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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to eat ice cream everyday and refuse to offer to DD

254 replies

olafandme · 21/06/2025 11:35

Yesterday I picked 7 yo DD up from school. It was a hot day and unusually it’s just us 2, no DS. I cheerily suggest we stop and get an ice cream on the walk home. To which she shouts at me “NO! I HATE ICE CREAM” (she loves ice cream and and eats them often)
to this I said “or an ice lolly or a cold drink, something cool” she screams that I don’t know her at all because she HATES COLD THINGS and runs away from me dramatically. Proceeds to walk 5 steps behind me entire way home. I stop off and buy myself an ice cream just to prove a point.
This type of thing happens often. For example few days or so ago it was torrential rain and i brought her umbrella to pick up. She screamed at me in front of whole playground because she did not want it (I was holding it - folded down and was not trying to make her hold it). That’s just this week.
I have spoken to her calmly and length about, 1) not shouting at me and also 2) about seeing the intent behind what someone is doing. Asking yourself is the person trying to do something nice or something nasty - if it’s nice try to recognise that and something along the lines of “no thank you” is what you say.
I’d say we have this talk once a week. anyway.
The ice cream incident must have tipped me over the edge. Because talking isn’t getting through to her. My plan is to not offer her ice cream for the time being at least. Anytime we have ice cream / ice lolly, she will not be having one. I think I could do a year or the summer at least. Maybe I’d reconsider after a change in behaviour and a sincere apology.
I tried this last night (same day as the incident) and did not offer her one and made one for everyone else. Despite me asking him not to - DH offered her one.
am i a psycho for thinking like this?
AIBU?

OP posts:
C8H10N4O2 · 21/06/2025 14:10

olafandme · 21/06/2025 13:20

She did apologise to the poor granny yes 😅.
Thats a good compromise- makes the point without going nuclear.
We have spoken so many times at length about these things (for years) but it doesn’t seem to be helping.
its funny because she definitely understands the whole manners thing -at Christmas she got a really terrible present (ideal for a 2 year old but not for a 7 year old girl) and she was very polite and said thanks so much etc. she waited till we had left to say she would give it to our toddler neighbour. She does know how to be polite - I think it’s mostly the after school thing.
And also (not directed at the person I’m replying to) I do understand the whole thing of parents being the “safe space” but at the same time we are human beings who shouldn’t tolerate being screamed at.

I agree with this approach - take any drama out of it, just as you would with a much younger child. "Safe space" does not mean being a verbal punch bag.

She will, as my DM would have said, cut off her nose to spite her face a few times when she misses out on the ice cream etc, but if there is no strong reaction from you then the behaviour should tail off.

Is this a recent change?

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:10

FlyingUnicornWings · 21/06/2025 13:50

And then the kid gets angrier, then the parent escalates their anger, then the child screams more, then the adult…etc etc etc. You can’t meet anger with anger, kids need to learn that too or they won’t have good conflict management skills as an adult.

As an adult, it’s your job to be regulated, not emotional. Calmly do what needs to be done to bring the child back to baseline, then you educate. Kids don’t learn diddly squat while highly emotional. They need to be calm.

Having said that, my response would be a very firm “it’s not okay to speak to me like that, we will talk about your behaviour when you’ve calmed down”. Then ignore until they’re calm. I most certainly wouldn’t put up with that behaviour, but I wouldn’t be angry with my child for being emotional. Emotions are fine, it’s how we express/deal with them that’s important and they’ll learn by modelling our behaviour. So calm but firm all the way, for me.

But the kid wasn't meeting anger with anger they met a perfectly reasonable question with anger. So they need to learn not to do that. Reacting badly to being shouted and screamed at is not a bad thing, it's how they learn that their behaviour and words affect others.

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:12

BertieBotts · 21/06/2025 13:47

It is unlikely to, because the kind of outbursts the OP described do not come from a place of logic, they come from a place of emotion.

It is highly likely that the child will not even remember what they said later on let alone be able to connect it with behaviour which is happening when they are in a highly emotional, oppositional/reactive state (at which point it is difficult for them to control an impulse anyway). The punishment is too far away and it only feels like it is related to the behaviour. It is not really, because the behaviour which is a problem is not a child saying that she doesn't like ice cream. That would be perfectly fine. The problem is the shouting and general being oppositional.

