To take DD’s trust fund..

[BlueFlamingo55]

AIBU to take part of DD’s trust fund to pay for our new house?

DD has quite a modest trust fund (~£30k) that I had promised to give her this year since she is now 19. The money is my inheritance from DF but instead I decided to put it away for DD when she was younger to help with her university costs, first car, house deposit etc.

Life didn’t turn out quite how I had expected it to and I have just come away from a messy divorce and am now having to purchase a new house in my 50s.. I’ve found a home that both DD and I love but my deposit (my share of the equity money from the marital home) wouldn’t be enough. I therefore decided that I’d take half of DD’s trust money to top things up. I do not want to do this and it was never the plan but it’s the only way I’ll be able to afford this house. We’ve explored cheaper options further outside of town but DD refuses to live in any of them (and I quietly agree with her, I much prefer the area this house is in)

I made the mistake of telling DD my plans re: the trust fund and she has gone absolutely ballistic, for want of a better term. Saying that I’m stealing her money and how will she possibly be able to afford her travel plans etc etc. Apparently I’m trying to ruin her life. I’ve reminded her that I help her out financially 24/7 and she is not hard done by but there is absolutely no talking sense into her. She has refused to speak to me all week.

Am I really the worst mother in the world for taking £15k in order to pay for good, permanent accommodation for us both?

So legally yours - morally I would say it is DD as that was your intention 17 years ago and you have told her and she has made plans. The title is misleading as a trust fund is a legal person in its own right. I would not do this as I think it would permanently damage your relationship with DD. I would buy the house I can afford as in my mind the £30k isn’t my money.

@BlueFlamingo55 I am not totally sure what I would do in your place. It's a tough call. You had hoped your DD would use the money for a good reason and she isn't. It is her money, yet it really isn't.

One thing I will tell you now. Do NOT tell your DD that she will be getting money from your DM. Unless your DM expressly leaves it to your DD, it is your money, not hers. Stop making promises that might be too difficult to keep.

I hope you can find a decent place, whether you use some of the savings account money or not.

You are NOT a bad mother, at all. Sometimes, shit happens and we have to adjust our life. It doesn't hurt your DD to learn that little tidbit at her age.

I’d be interested to know if the money was included in any financial settlement made in the divorce. Because if it was in your name, it should have been, and if it’s in DDs name it should have be given to her when she turned 18.
At her age though, she doesn’t get to decide where you buy a house!

your daughter is a selfish twat. yes its not great only getting half the promised amount, but its for the purpose of getting a decent house to live in now. with that shitty ungrateful attitude id be considering taking the whole amount. its your money op, daughter should be grateful she is getting any. its not a trust fund, its your savings, which you had hoped in good faith would benefit your daughter. but life throws curveballs and hard decisions have to be made. would id live in a crappy area for the rest of my life so dd could go on a really nice jolly? no, probably not.even if she was going to use it for future house purchase, your immediate needs trump that.

It may still belong to the daughter. The name on the account is a red herring.

Say I give you a car but we keep it in my garage. The legally important question is ‘was it given’ not ‘whose garage is it’.

If it was given but kept in OP’s account then she is a trustee. (There are other ways of becoming a trustee too, which is complicating this discussion).

Practically, if nothing is documented, it comes down to a moral question because the daughter has very little hope of demonstrating that the funds are hers. But legally if she has made the gift she cannot take it back at will, regardless of whose name is on the account.

Completely agree with this & I’m amazed anyone thinks otherwise! Your DD sounds like an entitled brat & needs firmly shown how wrong she is. The only person damaging your relationship is her (sorry Op as I’m sure you did your best & are massively disappointed in her attitude.)

If they used common sense it is. People skim read. An adult cannot take another adults money without consent, most people know that, so really strange people are accusing her of fraud. See it all the time here. The other day a poster said my husband ate all my kids snacks and he always does this and I find out too late on a Sunday night. Multiple posts saying but it’s Sunday morning. Of course it was obvious OP was in Australia (actually was NZ). I find it odd how people don’t seem to use any common sense when reading posts on here.

