AIBU to wonder my manager lied about her daughter’s school?

[temptemp2]

Not sure if I’m overthinking this or if something odd is going on.

A while ago, my manager and I were chatting about our kids. She was asking about SATs for her 8-year-old DD. I explained what I knew and also mentioned the 11+ since my DS (14) is at a grammar school and went through the process.
She said her daughter isn’t really into study so there is no point getting a tutor. She made it sound like school isn’t really her thing.

Then just the other day, I overheard her telling someone else at work that her daughter is at a private grammar school. That really threw me, especially after our earlier conversation. I did not say anything, but I felt a bit taken aback.

I get that people do not always share everything, and maybe she didn’t want to go into it before, but it felt like a lie especially after she asked me for info and gave the impression her daughter wouldn’t be doing anything like the 11+. Why say all that if her daughter is already at a private grammar?

AIBU to feel confused and like she was being a bit dishonest?

Did you just assume the child was at a state primary because she asked about SATs? Quite a lot of private schools don't bother with them so I would tend to assume the same if someone was chatting about them.

I can also easily see how someone who sat an entrance exam for 7+ for an independent school could be excelling, but not be particularly academic or enjoy studying and getting a tutor to sit the 11+ for a state grammar would be a waste of everyone's time.

Honestly, I think you are reading far too much into this and I would probably have thought 'that's a bit odd, that wasn't the impression I got' when you overheard her talking to your colleague, and then not given it another thought. I don't think she has gone out of her way to mislead you - I think you made an assumption which was incorrect and now feel a bit put out about that.

But you didn't hear her say something completely different unless you are going to tell us she has got a tutor for her. She was being polite listening to your tales of 11*.

My 4 all passed the 11+ and never had tutors. It is possible. I feel sorry for the kids who have years of tutoring to get into a school where they are likely to struggle.

Could be that’s she’s happy to be frank and open with you, but feels less comfortable and like she has to impress the other person she spoke to?

that is has grammar in the name does not mean it is a grammar school.

She may also have been ‘playing down’ because some people have strong reactions to private schooling/children doing well at private school (‘only doing well because they’re spoon fed spoilt brats!’), and doesn’t want to risk it causing bad feeling amongst her colleagues.

It is pointles getting a tutor at many provate schools, a, because they prep the kids for the format of the 11 plus whereas state schools do not and b because their entrance tests , especially for internal candidates are often based on CAT like computer tests (the ones my son did were called INCAS & CEM or something ike that.

My son is not at all academic but he excelled at college in a particular area.

@TheignT where did I say it wasn't possible? I was referring to people who down play...

So many replies like this!

Of course it’s good to get the measure of someone you work closely with. Especially if they are prone to telling pointless lies. Working out why she lied may help OP guide future conversations (e.g she’s massively protective of her family and doesn’t want anyone knowing where they go to school)

Well that’ll be because it’s fee paying

It’s just a private school that any kid can go to if you’ve got the funds. It’s not private “grammar”. Grammar schools require you to be of above average intelligence. Private schools do not.

@Cattery that is true for many privates but not all. Some are very selective

That’s a bit reductive. Some private schools do. Some private schools don’t. They aren’t a monolith.

There are some incredibly selective private schools where half the kids get straight 9s at GCSE and all A*s at A-level. There are also private schools which have no entrance exams - that are simply first come, first served - as well as schools which do set entrance tests but basically let in anyone who can write their own name.

You are coming across as a sticky beak who is far too invested in your bosses child.
often people with clever children don’t feel the need to brag.

You've lost me that she is telling you that her daughter doesn't like studying, and no point in getting her a tutor but also saying her daughter is excelling at school?

Perhaps you gave to much information to her that she didn't know how to get out of the conversation, then talking to someone else it was a different conversation and she felt she could say more.

Sometime people can come across in such a way the conversation is shut down with a couple of reasons - but with someone else they feel more comfortable and will say more.

Possibly its you? Have a think about how you come across to other people? It maybe that you just don't gel with this person, but its understandable you feel they have held back on information - but they don't have to gibe you everything

I think you're overthinking it. It doesn't sound like she "lied", rather that these sort of conversations are often quite nuanced by choice of words.

Most people are proud of their children and anxious that they do well at school, whether that's academically, socially, in the mental wellbeing sense, by getting the benefit of certain opportunities that suit them or a combination of all those and more.

Parents who are worried about how their children are performing or settling at school will tend to talk about them in a way that manages expectations without getting into detail. For example my husband and I both passed the 11+ and people would assume our son was taking it. In fact he was struggling massively at school due to (then undiagnosed) ADHD and we were very worried. But rather than bang on about that we'd say "oh he's not very academic, we don't think grammar would suit him".

