To tell the school my child will NOT go to detention..

[Nataliaa]

DD year 7 has been given a 30 minute detention tomorrow afternoon, after school. Since starting secondary, she has received 2 detentions- 1 for forgetting her PE shorts and 1 for not completing homework.
I fully supported the school and the consequences DD had to face on these 2 occasions. She did learn from each time and since then, she has always been organised with PE kit and completing homework.
DD is well behaved, works hard and all school reports have been brilliant so we have no concerns.

Back to today… it is 31 degrees and the school allowed blazers to be left at home, but still expected the children to be in their shirt, ties and trousers (the school recently banned skirts, and does not allow shorts so all children are in trousers. All year round)

During lunch break, DD loosened her tie and untucked her shirt as she was so hot and sweaty… and then forgot to tuck in her shirt and redo tie before going back in.
She walked into English and straight away the teacher told her to tuck the shirt in and do tie, which she did.
Then whilst sat down she untucked the shirt again… she then got up for something and the teacher noticed the shirt untucked and as she had already been told once, she was given the detention.
DD tried to explain she was just so hot and sweaty, she felt she couldn’t concentrate and loosening the shirt helped.. she was then told off for answering back.

I do not agree with this detention at all. Other local schools have let kids go in wearing PE kits in this heat. The teacher was not wearing shirt and tie- she was wearing a floaty and cool summer dress.
I can’t think for the life of me how an untucked shirt would affect DD’s education, and why it’s more important to stick to a strict dress code rather than doing whatever is comfortable in this heat!!

I have never been in the position to disagree with the school, and not sure what would happen if I refuse to let DD go to this detention… also not sure if that’s setting the wrong message to DD, as I always encourage following school rules!!

Any advice? Is this a hill worth dying on? What would you do?

All the evidence is the other way.

Certainly in my area there are four state secondary schools and a couple of private schools and you could easily assess the quality of each school based on nothing more than the appearance of the kids. And the kids from the one in special measures stand out a mile. If you regard not being a "worker ant" and "standing up to authority" as virtues then that school is the one for you. They've locked down due to kids with knives twice this academic year, very few worker ants in that place.

It's exactly what the OP is looking for. I bet they don't have to tuck their shirts in there and I bet you don't get a detention the first time you give lip in a lesson.

I'm usually for school uniform and discipline, but to insist on tucking shirts in and wearing ties in this weather is just cruel and unhealthy. I'm not sure what I'd suggest about the detention but I definitely think this is a matter that should be taken up with the Head and maybe the governors. Could you get some medical evidence to help back you up? Are other parents concerned about this?

I definitely think this is a matter that should be taken up with the Head and maybe the governors

Yes, that would certainly be preferable to disobeying the rule twice in a lesson and giving a teacher lip.

So you expect that your DD should not have to obey rules while other children do obey them (regardless of whether you think the rule is petty or not) AND you make excuses for her answering back to a teacher. She is in the wrong and should do the detention. She needs to learn that actions have consequences.

today I wore loose culottes and a non sleeve top and strappy sandals to work which met the brief of business casual. I look presentable but dressed appropriately for the weather. Pretty much every other women was dressed the same. There was no way on earth I’d be wearing full length trousers plus a shirt today. I would have passed out on the tube. I don’t understand why we would set higher standards than expected in the workplace in this sort of weather.

We will get the school/heatstroke version of Awaabs Law

I'm a teacher and I agree with this. Talk to them, see their side and decide then. Encourage your DD and her friends to advocate for a cooler uniform on hot days.

But please, do not mention what the teacher was wearing in any part of the above conversations. They are not students, they have completely different roles in the school community, their dress code is not the same.

Don’t you think the teacher had better things to do than keep reminding multiple children to tuck their shirts in? To then have a kid argue the school rule whilst she’s trying to get on with teaching a lesson.
It’s important for students to follow the rules on the ‘minor’ stuff so the school has a handle on the bigger stuff.
I worked in a school where uniform rules were not enforced and the kids were practically feral. My current school on the other hand is very strict and we rarely have any major incidents of poor behaviour. You reep what you sow.
I wore a light blazer today by the way.

Another one.

I would support my daughter . Frankly I’m beginning to believe many schools in England are frequently run by bullies or ( charitably ) people without common sense or compassion.
it is unbearably , dangerously hot . Schools don’t have air con . No one would choose to wear a tie , tucked in shirt & black trousers in this weather & try and concentrate on studying. I bet the teachers are wearing airy comfortable clothes …

It was probably about 34 degrees in the classroom. It is 22.30 at night currently and my thermostat is reading 30 degrees in my bedroom. Whilst I don’t disagree in the grand scheme of things about strict uniform rules, you have to be some sort of cruel person to choose to enforce the rules in this heat. If I was the teacher I’d have been telling them to get themselves as comfortable as possible for the duration of my lesson just so they might have even a tiny chance of being able to concentrate.

Or maybe you should just send your so-precious little bubba to school to get an education instead of encouraging him
be a snowflake who takes a day off just because he might be a bit warm? 🙄 Parents like you are a big part of the problem.

Bollocks.

My kid is on the school council and willing to confidently say exactly what she thinks about school uniform in that forum. Also she's had a good relationship with her teachers and the head, and again could cheerfully tell them what she thinks of the uniform.

What she wouldn't do is break the rules twice in a lesson and give the teacher lip.

That doesn't make her a sheep, it means she understands how to effectively make her case, keep decision makers on side and maximise the chances of getting what she wants. Just as she'll need to do in the workplace.

33 fucking degrees and schoolchildren are being made to wear a purposeless additional piece of clothing which most adults don’t have to wear now.

When it cools down a bit why not send her in with a bowler hat and furled umbrella, it makes about as much sense.

What problem?

@DrfostersThe teachers are just doing their job. I couldn’t have all the kids sat there breaking uniform rules (or other rules like eating snacks or feet on the desk). I would get into trouble if SLT walked in and saw me allowing all the kids to do what they like.

YABU. If she showed attitude then yes she should get detention.

Again, no idea where you are based but in London where it is 35 degrees inside I assure you it is more than just a bit warm! I am impressed so many people think that is just a normal everyday temperature. I’ve been feeling so hot and miserable all day. I can’t handle the heat at all. Anything above 25 degrees and I melt. I had a fan on my desk blasting me full pelt. Am I literally the only one?

Please never forget your primary relationship is with your daughter . That’s the important one .
Sometimes , faced with illogical situations , such as the one you’ve described, our children need to know we have their backs and listen to them .
As a teacher I wouldn’t blame a normally well behaved student for being grumpy when so hot and uncomfortable .

Well honestly that’s on you watching your kids getting ill rather than standing up for them. Sorry but that’s awful

Deeply unpleasant attitude.

Errr it’s my job. Do you regularly go against your employer’s rules and regulations at work?

What problem?

Attendance, for starters:

At primary school, children who attend school nearly every day in Year 6 (95-100% attendance) are 30% more likely to reach the expected standard in reading, writing and maths compared to similar pupils who attend 90-95% of the time.
The link is even stronger at secondary school. Year 11 pupils with near-perfect attendance are almost twice as likely to achieve grade 5 in English and Maths GCSE, compared to similar pupils attending 90-95% of the time. In other words, missing just 10 extra days a year reduces the likelihood of achieving these grades by around 50%

We are talking about children. A few you genuinely saying that you would put a child’s health at risk from overheating and if you saw them get ill in class you would just literally say, tough it out, rules are rules? So yes, I would honestly in this situation not want to have a child getting sick on my watch. I’m honestly shocked quite frankly.

The OP states child has to wear tie and trousers . Far too hot for this weather