Perfectly reasonable . You made that offer before you needed to buy a reasonable house and home for both of you.
Now the situation has changed. You can’t afford to gift DD £30 K but you will still give her a generous amount. She is still a very lucky girl !

I haven't read the full thread but have read all the OP's posts. I cannot believe people are suggesting that a woman in her 50s about to take on a new mortgage and in a situation where the ex never sees his child should take on additional credit card debt to ensure her dd can go travelling to the extent she wants.

The money should never have been mentioned to dd and it should not have been left in an account in which it barely grew, but that can't be changed now. I think the dd sounds extremely immature and entitled and and I would be so disappointed if my dc behaved that way in those circumstances. I understand her being disappointed but that's it. And people are suggesting it would be understandable if it was the end of the relationship. What on earth?

Sounds like the sensible thing to do. It's your money, and daughter sounds ungrateful.

The funds are not hers are they and never were. I have an empty garage, anyone could park their car there or someone could say in 10yrs you can have that car. But until it was in my name, it’s not my car.

I can’t believe how so many think this entitled young lady should have the money to splash on a gap year whilst mum struggles. Even though it’s the mums inheritance. OPs been thrown a curve ball. Yeah it sucks to get 15k less, but tough shit. It is only going to wasted on travelling, when it’s actually needed for practical reasons. Or she gets it all and they live somewhere less desirable. OP has made the right choice. This is a compromise and she still gets half the money. I am shocked how many people think her behaviour is appropriate. Someone even said the mum should rent so this princess gets the 30k. Unbelievable.

Your first mistake was telling her it existed. No, you can't take away something that has been gifted to her, even if it was you that gifted it. Her brain won't accept that that your plan will benefit her, she just wants the money, as most 19 year olds would. You'll have to move to a scuzzier town to spite her, just don't steal the money!

@Zanatdy until it was in my name, it’s not my car.

This is simply not how the law on cars, or on funds held in trust for minors, works.

Grateful or ungrateful doesn’t come into it, legally. The question is did OP give her daughter the money, or did she only promise she would in future.

What I don’t get is why you’re asking strangers on the internet what to do when the person you’re taking the £15,000 from ALREADY SAID NO F*KING WAY?
I mean, I thought she made herself perfectly clear.
Was it the “no,” or was it the “going ballistic,” over money that’s RIGHTFULLY HERS that made you mad enough to create a post on Mumsnet about your own daughter?

“We’ve explored cheaper options further outside of town but DD refuses to live in any of them”

So tell DD that the choice is either you use £15k of her inheritance and live in a nicer area, and that you’ll set up some arrangement to pay her back, or you leave her money intact and live in a less salubrious area - that appears to be the only choice. As she won’t be living at home for that much longer, it shouldn’t really affect DD too much - but do underline to her the difference that this money is making to your house-buying prospects- she might want to reconsider blowing it on travelling. As ever, money is hard come by but easily spent.

I wouldn't take her money if she is unwilling to give it.
However, she must then accept that you are going to have to live in a less desirable area and that she will have to contribute to all bills moving forward.
She is 19, probably won't be living at home for much longer and should be capable of paying towards her own expenses.

To be honest, I thought I'd be on your daughter's side, but I'm not.

Women over 55 are one of the fastest growing sectors of homelessness. As this was your inheritance, you absolutely should use is for your new home.

It was a lovely idea to try and keep it all for your daughter, but life hasn't played out that way. She can be disappointed from the comfort of her new bedroom.

She's 19, she's got plenty of time to travel. Is she at Uni now? Surely 15 000 will still be a huge help to her. Time for you to prioritise yourself, the mortgage and your pension. I have no doubt that if you're in a position to give her a bit more further down the track, that you will.

I say this as someone with adult children, holding on to an inheritance to hopefully pass on to them. But, should DH or I need it for medical expenses or aged care, then it will be used for that. Mum left something to me and I hope to be in a position to pass the full amount plus more on, but I wouldn't do so if I didn't have a home.