Our youngest did take 11+ and has got a grammar place but the schools here are super selective so we didn't want to assume she would get a place and make her feel under pressure. Also a lot of people disapprove of the grammar system and I didn't want to get into all that. So we didn't talk about it much to others and only if they asked we'd say nonchalantly "oh yes we'll let her have a go".

We considered private for both ours at different times when it seemed like the best option. I actually felt quite awkward about it as we're quite lefty and initially said we didn't believe in it but that came a point where we thought "but we can afford it so if it's the best option why would we not do the best for our child". But I wouldn't have wanted to discuss it openly for exactly the above reasons, unless it was right in a "read the room" sense.

"Ordinary school" can mean a range of things. If she said "state school" when her kids were at private that would be untruthful but ordinary school just seems vague.

"Private grammar school" is not the same as Grammar School. If it's a private school with grammar in the name she was correct to describe it as such.

Private schools may or may not have entrance exams but they aren't usually the same as the 11+ and could be harder or easier. So her daughter probably didn't take the 11+ as you know it.

I can't see why you are so convinced she "lied".

I would agree that a London grammar place is harder than a selective private school place to get but it doesn't mean some privates don't require above average intelligence.

Maybe the daughter is at private school maybe she isn't brilliant academically and she felt comfortable sharing that with you but not the other person.
I wouldn't over think it.

I am aware
Its NOT a Grammar school though

@Hoppinggreen Ok

I don't see any lies? What I see is you creating your own narrative rather than taking her at her word.
Saying your child isn't into school and there's no point in getting a tutor doesn't mean they are at a state school and struggling academically.
I wouldn't get my son a tutor, he doesn't like school. However, he is very intelligent and prefers to learn independently in his own time.
You need to stop making up stories in your head, it could get you in trouble. If you make an assumption based on someone's word you should ask for clarification before deciding what you think is what they actually said.

Your boss asked you about SATs and you went on to talk about the 11plus and your dc at Grammar. which is irrelevant. I don’t see the relevance of the 11plus and sats and I think perhaps your boss thought you were bragging. So Gave you minimal information about her kid and moved on. Think that’s how I’d play it.

It’s not a State Grammar but the word Grammar was incorporated into many private schools. It’s not exclusive to state.

I would assume that her DD is at a fee-paying prep school which is the feeder school for a selective secondary school with its own entrance exam, for which she is being crammed. She doesn't need a tutor and she might not be up to the 11+.

I went to such a secondary school on a direct grant from the lea in the sixties. The pupils from the prep school were as thick as mince, and of course the average IQ plummeted once direct grants were abolished.

We have lots of independent schools locally, that have an exam that y7 need to pass to get a place. So they are technically ‘selective’ but not until y7.
I have never heard of a school that has an exam for children who are in y3 or younger.
Independent schools at prep are not selective and are much cheaper than at secondary.

This is what you don’t seem to understand.

Her daughter could currently be at a great private prep school with ‘grammar’ in the title that is selective at y7. But is also not academic and would not have a chance at the 11plus. And they wouldn’t invest in a tutor.

As private schools don’t always do SATs she may genuinely been interested and many don’t bother with the 11plus as they can afford school fees. She may genuinely have been interested in how the ‘state’ system works.

You have made assumptions. She asked direct questions. You should have asked more questions rather than just assumed.

The most obvious answer here is that you got the wrong end of the stick and seem to have blaming her!

From the conversation you had you know the child attends a private school and isn’t academically driven at this stage/age.
Early entry tests assessments are really not a good gauge of future educational success, especially those that test at age 4-7-8, most parents will agree that testing at 10-11 still isn’t a great indicator of how clever a child will be in later life.
So a child can easily be at a selective school and not absolutely brilliant years on or simply struggling with the more complex maths and writing requirements.
As time passes you will “learn more”.

one of my sons

• was not academic,
• did not enjoy studying,
• and there would have been no point getting a tutor.
• (English style) selective grammar schools would not have been on the table at all.
• but he also excelled at a private school that has entrance assessments
• and I would have referred to his school as a “regular school” if asked, although that’s seems an odd turn of phrase. (What is “regular”?)

Exactly which aspects of that came through in discussions with fellow parents at work would have depended entirely on the context of the conversation, what was on my mind at the time, common ground between me and the other parent, previous evenings dinner table discussions at home.

I would have been entirely truthful, but all of it is true (even though it seems contradictory to you) and I wouldn’t have thought to subject someone to a half hour monologue on the exact circumstances of my child’s education.