AIBU to think that 'patriarchy chicken' isn't the whole story?

[AliceMaforethought]

Hear me out, as I reckon that this will be an unpopular opinion, but I am keen to know if my experience is just me or if others experience the same.

I hear a lot on this site about 'patriarchy chicken': simply put, the admirable notion that women deserve to take up space and not have to stand aside for men. Last week, I was in London, (I'm from a smaller UK city) I was STAGGERED by the utter lack of spatial awareness of women. I am a woman, for context: youngish (I'm 42 but look a lot younger) I found women knocked into me constantly and let their kids blunder into me and other people. I didn't have a problem with men at all. The other thing that I did notice was that all these women were white, and were all ages from young to late middle age (old women weren't an issue at all) I am mixed race. Before anyone thinks that I was the problem and was just out of my depth in London, that isn't the case. I am a trained dancer, I have a lot of spatial awareness, and I am used to London even though I haven't lived there for a while. I am starting to wonder if I need to play 'white supremacy chicken'!

So do you go on threads which complain about men, and tell the women on there that they must be making it up?

Not an iota of self-awareness!

To paraphrase Reni Eddo-Lodge, this is why I don't talk to white people about race any more. Waste of my time.

It’s just the hustle and bustle of busy London streets. Try not to read anything into it

She literally said in her op that all the people barging into her were white women and that it's always white women who do it. From your post I can see you're one of those who thinks that racism against whites doesn't exist. Saying that all middle class white women have got entitled attitudes because of their race privilege is a fucking joke

Haven't seen it myself but I can believe it happens.

Racism against whites doesn't exist.

Please learn to comprehend the difference between "all the women who barged into me were white" and "all white women barge into people". FFS.

Racism against whites doesn't exist but I don't think we're at the level to be having that discussion.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 doesn’t it?

Were they on their phones? I watched one woman get off the bus recently, completely engrossed in her phone. She was on a direct collision course with me, but in between us both was a lamppost. I can safely say that she would not have moved out of my way, as she walked straight into the lamppost. These people engrossed in their phones seem to expect even inanimate objects to move for them!

This. It’s just the way London is

Depends what they say and how many others have experienced the same thing.

I don't use Karen either but I'm more than OK with the original meaning of the term. It's hilarious that MN gets in a froth on it because I've never seen that original meaning encapsulated any better than the weekly "shall I REPORT these WORKMEN for BREATHING" threads on here.

No, it doesn't. Xenophobia can do, in that white privilege doesn't fully protect people from dislike of foreigners, but racism does not. Also white people can be victims of anti semitism, but that is not because of their whiteness but in spite of it.

YABVU for

1. using capitals for “STAGGERED”

2. thinking 42 is “youngish”

3. assuming as an ex dancing you have superior spatial awareness

4. making the bold and unfounded claim that it’s only white woman who walk around bumping into everybody.

What a nutty post.

So, do you think that 'patriarchy chicken' is a thing or not? Or is it impossible, because after all women are 51% of the population, so how could they be discriminated against, right? I mean the men must spend all day bashing into them. According to your logic, that is.

Racism (and misogyny and homophobia and transphobia) are reflections of societal power structures. They have the power they do because the racist, the sexist and the homophobe are backed up by a larger dynamic formed by centuries of history.

A "misandrist" or an LGBT person being snarky about the heteros or a POC making a joke about the yts might be being a dick but it does not have the weight of racism, misogyny or homophobia.

42 is youngish. And as I said, I look about ten years younger than my age, sometimes more.
I do have amazing spatial awareness, and being a dancer absolutely helps with that. I'm not sure why you find that hard to believe or understand.
I didn't say 'only white women go around bumping into everyone'.

Anyway @AliceMaforethought this thread has gone exactly how these threads ALWAYS go on MN and I would advise both of us to waste no further time on it.

You're right. What I find especially galling, though, is the way that these same women will moan all day long about men. They understand societal oppression just fine when they are on the receiving end. I bet a lot of them would claim that misandry doesn't exist, either.

@AliceMaforethought you are clearly wasting your breath on some people on here who, rather than being interested and informed by others’ lived experience, want to cling onto their insular view from their own limited experience.

As I said, as a white woman I haven’t experienced this aspect of chicken. But having lived on the planet for 58 years, I realise that my experience isn’t the only experience there is.

People all over the U.K., not just London, are getting worse at spatial awareness and general conscientiousness of people around them. It’s staggering how many people walk around staring at their phones / chatting to friends and totally ignoring others on busy streets.

Totally agree that patriarchy chicken is likely not the whole story, and there is a racial element going on too. Hopefully this will be studied at some point to validate your perception.

I mean where in London? I live here and go all over and have truly never seen this - am also mixed race. Though I do see people on their phones or lost in music...maybe that. But are you saying they barge into you but cede ground to white people,,?

I think some people are just rude, but most are not. I think that's true of men and women and people of all skin colours.

Discrimination exists in this country, direct and indirect and it's important to acknowledge it where it exists but London is one of the most diverse cities in the world. It sounds a bit wild to think white woman or wondering around London bashing into people of colour as some kind of strange power play. Perhaps you were just unlucky?