For saying Im not auto childcare because I don't have children?

[Trainfortwoplease]

Background - DH and I have been trying for a while with no success, apart from a recent first trimester miscarriage.

We have a trip planned with another 3 couples, which I've really been looking forward to. All other couples have children, ranging from 6 months > 3 years old. Its not our first trip, usually a mix of walks/Sunday lunches and bbqs. It will be the first trip since the latest couple had their first DC. All couples know DH and I are trying.

In the last few weeks there have been comments about how I'll have the job of being responsible and getting all the mums home from the pub, how DH and I can babysit all the kids and let the parents have a night off and I recently found out they are planning a trip for just the other 3 (like a Disneyland), but DH and I aren't invited because "that doesn't seem our thing". We weren't asked, just told.

Today there was another joke that on the upcoming trip I'll be watching the kids while the rest are at the pub. I replied on our group message with "ha ha, no thanks. I might have fertility issues but I still want to enjoy the trip with you all".

My friend has now messaged me separately, saying ive upset her husband (who i was responding too).

I have no plans to apologise, aibu?

Your response is perfect. I’m so sorry, you deserve much better friends! My best friend is childfree and keeps asking to come and babysit our children so DH and I can go out and I always refuse because if she’s coming up, I want to spend time with her!

You sound amazing and I’m sure you’ll have no problem meeting much nicer friends. Also your relationship sounds lovely, the way you have each others back with it all ❤️

Cancel going. Your friends sound insensitive and quite thick.

I'm so glad your DH sent that text alongside your reply. I hope you can enjoy your time away together and I really hope you can one day have the baby that you long for. Best wishes OP 💐

I think Gregg needs to have a little thinking time and realise that what he feels is embarrassment which is normal when someone calls you out for being a d. He (and the others) made insensitive jokes when their friends were struggling with fertility issues. If they didn’t put two and two together, fine, but OP has now told them how she feels and it is clear their ‘jokes’ were hurtful. His and Mrs Gregg’s anger/upset is misplaced - they only have themselves to blame for being insensitive and have chosen to become the victims rather than apologise profusely for messing up. As you say, I’d be inclined to give couple two a chance as we’re all human and make mistakes. But a thumbs up is friendship ending, I think!

It’s not the OP’s responsibility to teach her ‘friends’ how to be decent human beings. If they don’t know that already, she’s better off without them.

I would say 'I'll be out every night the dads can take turns babysitting!'

Unless you think you might want them to babaysit for you on a similar trip in the future with your baby.

I never babysat for my brothers kids so I wouldn't dare ask them to now, but if I'd done lots for them I would be cashing it in now!

I think I would give couple 2 the benefit of the doubt. Let them come round and apologise. If none of them have experienced infertility, even if they have had miscarriages, they may well not have recognized their insensitivity until they were called out on it. Up until then, it was mates having a giggle, not really thinking about what it would have been like to be on the receiving end.
This couple seem to have grasped it quickly, so maybe they have had losses. The others, if having babies is so easy for them, won't have ever had to pause for thought about the impact of their 'jokes'.

From my own experience, I still recall the venom of my SIL when I found I was expecting. I made a flippant comment about it being a surprise to me as we had not been TTC. I had no idea they were TTC, they already had 2 and as far as I knew had no difficulties with conceiving either of them. At the time, I was so taken aback by her reaction. It was only with hindsight that I can see that the ease I had with conceiving felt like a kick to her when she had clearly had problems. I never intended to be insensitive to her and was horrified to have upset her. I was a lot more cautious after that.

I am sorry you have experienced this from people who were meant to be friends.

You and your husband handled that brilliantly @Trainfortwoplease. It’s so nice to read about a couple who really are on the same team. I get a bit depressed reading most threads on here.

Any holiday with someone else’s DCs is endlessly annoying, its just not fun at all, they should have been sucking up to you for tolerating the general irritation of someone else’s noisy messy rude children when you’ve paid good money and taken annual leave.

