking to children about being donor conceived.

How on earth does a sperm donor get parental rights in the first place? You’re not required to name them on the birth certificate. Seems there must be more to the story.

They slept together several times before and after pregnancy
He was not an anonymous sperm donor.
He went to court to get put on the birth certificate as the father and has parental responsibility

From what is described here it sounds more like the father shoukd get legal advice and take full custody of the child. This woman is not well and sounds like an irresponsible, immature and utterly selfish creature who just wants babies and gives no shit about the wellbeing of the child and how her action impacts how the child develops. it sounds like the father really cares and is very possibly worried to leave his child full time with this woman. Poor children, every day there is at least one post about women who want babies but don't give a minute thought of what the child needs.

She needs to get proper legal advice. You need to stay out - all you can do is advise her to get proper legal advice. If you try and help her do something illegal (even unknowingly) you could be landed in trouble. If he is someone she just got pregnant by then he has full parental rights the same as her. If she used a proper sperm donor clinic then they will advise. It sounds like he has full parental rights. The law decides and the court decides and you need to stay out or risk being found in contempt of court if you try and stop court processes (not that you suggested this). Your friend needs to use proper legal channels and find a solicitor or self represent in court. But she wont stand a chance arguing she had a right to change his name because she did not if the dad had parental rights. Yes it does seem unfair that once you have a child with someone that they get to control what you do with that child until the age of 16.... but thats the way it is. The sooner your friend realises this the better. The court looks at all decisions from the perspective of the needs of the child not the wants of the parents. So for example - the chid has a right to a relationship with their biological dad. The child has a right to retain their biological dads name - the list goes on. Its just the way it is.

If you don't have a passport, there's no need for the thread at all, as you can't sign it - 'I don't have a valid passport and you need one to sign it'.

Sorted.

I think he was a "sperm donor" in the respect that they had a casual relationship, she got pregnant, and she wanted a relationship and he didn't. So now it fits her narrative for him to be a sperm donor rather than a guy who wants contact with his child.

I think she’s winding you up

I don’t think the police will be getting involved in ‘passport fraud’ that’s a passport office problem.

I’m not sure why the dad is bothered about the name change as it’s not his name that’s been usurped

While lying about being dead was vile, I am not actually sure what crime it is that would be sanctioned by a caution

Law must have changed.. l changed my daughters surname when l left her Dad.. solicitor did it.. said it was legal because we wasn't married.. so she was illegitimate and only l had parental responsibility.

Ah ok, apologies. Did not see her clarification.
I mean I don't agree with what she has done. No man should be cut out, especially if he wants to be involved. But of a aubergine move by her mate imo.

that contract means nothing and sorry she not a good person

No worries and totally agree with you - she's behaved like a total plum.

Before she changed the child's name all she had to do was do a bit of research. She would have found out she needs he's permission, unless she got permission from the court. She has committed fraud and will be made to child the child's name back. I'm not sure what the police will do. 🤷

But what was she thinking getting a sperm donor like that? She should have slwent to a proper clinic. She father could have children everywhere or be riddled with all sorts. I always wonder what type of men sign up to be a sperm donor like that.

Keep away from this woman she will only cause problems, l feel very sorry for the poor kid she doesn't like the father but she liked him enough to have repeated sex with him, now she throws away what he gives to his child, not much of a mother perhaps the court should give custody to the father

Read the update... It was not a sperm donor at all! They had sex until she got pregnant and after too! And then she wanted to stay in the relationship! So this definitely doesn't classify as a donor.

So, your friend found a sperm donor on a website and it all went wrong. What a shocker. Not very smart is she, or to put another way: she’s stupid.

That’s why they have clinics for this sort of thing. Yes, they’re more expensive, but they know what your doing and you get all the legal protections. She should at least be thankful the donor wasn’t HIV+ or something.

And under the law he has parental responsibility for the child, and no she can’t arbitrarily change the name on the child’s passport. She also can’t take them abroad without the father’s permission. That’s how parental responsibility works, which she would know if she had a brain.

the law has not changed. And your solicitor is completely wrong. You have broken the law.

Are you seriously dumb enough think that just because parents aren’t married the father has no parental responsibility?

I mean that would mean fathers have no parental responsibility for over half the children born in the country (a majority are born to unmarried mothers). Would save them a lot of money in child maintenance!

Actually the law has changed. It used to be if you were unmarried then the father did not automatically have parental responsibility even if he was named on the birth certificate. If the parents were amicable then they could both sign and get witnessed a Parental Responsibility Agreement which then got registered officially. Or if the mother refused, the father could apply to court for a Parental Responsibility Order.

Certainly this was the case 20-odd years ago but the law did subsequently change so that unmarried fathers got PR by being named on the birth certificate.