To tell the school my child will NOT go to detention..

[Nataliaa]

DD year 7 has been given a 30 minute detention tomorrow afternoon, after school. Since starting secondary, she has received 2 detentions- 1 for forgetting her PE shorts and 1 for not completing homework.
I fully supported the school and the consequences DD had to face on these 2 occasions. She did learn from each time and since then, she has always been organised with PE kit and completing homework.
DD is well behaved, works hard and all school reports have been brilliant so we have no concerns.

Back to today… it is 31 degrees and the school allowed blazers to be left at home, but still expected the children to be in their shirt, ties and trousers (the school recently banned skirts, and does not allow shorts so all children are in trousers. All year round)

During lunch break, DD loosened her tie and untucked her shirt as she was so hot and sweaty… and then forgot to tuck in her shirt and redo tie before going back in.
She walked into English and straight away the teacher told her to tuck the shirt in and do tie, which she did.
Then whilst sat down she untucked the shirt again… she then got up for something and the teacher noticed the shirt untucked and as she had already been told once, she was given the detention.
DD tried to explain she was just so hot and sweaty, she felt she couldn’t concentrate and loosening the shirt helped.. she was then told off for answering back.

I do not agree with this detention at all. Other local schools have let kids go in wearing PE kits in this heat. The teacher was not wearing shirt and tie- she was wearing a floaty and cool summer dress.
I can’t think for the life of me how an untucked shirt would affect DD’s education, and why it’s more important to stick to a strict dress code rather than doing whatever is comfortable in this heat!!

I have never been in the position to disagree with the school, and not sure what would happen if I refuse to let DD go to this detention… also not sure if that’s setting the wrong message to DD, as I always encourage following school rules!!

Any advice? Is this a hill worth dying on? What would you do?

Ime it’s rare to have a Year 7 defy and argue back.

If schools are going to impose stupid infirm rules they can deal with the consequences of that, which will be hot, irritable children and their hot, irritable parents.

Or, in the real world, the kids lucky enough to go to schools with zero tolerance can benefit from the consequences of well behaved ordered pupils ready to learn with the academic benefits that brings.

Hopefully the OP can find a school and allows answering back in class, and allows children to break a rule 5 minutes after she's been told not to. And that will free up a place at her school. I'm willing to bet the queue for places will be longer at the OPs school.

She'd absolutely be doing the detention and would be punished at home too if it were my DD.

She broke a uniform rule three times, defied a teacher's instruction to correct it and was rude when challenged.

The DC's school would have been harsher- it would have been two immediate detentions for the top button undone and shirt untucked at lunchtime.

Tbh this is why schools are so reluctant to relax uniform rules- they give an inch and DC take a mile. Blazers are still compulsory at the DC's school- individual teachers can give permission to remove if a room is very warm.

...and yet Scottish state school education is a train wreck whereas English Schools are better.

Agreed we look on aghast. Have you looked lately at how schoolgirls are dressed

No. Plenty of countries have no uniform at all, many have better educational outcomes than we do.

If teachers don’t want stupid disruption caused by stupid uniform rules on a boiling hot day, they know what to do.

Mine wouldn't be serving a detention for that and it is a hill I would die on.

Moronic.

I don’t see explaining you weren’t doing it to be defiant, you were doing it as the heat was unbearable, as answering back. She wasn’t being rude. She was explaining she was not trying to be rude. Other schools in other countries teach children intentionally to advocate for themselves. The last thing I want school to create in my child is someone who puts up and shuts up. Honestly.

I think in your shoes I probably would accept the detention but gather together health and safety information about maximum heat in workplaces, about how likely people are to concentrate if they are uncomfortably hot, and advocate on your child’s behalf, to the headteacher and after that the governors. With climate change, there my needs to be a complete rethink of summer uniform. My kid’s state school has one - shirt sleeved shirt, no tie, no blazer. It’s not hard.

It sounds like your DDs school are managing behaviour very closely. Whilst that's hard for her as she's learning the rules in y7, I'd just be glad it's a priority for school that discipline is in place. I'd assume that means she can concentrate in class because disruptive behaviour wouldn't be tolerated. That's such a rare thing now, I'd just go with it and not pick a fight with school over this.

This is one of the reasons I left teaching. Petty uniform rules whilst neglecting the important things.

I suspect what will happen if the DD misses the detention is that the teacher will pass it up the policy.

OP if you are intent on this happening you would be better, informing the teacher (saying something about how you know that they are just following the school's policy) and appealing to the head to get the subsequent detentions stopped and hopefully get them to change the policy during this heat.

And if climate change is being taught as part of the curriculum @Nataliaa id be pointing out the hypocrisy

Nobody dresses like this anymore. It's just about control and teaching the children to shut up and not question anything - so they can become good little worker ants for their masters later in life.

So you are okay with giving your DD the green light to ignore a teachers instruction and then answer back. Great.

Uniform rules are bullshit. But if you picked that school for your kid then you have to just suck it up. I much prefer the idea of no uniform. But I know that's quite uncommon in the UK.

They sound like they give detentions too easily. Also they need a Summer uniform.

Sorry. Post continued here.
They wear school uniform of a kind but personalised.Those legging things, skin tight, worn without knickers under a skirt so short that nothing is left to the imagination. They do wear a school blazer and tie but I doubt anyone notices because there is something horribly fascinating in seeing buttocks flopping and wobbling from side to side. Do they know what they look like? I can't think why their mothers let them out the door like that.
Don't curse the school uniform. Girls could be so much more badly dressed.

When I was a kid, boys in our school had to wear short trousers all year round until they went to junior school. Being extra cold in winter helped them learn better or some arbitrary batshit way of letting kids ‘earn the right’ to more comfort as they got older. Some schools/teachers get OTT about enforcing really stupid rules.

I would seriously consider moving school. Sounds more like army training college.

@LemonPresse not necessarily true for all schools but in vast swathes of the state sector year 7 are by far the most appallingly behaved. It’s a mixture of immaturity, a lack of aspiration, chronic babying, SEN issues and a lack of appropriate provision or of internal support to make a mainstream school appropriate. The truancy, swearing and wild behaviour of this year group leaves the world weary year 11 students united in their firm opinion that things are very worrying indeed.

I was about to say the same thing. We have uniforms here, but they are weather appropriate - as they should be. If you see a kid in summer wearing their winter uniform, or a blazer, it's because they've chosen to, not the school.

No it wasn't. The detention had already been given before her DD answered back.

OP, the reason for the detention is not right but really, is this something you really want to kick up a fuss about????

Sometimes things happen to us in life that we don't agree with, and it's just part of what happens. It's not going to kill her going to detention. It's nice for her to know you're in her court but honestly I'd just advise her to go and do it, and respect her teacher.

I'm a teacher and in all the years I've been teaching have never given a sanction for an untucked shirt while they are in my room working. In schools where its been policy I've always asked students to sort their shirts out before leaving my room and picked students up in the corridor. Persistent offenders or refusers would get a sanction. However, this teacher did make their expectations clear and your dd went against them and gave some backchat. If this was one of my kids I'd say ' Yep, it's a bit rubbish but you did have it untucked again and that's the consequence" and they would get over it and do the detention. My ds got a detention because his glue stick had run out, whilst I thought it was quite petty for a supply teacher to be checking under the glue lids I couldn't really argue as he had told me he needed a new one the week before, I had purchased new ones and he hadn't bbothered to pick one up. I feel like my kids are pretty resilient to be honest. As annoyed as you are, it might be best to teach your dd that sometimes people are picky and sometimes they aren't and she just needs to get on with it.