To tell the school my child will NOT go to detention..

[Nataliaa]

DD year 7 has been given a 30 minute detention tomorrow afternoon, after school. Since starting secondary, she has received 2 detentions- 1 for forgetting her PE shorts and 1 for not completing homework.
I fully supported the school and the consequences DD had to face on these 2 occasions. She did learn from each time and since then, she has always been organised with PE kit and completing homework.
DD is well behaved, works hard and all school reports have been brilliant so we have no concerns.

Back to today… it is 31 degrees and the school allowed blazers to be left at home, but still expected the children to be in their shirt, ties and trousers (the school recently banned skirts, and does not allow shorts so all children are in trousers. All year round)

During lunch break, DD loosened her tie and untucked her shirt as she was so hot and sweaty… and then forgot to tuck in her shirt and redo tie before going back in.
She walked into English and straight away the teacher told her to tuck the shirt in and do tie, which she did.
Then whilst sat down she untucked the shirt again… she then got up for something and the teacher noticed the shirt untucked and as she had already been told once, she was given the detention.
DD tried to explain she was just so hot and sweaty, she felt she couldn’t concentrate and loosening the shirt helped.. she was then told off for answering back.

I do not agree with this detention at all. Other local schools have let kids go in wearing PE kits in this heat. The teacher was not wearing shirt and tie- she was wearing a floaty and cool summer dress.
I can’t think for the life of me how an untucked shirt would affect DD’s education, and why it’s more important to stick to a strict dress code rather than doing whatever is comfortable in this heat!!

I have never been in the position to disagree with the school, and not sure what would happen if I refuse to let DD go to this detention… also not sure if that’s setting the wrong message to DD, as I always encourage following school rules!!

Any advice? Is this a hill worth dying on? What would you do?

Im interested in the phrasing of “her tone came across as rude”. No, her tone WAS rude and her behaviour WAS rude. This is not about interpretation; it’s about intention.

You weren't there.
You cannot possibly say with any certainty whether the child answered back or was giving a rational calm explanation.

To say that you know for certain she wasn't answering back is just playing ludicrous.

So you want kids who don't question authority ever?

My daughter's head master is constantly walking around the school. Any child can approach him and ask him anything. Certainly they can say "The school uniform is uncomfortably hot, could you consider changing it." He'd engage is a friendly way. He might even change his mind.

On the other hand if a kid breaks the rules and gives lip in a lesson they get a detention.

I'd suspect both those things are true in almost all English Schools.

Same applies in the workplace. You can likely tell your boss you don't like the dress code and he'll hear you out. If you break the policy and you're a dick to your boss you're probably not going to progress far.

No she wasnt there But you were..................apparently

I think the issue is not that she stood up for herself, it’s that she didn’t expressive herself in an appropriate manner. The right response would have been “sorry sir/miss, I’m just really really hot”. I don’t imagine she’d have got a detention if she’d “stood up for herself” in this way.

Yeah this. 100%.

Agreed! And I disagree that not being strict on uniform leads to disrespect. Children and teens know when rules are stupid. I’d find this stupid. And I’d argue that if they are going to be so rigid she has the right to explain herself.

Same. Completely agree about stupid petty uniform rules. They don't lead to respect at all. Would you respect a boss that had pointless shit rules that they expected you to follow that made no sense, had no business reason and made you really uncomfortable, whilst completely flouting those same rules themselves? I wouldn't. Id think that were a twat and I'd probably be looking for another job tbh. Kids don't have the luxury of just switching schools when they're up against this shit.

God I hope that teacher got caught up in traffic on the way home for a couple of hours and their aircon packed in. See how they cope

Yanbu. Ours said pe kits or normal white shirt with no tie or blazers with trousers or skirt. Most wore pe kit and this was pre planned and organised last week

Maybe not the authority to approve removal of the tie but certainly the relevant power to not issue a detention for such a stupid reason.

I am happy to challenge authority. However, before one decides to pull down a boundary one needs to understand why it is there.

I completely agree with you. I cannot stand how obsessive the secondary schools are about uniform. Had my sons school not allowed PE kits today I would have let him stay home.

Where did I say I knew for certain what happened?

You soind the type.

Boo hoo.

What type is that? Sounds sensible to me.

Blimey to the people saying she answered back - she was simply trying to explain she was too hot! Hardly kicking off about it or being rude.
It’s ridiculous to expect children to be able to concentrate in this heat, in hot stuffy classrooms, whilst wearing long trousers, tucked in shifts, and ties. I’m so glad they weren’t so strict about uniform when I was back in school.

Exactly. It's nuts, bordering on cruelty. Look at all the outrage about people walking their dogs in the heat but here we have loads of morons arguing that it's totally fine to expect kids to sit in a classroom, with no aircon in a heatwave dressed as though it's winter in Victorian times. WTAF is that about?
I don't know where this school is but I can tell you in London it was 33 degrees today. So id bet in a classroom with the sun shining in and all those bodies it was even higher than that.
What happens when a kid gets heat exhaustion or worse?

Kids don't have the luxury of just switching schools

To some degree they can.

A swap from a school with good discipline to a school with poor discipline should be pretty easy - very few parents aspire to a worse school with lesser classroom discipline so the OP should be able to take her pick and her daughter's place will be filled quickly with someone coming the other way.

I’d give my boss the finger if I was burning hot and forced to wear a tie and trousers today. Some people do not do well in heat - it makes me feel very unwell.

Why does nitpicking about uniform suggest the school has more "discipline"? I reckon a school that "has" to stoop to that level of nonsense is likely a school that's not able to get on top of the things that ACTUALLY matter. Like results, or bullying.

Does the school begin with M?

Totally right. And untucking it again.

OP of course you are sending the wrong message.

Translate this to the future. Let’s say for example your daughter becomes works in an office and is told the office dress code is business casual. She pushes it one day because it’s super hot and wears a tube top and flip flops. She is told she is in breach of the dress code and told to go home and change/. Her first thought may be, well it’s hot and I shouldn’t be punished and because it’s hot I can wear what I like. How do you think that ends up going?

Yeah I have over-exaggerated the point, but these things are preparing kids for later whether we agree with them or not.

All the comments about following rules, she should take it on the chin as she was rude as she disrespected a teacher etc..your kids are going to grow up to be absolute jobs worth sheeples who can't think for themselves and ignore their feelings whilst pandering to everyone else's because they were never taught to think outside of the box a little and question authority figures when they clearly are in the wrong, just like all of you.