To ask if you refused to help with older relatives and how that went down?

[Fragmentedbrain]

I have 2 parents and 2 parents in law closing in on needing care. Reading other threads here it sounds as though this has a high chance of ruining my life over the next decade or so.

My husband and I work full time, love our jobs and don't have any caring responsibilities or instincts, not even a cat. I don't want to give up work or holidays or enjoying this bit of my life before I in turn am too old.

If we refuse to get involved beyond visits to say hello, how screwed are our parents?

(As we are child free I am not worried about any example setting although appreciate the relationship with siblings could get tricky)

Obviously not but I’d say the majority will have. I still don’t understand the hilarity.

But I was replying to a post that said everyone who retires abroad will have "retired from 40+ years of working and paying tax and NI contributions". I think it's a stupid thing to say.

Good post @LondonJax. Also something to remember is whilst your DPs are still in good health, they may say things like “ We won’t be a burden “ and “Just throw us in a home when we need it. You have POA and we can afford it”, they may not actually act like that when the time comes as the human desire for autotomy and to deny reality when it’s unpalatable , defies most other emotions.

I empathise, it sucks getting old and none of the options are particularly fun or pleasant. I am simply not prepared to sacrifice my life and pension prospects to prop up some misconception that the elderly person is independent and managing fine. Also with my DF, he is not a bad person and he is as good a DF as he was able to be, but spending lots of time with him or driving him ( he shouts at the traffic and makes me very anxious) would be difficult for my wellbeing.

So what do I do ? Well as much as I need to to feel that I am a decent human being ( “Let Them” by Mel Robbins is good on this topic) but not at the expense of my personal health or wealth. I don’t know what the future will bring, but I will try to retain my red lines as much as possible.

If you'd help an old lady cross the road, which i assume you would, then where's the harm in extending that kindness to people you're related to

No, it isn't low. Kids aren't responsible for their parents. If they want to help them out, great! Would you say it was 'low' for parents not to help their adult children with grandchildren?

Don't be disingenuous. Helping an old person across the road is a one off.

Live in care?

Exactly this. No one asks to be born, including the parents. I'm wondering if this person recognises the thousands of hours that parents put into raising a child and supporting them to adulthood so they can achieve this wonderful life.

Sorry did not mean to reply to that post

Some of us can.

My parents know firsthand what it’s like to care for elderly parents for years as does my sister who was in secondary at the time. I stepped in to give my parents a bit of breathing room for under a year because grandparents both passed within months of each other. It is not easy and there is a reason depression, anxiety, carer’s burnout is prevalent in such situations.

They told us that they will be sorting themselves because they don’t want to put that on us again and even more so that my sister and I have children.

I have an autistic child who will likely never be independent and two younger children, one being barely 2 and I live 4,000 miles away. I cannot move my entire family to help and my parents don’t want to move here and I also don’t want them moving in with me or my own mental health suffers. I know this for a fact. My sister is a 10 hour drive from them so they would likely move closer to her where my parents both have siblings if they needed to.

My father retired this year but still does jobs and my mother still works. My maternal grandparents died 13 years ago and both my sister and I have been out of their home for a decade. If they haven’t planned like they said they would, that is on them.

Its not disingenuous, its extending a hand of help to those who need it, as part of living in a society. Op is talking about not helping at all

I am ethnically Indian. I find this thread very odd. I do understand that not all families are the same. However these are the people that raised you, looked after you, funded you when you needed it and did their best for you at all times. You must surely make sure they are properly looked after? You might do this via carers or via working with social services but surely you would also be doing your best to be there for then for hospital appointments, to make sure they are eating well and that they are maintaining cleanliness? This is difficult for me to comprehend.

It’s not remotely stupid. Working and paying tax for 40 odd years is pretty standard. As is continuing to pay tax post retirement.

Unfortunately in the UK getting a dementia sufferer into a care home when they really start to need it is incredibly difficult unless they are self-funding.