I would give the apologetic couple a second chance, we all make mistakes and we all learn, I could see myself being mortified and hoping a grovelling apology would be accepted. Only people with zero wisdom are unable to look at their behaviour and say “yes, that was really really bad, I should have seen that WAY DIIFERENTLY”. Only people who can grow and learn and stay interesting can properly apologise. See what you think. People who can apologise are generally less shallow than the rest.

The planned holiday sounds very un-fun, I would recommend Marrakesh: its a very cool destination, very romantic, not kid friendly.

What utter shits. I’m glad your dh stood up for you like that. Do you think you’ll see the apology couple? It’s good he’s owned up to their shitty mistakes at least.

I had so many scenarios like this when we went through years of fertility treatment and recurrent losses. People are so thoughtless and selfish at times, but generally it’s through lack of understanding, not malicious. Doesn’t make it ok though.

you've the patience of a saint putting up with the ‘banter’ for so long. I’d have snapped long ago.

i remember missing baths and being so happy at being in one again. I hope you had lots of bubbles!

I don’t agree. OP was very restrained considering.

The fact that you're having such struggles and your loss is so recent and they know this just underlines the incredible insensitivity of these people. The couple who are mortified may be salvageable, but the others are not worth your time. Book yourselves a lovely trip just as a couple and recuperate together. 💐

Absolutely despicable that they would behave like this. Your response was perfect. Straightforward but dignified. I should think the first two couples are saying nothing because they're too busy stewing in their own juice, as they should.

Thank you, that's helpful to know x

Absolutely no chance would I be 'giving anyone a break' and minding children that weren't mine. Family holidays are for spending time as a family. They should have left them at home with a sitter if they wanted child free time.

Im so sorry for your loss. I hope things go well for you in future.
I also hope you find better friends: one couple may be redeemable, but the others are atrocious, insensitive cunts. As well as being CFs.

Have a wonderful holiday with your DH.

Hi Op,
These people aren’t friends and have no respect for you and your husband. What’s wrong with them?! The “jokes” aren’t jokes but rather a very cruel and rude was of saying how they see you and you DH.

The jokes are bad enough but their responses, specially Mrs Greggs, tells you all you need to know about them.

Good job to you and DH for speaking up. I sometimes feel like many people who just walk around behaving poorly partly stems them never having to be made to face consequences of their actions.- By speaking up, you are reinforcing you position.

I would exit the group- there is not much for you in it.

Take case

Sending virtual hugs 💚

Exactly. Id be telling my husband to stop being so silly. Imagine having the nerve to get upset at the fact that he needs to look after his own kids and the wife having a bigger nerve to tell op. Very weird.

This.

Your husband is fantastic!
Planning a trip without you is really horrible on a group holiday. And the other stuff is just wrong.
I like the couple that have messaged and want to apologise.
But fuck the other couples who are just pissed they’ve lost their free babysitter.

That makes no sense. As the only childless couple, why would you be expected to provide lifts and childcare? I could understand the lifts bit if you were pregnant, but you’re not.

And to be honest, the last holiday I’d ever want to go on as a childless couple, is one with other people’s small kids. It’ll be awful. Make the most of an adults’ only holiday while you can.

I REALLY hope Mrs Gregg is on here and learning about herself in real time.

This one's for you, hun, should it be the case.

🖕

Oh my goodness. What an utter cockwomble Mr Gregg is! The text you sent was perfect. Glad couple #2 have apologised and want to make amends. Some people can be thoughtless but Mr and Mrs Gregg are taking it to a whole new level.

I’m so sorry for your loss. You deserve only love and kindness. Which sane person would ever treat a woman going through a difficult fertility journey in such a crass and insensitive way?

Enjoy your bath and enjoy planning a great weekend away with your husband.

I am in utter disbelief that your friends have treated you like this at such a delicate time in your life. Absolutely unbelievable! I have read through all of your posts on this and your responses are spot on. I’m irrationally proud of how your husband has had your back! And you are making the right decision in not going! There are better friends out there who won’t treat you like this! I hope you find an amazing alternative trip x

This. I suspect the ‘jokes’ were in fact heavy handed hints, and when you said no Gregg decided to show his arse. He was fully intending to palm off the kids on you and/or your DH.