Do people still judge single mothers?

[purpledaze24]

Not sure what my AIBU is exactly but I’m interested to hear whether people think single mothers are still judged negatively in society. Growing up in the 90s there was always that disgusting attitude of it always being seen as the fault of the single mother for ending up in that situation, they were irresponsible, they were slags etc etc, couldn’t possibly ever be the fault of the man. Obviously we’ve moved on a bit but do you think that attitude still lingers a bit? Or has it gone completely? I’m a single mother and I recently got turned down on a house rental. When I told my dad about this he said “maybe it’s because you’re a single mother”. He’s a boomer and has some pretty outdated views but it shocked (and kinda hurt) me that he could think that would be a reason. My finances (which I proved to the house owners) are very good and I could more than afford the house. It would never occur to me that that’d be a reason. AIBU? Or have the stereotypes/judgement disappeared?

Not really, most of the single mothers I know were married and now divorced. There is one I sort of do as she’s on baby 4 with father 3 and that relationship is about to end too from the looks of things. Every conversation starts with ‘ as a single mum’ or ‘because I’m on my own with 4 kids’ etc and about how hard it is and own difficult father 1 or 2 are being so it’s tricky not to think she should get her shit together and stop having more kids….

Yes, and men who slagged off former girlfriends too - another red flag in my book.

That’s understandable but the difference is that’s a behaviour that the man is choosing to display (and says a lot about what kind of person he is). Having divorced parents is a circumstance that was not in his control (and unless you’re in your 80s, a circumstance in which about 50% of people would have come from). Parents divorcing in childhood doesn’t automatically mean the child is going to grow up emotionally damaged/unable to have a successful relationship themselves! Everyone’s childhood is unique. What a ridiculous thing to discriminate against someone for. Each to their own I guess!

Well, as I explained in a previous post, the reasons for a historical divorce aren't visible to outsiders, so it's a leap of faith to assume there is no damage - that's my instinctive inner risk assessment kicking in. We all have different attitudes to risk. I'm naturally cautious so would lean towards thinking one or both parents had flaws, with a high risk of inheritance through nature or nurture.

I've never been in a situation where I've met the perfect boy/man and later found out that his parents are divorced. I have been in situations where boys/men have slagged off their mum or their dad or their upbringing or their previous girlfriend pretty early on in the conversation, and in my book they are the ones to avoid. Anyone who can slag off their own parents to a virtual stranger wears their damage on their sleeve.

So people who grew up with parents who stayed together all have flawless parents? And those parents were all happy in their marriages? What about people who grew up with parents who stayed married but where, say, the dad was abusive and the mum was an alcoholic. Would you pick a man from those circumstances over a man whose parents amicably divorced and successfully co-parented him? Can’t you see how flawed your logic is? You’re applying a blanket rule of assuming all divorce = damaged children who hate their parents and all parents who stay together = stable children who love and respect their parents. It just doesn’t work like that. Domestic violence, neglect, physical, emotional, and sexual abuse exists in childhoods where parents stay married just as much as it does in childhoods where parents divorce. Wouldn’t it make more sense and be more accurate to say you don’t want to date men who slag off their parents or whose parents treated them badly, without making such generalised assumptions about them based on circumstances that differ wildly from person to person?

I’m curious as to whether you found Mr ‘perfect’ who had the perfect childhood with these flawless parents and was/is he himself a flawless husband and father?

@playdoughed Also, anyone who moans about how shitty mummy and daddy were to a virtual stranger is a walking red flag, it’s got nothing to do with whether they are the product of divorce or not! The most stable, kindest, respectful men I’ve met are ones who were raised by single mums. IME they are strong and independent, having been inspired by the strength and independence of their mums. They also have nothing but lovely things to say about their mothers and a huge amount of respect for women in general. I’d choose a man like that any day, over a man raised by married parents with a domineering father who taught him boys aren’t allowed to show weakness and that he is in some way superior because he was born with a penis. Those are inherited & nurtured traits I’d run a mile from

That's a very defensive comeback, understandably. However, I said nothing about blanket rules. I described it as a "risk assesment".

I did find someone who I'm very happy with and we've been together for about 29 years. Neither of us are perfect, and our parents weren't perfect either, but we are loyal to our parents and loyal to each other, and we work through any difficulties with emotional intelligence. That's not rare - the majority of marriages don't end up in divorce.

