To think the cafe staff should have given the money to this homeless man?

[Eastie77Returns]

I went to a cafe earlier today. There was a man outside who regularly sits with a sign stating he is homeless and asking for money. At one point a man came in, handed a member of the cafe staff a £20 note and left. It turned out he had given the staff this money to buy a meal for the homeless man who subsequently came into the cafe and ordered some food and drink. It was clearly a regular occurrence as the staff member automatically knew to charge the bill to the £20. When she had rung everything up she handed the man his meal and he asked for his change. She refused and said “No, the money is only to be used for food here. You know this. If you want to use any of the change you can order something else tomorrow”

The homeless man became angry and shouted that he wanted his money. The whole episode escalated and he began banging a table. A male member of staff eventually escorted/pushed him outside.

AIBU to think the cafe should have just given him the money??

If the guy who gave the money wanted the homeless man to have it direct he would have just given it to him. The cafe did nothing wrong here.

But the cafe clearly has some history with him, which you don't. You can't just step into a situation a judge it based on the 30 second interaction you saw. If you feel he needed autonomy in his spending based on what you saw, maybe you should have given him some money?

Even homeless charities say you shouldn't give homeless people cash.

BoredZelda

I auppose the bottom line is that people will support in one of a variety of ways and will chose what feels right akd comfortable to them.

And that is their right to do so - it's their money.

Some will give money in the assumption it will buy a few days of essentials from Lidl but not caring too much.

Some will want to provide a meal.

Some will want to give cash.

It sounds like I'm contradicting what I've just said about humanity and individuality but the dynamic is never going to feel fair and equal because it is inherently unequal when one person needs and another person gives.

But, ultimately, everyone will have their own boundaries, reasons and motivations and I think those can be very personal decisions.

As long as people are offering help and support, I don't think the exact nature of it should be criticised too harshly.

Interesting because most homeless charities actively discourage giving money...

If the person who bought in the £20 wanted him to be able to use it anywhere he would have given it directly to the homeless man , they were quite correct and presumably he could come in and have the change in drinks / food at another time .

I wasn't 'his' change. The money wasn't the gift to him. The meal was. The change belongs to the man who paid the £20 and he wants it kept on tab so the homeless man can eat another day, not stick it up his veins or whatever.

OP how much did you give him? You still haven't said...

It was the donors money to do with as he wished. And he wished for the homeless man to have food and drink from that cafe. Very kind of him, and probably someone he knows, and the cafe staff know the situation, and what he was most likely to spend it on. The donor DID NOT want to contribute to drink and/or drugs and wanted to be certain of that. This is why it’s literally advised not to give homeless people money directly. Sure, there are some who won’t spend it on drink/drugs, but unfortunately the majority will.

Did you consider that you could have given him the £7 if you felt so strongly?

The original donor gave it to the cafe for a specific purpose. How did the homeless man even know there were left-over funds? He would have been better to have quietly eaten his fill without disturbing fellow diners and certainly without being abusive to the staff. As the member of staff reminded him, “the money is only to be used for food here. You know this. If you want to use any of the change you can order something else tomorrow”. He was not going to lose out.

Any charity, organisation or person who works with the homeless will tell you not to give homeless people money directly. If someone is homeless, their best chance of getting out of that situation is by engaging with local services and charities. Regardless of whether they are addicted to something or not. Charities can provide essentials and practical support and shelters can provide beds, but homeless people often have nowhere to go for most of the day. So this man paying for the homeless man to go in the cafe and have lunch means that he has a meal, shelter from the weather for an hour or two, somewhere to charge his phone, connect to wifi and have people who are seeing him regularly. If you want to give someone money on the unlikely chance it will be spent wisely and not on drugs/alcohol, you do that and have the what-ifs on your conscience. But you can’t criticise others trying to look out for a homeless person in a more realistic and practical way.

You get toiletries and pants, etc at homeless shelters.

Most times homeless is a polite word for junkie and drunk.

That makes no difference to how respectful you need to be, but you do have the right to refuse to pay a dealer.

I agree with the cafe. The money was given to the cafe to provide the man with £20 worth of food. If he couldn’t eat that much in one day he could go back the following day and have some more food.

What did he buy with the money you gave him OP?

The cafe staff did completely the right thing, were completely fair (it’s not like the cafe pocketed the change), and it’s a shame they have to be on the receiving end of abuse and aggression. I’d decline any more meals paid on in these circumstances.

A local shop has a woman who regularly begs outside the doors. She will tell people things she wants like washing powder if they ask for items rather than money. She will then go back into the shop to try and return said items and take the cash.

They are now wise to this. And also know that she has a flat and gets dropped off to "beg" every morning. So they have started telling customers not to buy her anything.

They sometimes get people like OP getting uppity with them and calling them names. The staff are mostly either retired people who want to keep busy or young students, all on minimum wage and who are also threatened by shoplifters on occasion too

Get over yourself OP

It's interesting. There was a thread the other day where someone was complaining about women with NHS Healthy Start cards using the cards to buy alcohol and cigarettes. The guidelines state that they are only to to be used for fruit, veg and milk. However most people on the thread rounded on the complainer and said she was BU, people should be allowed to use the money on the card however they see fit, it's no-one's business, how dare she try to police struggling mothers.

So some people can use money meant for healthy food and drink on alcohol and cigarettes - both products that can be as harmful and addictive as drugs - because they should be allowed to choose how they spend that money and it's demeaning to force them to only spend money on specific items. But the homeless man on the street cannot use a penny of the £20 elsewhere because it was only meant for food in the cafe. Well ok.

Sorry, are you suggesting I called the cafe staff names? Where did you get that from?

The tone adopted by the cafe staff member when she refused to give him the money was really patronising and I think that is what got my back up more than anything else.

They probably deal with him several times a week you were there for a minute. Give him your money if you're sure he's off to do a food shop.

The £20 was not the homeless man's though. No one was forcing him to spend money on café food as he was never given the money to start with.
Like as been said many times now, there will be a reason that the donor did not just give this man the cash.

Lots of cafes have a 'pay it forward' sort of scheme where you can buy a drink and they keep it back for someone in need. Would you think it acceptable for someone to come in and ask for the money instead?

I thought she was saying that the staff have more knowledge of the situation than random people who pop in and cast judgement. Just like you did to the cafe staff.

And you are being rounded on and told not to police the actions of benefactors/cafe staff.

It's not interesting unless you can show us that there's any actual crossover between the two groups of posters.

But what is interesting is that you're exhibiting a double standard yourself. All this talk of how the homeless man should've been able to do what he wanted with the change, whilst not even considering that this would undermine the donor's agency to spend theirs how they want. The man who gave the money was explicit in what he wanted doing with it, but apparently that doesn't matter.

You're welcome to Google Natalie Williams, jubilee+, homeless, alcoholic. San Fransisco to try to find the link.

I've had a quick look but can't find it.

You're calling her names here

And still haven't said what YOU gave this man

So America. Which has a different outlook and situation to the UK...