Friend upset because of a comment I made about renting

[scarystories]

Last week, I caught up with a close friend and we started talking about pensions. This topic came up because I recently started a new job and chose to opt out of the private pension scheme. I've always made this choice for various reasons that I won't bore you with, it’s a personal decision that suits me. However, I completely understand why others would choose to have one. Of course, I might live until I'm 90 and end up eating beans on toast every day, who knows? But that's my issue, not anyone else's.

Anyway, I told my friend that I wasn't worried and was hopeful that my mortgage would be paid off in the next 20-30 years, so I wouldn't have to worry about that monthly expense. I mentioned that it's harder for people who rent, as that bill will always be there. This comment upset her because she rents, and she felt I was looking down on her. That was not my intention (I actually rented for 7 years before buying my house). I was only stating a fact: rent is a constant expense, whereas a mortgage eventually ends.

Was I wrong? Should I apologise?

I think it might be because you said ‘the bill will always be there’ like it was a definite fact

You were presuming she will never be able to buy a house, which may or may not be true - but who wants to be reminded of that?!

Use the THINK code before you speak
Is what you are about to say: (answers per your comment)

True - possibly
Helpful - no
Inspiring - no
Necessary - no
Kind - not really

So in hindsight, probably not a great thing to say - although I think you were just a bit clueless rather than mean

I have recently taken on quite a big mortgage (for a single person on my income) in my 40s, because like you I was terrified about renting when I hit old age, and how that would work. (Truth be told I will likely inherit one if not two reasonably substantial amounts by then, both probably enough to buy a small place outright in the cheap part of the country I live in, but have never wanted to rely on that because anything could happen between now and then, the relatives concerned could fall out with me and leave it to the cats' home etc eyc. So I wanted it to be a bonus but not my sole provision).

And yea, it's a struggle to buy on your own, and involves a lot of saving and going without, so I 100% get you.

HOWEVER, I try to be really careful when I make comments to friends who are still renting, as I can remember those comments and how useless and stressed they used to make me feel....

I only have four friends who are close enough that I would frankly discuss my financial situation and choices with them. One is a homeowner of a much more expensive house than I could ever afford, and has hurt me in the past in a similar way to th the way you hurt your friends. Two rent, and I am close enough to them to know that they also worry about their financial situation, so it is something we can discuss frankly without offence, and I talk to them about ways to get out of the rent trap. The other lives with her parents and has a solid plan in place for her future, so that's less of a concern.

My point is, if you don't know your friend well enough to know that comments like that will upset her, you should have kept your mouth shut about money.

But what's done is done. Apologise frankly, say that you weren't thinking, and that you yourself know how stressful it can all be and you fully understand (but ONLY say this if you can do so without sounding condescending and smug!)

Good luck. At least you are kind enough to care that you have upset her. That's a start!

Your pal is upset by something you said. Whether you feel she’s wrong or right - isn’t it just kinder and easier to say sorry. My view is that if I’ve upset someone I care about, whether it was intentional or not I apologize. They obviously feel scared or worried about their financial future - note that this is a sensitivity for them and don’t bring it it up in the future. Small beer for keeping good relations with a good pal.

Me too.
I'm a renter and I can't see anything offensive here. It's something I've thought about and am planning for, as it will be an ongoing bill.
I may want to wish it away, but it's just a fact.

Not sure why your comment would bother her.

It's factual, I'm a renter and probably always will be but your comment wouldn't have bothered me. It's madness that people can't just accept others people's situations are different.

Just do what's best for you as it seems some people will take offence regardless.

I dont think it's crowing or insensitive as you were talking about finances and the future at the time. It is just a fact and if people who rent haven't considered this then it's probably good that they do think about it although it would be a worry.

Oh my goodness, did that feel good to get that off your chest.You sound very bitter.

You just stated a fact @scarystories - rent doesn’t end unless your circumstances change, but a mortgage does. It isn’t looking down your nose or anything like it, sounds like she is over-sensitive. I wouldn’t apologise for what I said (because you were not making a judgement of renters - if you were that would be a different matter). But you could reassure her that you were talking about how your expenses will go down when you pay off the mortgage and nothing more 🤷🏻‍♀️

While true, it was quite gloaty and insensitive of you

I agree with this actually

I'd apologise for stating the bloody obvious.
Mortgages are cheaper than rent and offer security, nice one for pointing out she can't afford this luxury.

You've upset her. It's wasn't intentional, so apologise and move on

@Justchilling07 Comments like that really make me laugh because people here get absolutely slated if they don’t work or pay taxes. Meanwhile, I do work, and the only reason I opted out of the pension scheme is because I can’t afford the monthly payments. After paying tax, national insurance, mortgage, bills, and everything else, there’s hardly anything left to put into my pension pot. Maybe the government should consider reducing taxes so that people can afford to make monthly contributions to their pensions instead. And then people like that wouldn’t be so bitter about having us to subside in our old age. Just a thought 🤷🏼‍♀️

I agree with this. I also think you’re mad not to have a pension but I’d never say anything critical to a friend who didn’t have one expressing that. Even with a house I own and pension seven scheme I worry whether it’ll be enough, but self aware enough I realise I have more than some and less than others.

I don't necessarily think it's easier being a home owner in retirement years. It depends on the situation. Some older people particularly those in social housing get the vast majority of their rent paid for them by housing benefit, especially if like you they will have no private pension, wheras homeowners can be crippled by one huge house repair bill.

and which services are you happy for the government to stop funding to allow for the drop in taxes?

Though rent can be covered by Housing Benefit in retirement, if income is low.

@TeenLifeMum I have no idea, but don’t make people feel guilty if they can’t afford to pay into their pension then. You can’t have it both ways.

It worries you when you rent though. I was 45 and renting with two kids and could never have afforded to buy where we live. I can get a mortgage as a single parent for 180K and a deposit of 40 K so raise 220k tops and that without stamp duty, solicitors and movers. The cheapest house round here to buy at 3 bed is £350K and that would need gutting and rewiring and be full of damp and mould etc and need a new boiler, windows etc

I met DH and we brought together he put in far more than me and we brought a 4 bed for £500 K - same house others are selling for now 965 K locally - how the hell does someone afford that? Women particularly single parents with children can get properly screwed - I did!

It's how you said it.

was hopeful that my mortgage would be paid off in the next 20-30 years, so I wouldn't have to worry about that monthly expense

That is a reasonable thing for you to say.

I mentioned that it's harder for people who rent, as that bill will always be there.

This bit was a totally unnecessary addition to say to someone who you know rents!

Think before you speak.

She didn't crow. Why are you interpreting it like that?

Yeh, it sounds like you were being deliberately pointed and attacking.

I wouldn’t to a friend - I will on here to prove my point. Doesn’t feel nice does it? That’s what you just did to your friend, made her feel crap.

I think if you are actually saying/thinking "people like you who rent" then maybe don't say it. But if you are saying it generally, had forgotten she rented or were not thinking about her specifically, then it's easily said.
I'd apologise for hurting her feelings but what you have said is generally true.

You also now have the awkwardness of always having to think twice before speaking with her, I have friends like this and it can be tiring.

@TeenLifeMum Oh my goodness. How did I make her feel guilty? I spent nearly 8 years renting. I understand how hard it can be. I was showing empathy, not trying to make her feel bad. However, you've already created a scenario in your head, and nothing I say will alter that, so it is what it is 🤷🏼‍♀️

Also, please don’t believe that you’ve made me feel bad. You’re just a stranger online.