According to the Office for National Statistics, from the 2021 census:

• c59% of marriages that began in 1996 were still intact by their 25th year.
• c83% of marriages that began 2013 were still intact by their 10th year

Overall, the marriage rate decreased in that period though by over 10% which tells you that fewer people are getting married. The marriage rate has continued to decline since 2013. One might speculate, although I don’t have time to look this up, that fewer people want to follow the example of their parents in getting married because their parents’ marriages have not been such a shining example of emotional intelligence and loyalty as yours. it’s not rocket science to realise that people have a range of life experiences.

I suspect if you don't claim benefits and are a single mother and you are fine. Claim benefits and you are a pariah.

@NotEnoughKnittingTime Nobody knows each other's personal financial details though. People just make assumptions. I live in an ex council house (that I own) and have a professional job that's fully remote with flexible hours (so I'm always there on the school runs, no wrap around needed). People probably think I'm jobless, in social housing and on UC.

Yes it has dropped, but the childbirth rate has also dropped significantly over the same period.

People do tend to get married or form a civil partnership when having children because of the financial protection it gives them.

We all have different experiences. The men and child I know who had single mums raise them are no more respectful then the average bloke. Most had totally wild teen years with police involvement.
There is a single mum on the road I live on, she has two boys and they are an absolute nightmare, the mum openly admits she cant control them and they speak to her like shit on their shoes.
Most single mums dont stay single through the whole of their kids childhood either, they introduce new men to their kids or step brother and sisters. You only have to glance on here to see how shit that turns out for everyone involved.

My ex was raised by a single mum and he doesn't bother with our kids so ime it makes no difference

Some women still judge but I have found they often are less streetwise and quite traditional types and old fashioned. Not in touch with the real world. It is more the older generations tend to judge. Also those who have led a very sheltered life can pass comment.

Some people wrongly assume we have done this to achieve a council home too. Whereas I own my own home.

I was never abandoned by my ex but he became violent so he had to leave. He has always seen ds and paid modest maintenance until he was 18. We have always been civil.

Ds has never been in trouble with the police in reference to one poster above who knew women whose children had been and I have always been self employed working from home and ds has never been a 'latch key kid'.

Mainly the moneyed neigbourhoods can judge.

A fair few pity instead though. Single parents cannot really win.

FFS. Could you puruse the stereotypes any further?!

Plenty - and I would hazard a guess most - single mums bring up their children without police involvement, where their children achieve their academic potential and attend 6th form and then university. 2 out of 3 of mine are in/went to university and I've been single for 16 years with minimal involvement from their dad. The other is doing a trade apprenticeship and will out earn the rest of us, I suspect, within about 5 years. Most of us raise children who are polite, decent human beings with good values. Indeed, when they have seen their mother struggle, they have a good understanding of the value of money and what is needed to survive. I've worked full time for most of those 16 years, with seasonal and ad-hoc work on the side. Their father hasn't paid a penny. They all have a good work ethic, having worked since they were 16.

As for most single mums not staying single. Well, in my circles, those of who are single have remained that way. I'm no nun, but I have managed to separate my children's lives from my own emotional wants and needs. They haven't had men around at all - in fact, a recent dinner when a male colleague of mine came over to discuss some work stuff, my eldest's hackles were raised to such an extent that I feel I perhaps did the wrong thing. He is now struggling to accept that now they are no longer children, I will be pursuing my own life. He gets it on an intellectual level but admits he doesn't really like it.

If you pursue the single mum stereotype, sure, there'll be plenty of people who fulfill it. Don't forget many of us don't. And also don't forget that plenty of children in together families struggle, go off the rails, are rude, are involved with the police and don't reach their academic potentials. Why aren't you talking about them in such negative terms?

I guess I was single mothering wrong then. Mine has never been in trouble with the police, never had any issues with her during her teenage years and she now holds a Masters Degree....oh and DP didn't move in until after DD had left for uni, that was 15 years ago and in 6 weeks he is walking her down the aisle at her wedding.

No but I judge absent non contributing parents

Well done for proving that the judgement still exists

There’s still IMO a stigma associated with the single mother who can’t even begin to support one child, but who goes on regardless to have more, and expects to be supported by the taxpayer.