To think the cafe staff should have given the money to this homeless man?

[Eastie77Returns]

I went to a cafe earlier today. There was a man outside who regularly sits with a sign stating he is homeless and asking for money. At one point a man came in, handed a member of the cafe staff a £20 note and left. It turned out he had given the staff this money to buy a meal for the homeless man who subsequently came into the cafe and ordered some food and drink. It was clearly a regular occurrence as the staff member automatically knew to charge the bill to the £20. When she had rung everything up she handed the man his meal and he asked for his change. She refused and said “No, the money is only to be used for food here. You know this. If you want to use any of the change you can order something else tomorrow”

The homeless man became angry and shouted that he wanted his money. The whole episode escalated and he began banging a table. A male member of staff eventually escorted/pushed him outside.

AIBU to think the cafe should have just given him the money??

I tend to give gift cards so that people have a bit of autonomy and choice without actually feeding any drug or alcohol habits.

I do get the point that was being made by that charity CEO, but many charities that work with the homeless advise against giving cash for very good reasons. So gift cards are a compromise that I have landed on.

While I do understand where you're coming from I don't want my money being given to drug dealers and funding the criminal activity that goes with that. I don't think either approach is right or wrong, homelessness is such a complex problem to try to solve.

The person who gave the cafe the £20 could have given it to the homeless man and there is a reason he didnt.

They didnt pocket the cash they kept a tab for the following day. Seems reasonable to me

This seems like a good compromise particularly if it's a voucher for a supermarket where they can get a range of goods

OP: AIBU?
90% of the posters: YABU
OP: no I’m not, I know better despite not knowing background of situation etc etc

I now never give cash to 'homeless', whatever the story.
Started with the guy wanting 10p for a cup of tea, so when I brought him a tea rather than gave him cash he chucked it over me angrily.

Recently I was accosted by a lady who claimed to be living in a tent, the tent had broken and she needed ££ towards a new one. I said 'No problem, lets go to Millets round the corner and I'll buy you a new tent' Well as soon as I said that, the story changed as she claimed actually needed cash to rent a room for the night from the council. When I suggested I accompany her to the council to pay this, it transpired that apparently she needed the tenner (fare actually less than half that, and a bus at the time about £2) to get a train to the adjacent council as that's where the hostel was. When I said I'd go with her to the station and buy the ticket she accused me of being weird and stalking, and stomped off when I told her no cash I will only buy 'things', food, or contribute to charities.
Later I could see she was farming the shopping precinct and being controlled by another pasty faced chap who took some notes off her.

If you were the donor ...

You were free to give the man £20 or £7 if that's what the change came to. Did you?

The person giving the money clearly didn’t want him to have the acrual
money though

OP- Do you think that the man was unreasonable not to give the cash to the homeless man directly? I’m not sure why you think that the cafe should have gone against the donor’s wishes and risked the homeless man not getting any tab in future?
Did you offer to buy him some bits in Lidl?

Its not dignified to enable addiction. Even the experts working in homeless charities will tell you not to give them money.

Surely the cafe could have put the change 'behind the till' for the homeless man to credit them to use for future purchases? I think it's wrong that they should pocket whatever wasn't sent - it could buy the homeless person a coffee or whatever in the future.

YABU. He would've just spent it on drugs

OP says that's what they did.

If you are not naive ( I think you are) then you are incredibly obtuse. The money was given TO THE CAFE not to the homeless person. I repeat - they have been given the money . If the donor wanted homeless person to have money they would give to him - NOT TO THE CAFE.
What he decides to do with the money is not an issue as he doesn’t have it.
i hope you have the courage of your convictions and gave this greatly wronged ( in your opinion) homeless person the money they needed?

But this donor clearly didn't, otherwise he would have given the money to the man direct. For all you know, he did give him money directly on other occasions. The simple fact is that he gave the money to the cafe for one purpose only, and they would have been 100% in the wrong if they had decided to use it for a different purpose.

No-one, including me, has any idea how and why this man has ended up where he is.

Not necessarily true, OP. The man giving the money may well know exactly how he has ended up where he is, hence his decision not to give him money direct.

You seem to be avoiding questions about whether you gave him any money yourself, given that you feel so strongly about this?

Do you know the full situation of this man or the café? If not you shouldn't be judging them

I once got in a lot of trouble for giving freebies to a person with learning difficulties as it turned out she could be very violent - anyone looking on after that would think I was being unkind.

If he's really wanted to he could've ordered food up to the value of the money given and saved some.

OP do you not find it ironic that you find it out of order that people think her likely has a drink or drugs problem. Yet are perfectly happy to assume that you as a passer by are untitled to an equal or more opinion on what should have happened to the money compared to the cafe and benefactor who know him better.

Kindly, you may have some experience in areas of high homelessness, but those of us with lots of experience with people with alcohol and drugs issues would a) trust the people who knew him better and b) be able to spot whether he had substance or alcohol issues at first glance.

That is what they did. And it seems it was ringfenced just for him, and not anyone homeless or vulnerable going in and asking if there are any drinks or food going for free.

It sounds like an arrangement between the donor, the homeless man and the cafe. But if he keeps kicking off then at some point he will be banned.

It doesn't matter what else the homeless man wanted to spend the money on, as the man who donated the £20 clearly only wanted it to be spent on food/drink from the cafe, otherwise he would have given the money to the homeless person directly. The cafe is therefore correct in honouring his wishes.

I say this as someone who far prefers to give homeless people cash without strings. But not all people feel the same as me, and their wishes are just as valid when they are donating their own hard-earned cash.

YABU.

Why don’t you give him £20 to go and buy food and toiletries at Lidl then. Then come back and tell us what he’s spent the money on.

Whilst I utterly agree with you, if (and it is not unlikely) they spend it on drugs then this is fuelling criminal activity, county lines, gangs and child exploitation among other things, so I never give money. It’s a very difficult moral choice.

It isn’t a huge leap to imagine that someone living on the streets would use money to help fade away into oblivion by taking drugs. We can talk about the removal of choice all we want, but ultimately a large percentage of homeless people abuse substances because it helps them forget where they are & blank out the endless monotony of their circumstance.

There are multiple charities who beg people not to hand over cash but to do exactly what this generous person has done (or donate directly to them, of course). There’s a hard & fast reason why they ask this - we don’t know the back stories & have no place to judge but drug use is extremely common amongst those who have lost all hope.

OP - if it bothers you this much & it does sound like an upsetting scene to have witnessed, charities are crying out for volunteers 🫶🏻

The issue with just buying stuff for homeless people is that it becomes about the person giving and not the person receiving.

Eg it feels good to buy a bacon sandwich and a coffee for someone but it feels less good to receive it if you don't like coffee and are a gluten intolerant vegetarian. Who is the purchase for the benefit of?

It's not that buying food is inherently denying someone their autonomy. The problem is that some people take the attitude that they're homeless and so should be grateful for what they're given.

"Excuse me... Hi, I'm just popping into Tesco. Can I get you anything while I'm in there?"

"Oh thanks, I'd love a chicken sandwich and a coke?"

"i dont know what they've got. Is chicken and stuffing and a diet coke? Ok?"

"Yeah, thanks. Although chicken and bacon if they have it and a full fat coke would he better!"

"No worries. I'll see what I can do 🙂"

This is a human interaction and exchange. Just doubling up on your own order in Costa and handing it to someone on the way out is the opposite.

OP, when you hand over £20 to the cafe, you can ask them to give him the change. Until then, wind your neck in!