At 19 she's old enough to get over this tantrum and understand that she is benefiting from this money still. She will have a nice home to live in while she gets a part time job to save for her travels.

Don't take advice on money or legal matters (which is what a trust is) from Mumsnet. Spend 30 mins with a solicitor in your area and avoid any hot water.

I expect what they'll tell you that it's either in a trust or it isn't. If it is, including via a trust bank account for your daughter with you as trustee, the money is no longer yours and you cannot use it like this. If for some reason your daughter hasn't taken full control of it at 18 possibly you could use it and put her on the deeds of this new house but only if it is genuinely a better investment of the money that where it currently is and I'm her intrust rather than yours (which sounds doubtful - you'd need to be careful about the justification and discuss with the solicitor - not just any old self-justifying will do). If you use her trust fund for your own gain you could be a real trouble.

If it's not, I expect they'll tell you, first stop referring to it as a trust when it's not. It's a very seriously different thing. If it's just in an ordinary savings account in your name but you'd always said you'd give it to her at some point it's more murky. I imagine your solicitor will tell you that if your daughter has relied on that promise in a way that means it would actually cause her problems if you went back on your word, she may actually have a claim on that too. Much less likely but possible. More likely is that it just becomes a moral issue for you.

But for goodness sake check with a solicitor with some experience of this before you make any decisions, as you sound very unclear what the actual set up is.

Travelling isn't just being a gadabout.

Given the circumstances, this is actually your money, you promised it when finances were different etc I would use it on the house. But I would try to explain to her. There are 101 reasons why that money might have needed to have been used (you got ill, house needed a new roof etc). I guess the lesson is don’t tell young people - they can become entitled.

It would be completely different if the money had been left to her.

You need to take legal advice as people really don't understand what a trust or a trust funds are.
A trust fund is not a kind of investment, it is property held under a particular legal arrangement, whereby the asset is held in the name of one person (the trustee) for the benefit of someone else (the beneficiary). The trust is created by a "declaration of trust" made by the original legal owner of the property known as the settlor (in this case the OP).
So the real question to ask isn't whose name is the money in, but was there ever a "declaration of trust"? If OP has told her daughter "I am holding this money in trust for you" then there is a high chance this is a trust, and the daughter can legally demand her mother hand it over.
The practicality of daughter enforcing the trust is another matter but it sounds to me as though the daughter is in the right.
OP, you need to speak with her as adults with a problem to solve. One way around it would be to use the money to buy the house in both your names, with a written declaration of trust as to the proportions in which it is held. (NB property ownership will impact your daughter's own ability to purchase s house of her own as she would have to pay higher stamp duty as an existing property owner).
But please, please take advice from a decent Private Client solicitor (look for a solicitor who is a member of STEP) before you make an even bigger mess of things.

OP clearly stated (yesterday 21.15) that the money is in a savings account in OP's name. She called it a trust fund previously but it's not.

Well, that’s a stretch 😂

literally nothing to suggest the OP benefitted in anyway from putting 30k in a trust. How would she benefit?

Why can't you compromise on the type of accommodation you buy for you and her as a home? Does it have to be a house? Could you get an apartment or smaller house with 2 bedrooms? She has her life ahead of her and you have had yours, whatever has happened in it, it is now her world. Soon she will be flying the nest and making her experiences. Your father's money is family money to share with your daughter. Are you still in a good and gainful occupation? If so, why not sacrifice a few holidays/luxuries/little purchases to cover £15,000. It the great scheme of things £15,000 is not that much to our generation but the world to a 19 year old. I would put one caveat on the money though - that she uses it wisely and does not come to you for extra cash during her study years. You can then perhaps recoup some of the £15K.

If it was your inheritance, not hers, then it is time for a serious discussion with your dd. She is 19 and old enough to deal with financial reality.

You could either use some of the money and give her a proportionate share of the house but with the clause that you can live in the house for life, or you buy a smaller home, and she has the box room, before she goes off travelling.

It is her choice, and she can own that decision.

It might also be a good way of limiting inheritance tax in the future, if a % of the house is hers now.