For those without the neans to self-fund, it takes a catastrophic event and an initial hospital admission to even get in home care packages, which is "4 times a day" - in reality this can be under half an hour for each visit, only specific tasks undertaken, so 22 hours of potential disaster still on the table.

Add in that the sufferer may be deemed as still having capacity, and the right to make unwise decisions - like refusing care.

It takes several goes on this merry go round and the potential for bed-blocking for a care home to be considered.

ASC will often fight tooth and nail to keep people in their own homes, if that's their wish, regardless of safeguarding issues. And if the sufferer freezes family out, and there's no POA, family input can be wilfully disregarded regardless of motivation.

Ask me how I know.

Thank fuck for one normal , non phenomenally self absorbed poster on here.

I loved my parents, as they did me and my three siblings.. we WANTED to help them. Not everyone could do everything but we all muddled through.

Isn’t that what love is ? I feel a bit sad for you OP in your apparent care free world. To me it signifies you care about no one .

Depends which services they are accessing.

Access to the NHS is residence based i.e. you have to be resident in the UK to access it, and being 'ordinarily resident' is enough. Nothing to do with how many years NI they have paid in. Being 'ordinarily resident' means that you are here to stay, that the UK is where you live. So if they are moving back with the intention to stay for good they can access the NHS from day 1. If they just come back for a few months and plan to leave again, that's not the same and they should not be able to access the NHS. Having said that, most NHS services are not set up check the residence status of British people - just having the right accent and a local address is usually enough to get at least temporary registration with a GP. We've done it at my parents when we've been visiting with kids and they got sick - we were totally open with the receptionist that we didn't live in the UK, but she basically shrugged and said they don't have the systems to charge us for medical care - which is what should happen.

If they need social care (social workers, care assessments, carers, care home), that's the responsibility of the local authority where they live. I don't think there is any time requirement - once they are registered as living there, and paying local council taxes etc, they are eligible to use the services that local authority provides for its taxpayers. So yes, they will be treated as any other local resident in this respect.

Op, I said this before, you don't have to be 'hands on' but you can organise care for your relatives. That's the least you can do. Make sure they have good, kind, reliable care in their home. Try to see it as a project.

However you are worrying before it's necessary, they may not need it, not everyone does.

I wonder if your husband feels the same as you do. Also what would either of you do if the other was in need of care, you or he could fall ill and need looking after.

Why?

Yep, welcome to late stage Capitalism in the Western world, it ain't pretty.

You need to be ordinarily resident or pass the habitual residency test - they are different. It doesn’t matter if you have fully paid up NI and pension contributions.

I agree with you 100%, Cycle.

I was never asked but it was expected. I didn’t do it. My relative had plenty of money to pay for care but refused to consider it. They wanted me to move near to them and devote my middle years to them. I was not prepared to do that.

Lets not pretend that the alternative is much better - usually women pushed into a life of domestic drudgery and mostly women taking on all caring responsibilities whether they want to or not.

I feel the same.

You hate ‘all that stuff’ - but what stuff? Taking someone to an appointment is very different to giving them a bath.

It sounds like you don’t want to help them with anything, ever. Is that right? If so, I hope you’re ok with nobody ever doing you a favour or helping you out with anything.

Sounds like a lonely way to live.

And if my dc had that sort of attitude to me, I’d think I’d failed in bringing them up.

Taking someone to a chiropodist appointment is the kind of thing you’d do for a friend. It’s hardly a life commitment.

i think if you tell your parents that’s how you feel, prepare for them to be hurt, upset, maybe angry.

My mum died last year. After she died, I was able to think, well, I did x and y for her, I took her here and there, to medical appointments, to days in hospital, for blood transfusions, to the hairdresser. And I did all those things because I loved her and Dad, and wanted to help them in any way I could and make their lives easier.

Nobody is saying that you have to be a martyr and look after your parents 24/7, but I think that what you’re suggesting is pretty unusual. And selfish.

Good point.