If you want to deal with it in a behaviourist way then you still have to look at the whole situation. It's a predictable scenario meaning there is something triggering the behaviour (antecedent) - it seems to be that after a full day of school, being offered something or presented with a decision or something unexpected is the trigger for the behaviour.

Then the behaviour itself is shouting/screaming/rude tone/opposition - the exact form of words that she takes is irrelevant because it's clear that it's a knee jerk rejection of anything at all even if it's something she would usually like.

It's most likely that the current consequence (what the child gets out of the behaviour) is venting her feelings, attention/reaction (even negative) from adults, feeling powerful by exerting her own will.

To change the behaviour in a behaviourist approach you would try to reduce any reward that the adult can control e.g. attention, by ignoring or reacting neutrally to the behaviour, and then offering more attention/reaction when she is talking in a calmer way, or you could add some kind of external consequence e.g. losing a small part of a privilege for the behaviour you're trying to reduce, or gaining a sticker on a reward chart or other small reward for a successful trip home without shouting.

If the behaviour is not changing, rather than adjust the reward or punishment, it's more effective to reduce the gap between what's currently happening and what you want, so for example rather than a fully calm walk home being the goal, you focus on only one aspect e.g. name calling or swearing. Then once that is established you can focus on volume and once volume is reduced you can work on tone.

For a more rounded (not purely behavioural) approach I think it does help also to look a bit more in depth and consider if it's a possible sign the child is struggling, especially considering she is usually fine by the time they get home and it's predictably happening after school. That indicates to me it's a stress behaviour and so personally I would not go purely behavioural but if I was going behavioural, it would be very small steps and very mild consequences, while also trying to work at separate times on increasing skills (e.g. emotional regulation) and seeing if there are stressors in the environment which can be reduced (fewer demands on way home, possibly looking at support in school and/or skills they need for school).

You said why be kind to someone who is acting this way - because it's important for adults to model the behaviour that they want children to emulate, and we should all be kind. When a child is screaming and shouting and threatening, screaming and shouting and threatening back at them just legitimises their behaviour because they see an adult doing it and internalise the message that it is OK. You might "win" if you are engaging in a power struggle because adults can easily overpower children and most children are aware of this and will react to it by complying, though I do think this does damage to your relationship. Not necessarily insurmountable, and if there is enough warmth to balance it out and the child can generally meet the expectations of adults around them, that kind of parenting is what many people do (not necessarily with shouting!) and it doesn't cause any major problems.

But some children are operating under very high stress loads to begin with, and/or there is a much larger gap between their current skills and adult behavioural expectations, so they experience a lot of power struggles most of which they lose. Power struggles are stressful. Stress behaviours are (unsurprisingly) likely to get worse if you increase the child's stress level. For a behavioural expectation that the child is struggling to meet, a power struggle is not going to help anyway so it's counterproductive or could easily become too extreme on the adult's level. Being kind is one way to recognise that this is a stress behaviour and immediately reduce the stress in the environment, which can help in turn with the behaviour, which you can work on the underlying reasons for outside of the moment.

When someone is shouting and screaming at you I don't think you should be expected to be kind to them, I'm not saying you have to scream and shout back because obviously they're a child but if you're teaching them that they can shout and scream and be met with kindness I don't think that's a good lesson, or in any way realistic.

The words also aren't irrelevant in my opinion.

Iwontlethtesungodownonme · 21/06/2025 14:13

Ok, I'm out. Was trying to be helpful and I'm being ridiculed.
I have a neuro diverse son who found the transition between school and home difficult. Keeping it very low key helped him.

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:14

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:12

When someone is shouting and screaming at you I don't think you should be expected to be kind to them, I'm not saying you have to scream and shout back because obviously they're a child but if you're teaching them that they can shout and scream and be met with kindness I don't think that's a good lesson, or in any way realistic.

The words also aren't irrelevant in my opinion.

Also, to add, not allowing ice cream doesn't have to be in anger, op could be perfectly calm and matter of fact about it.

IAmNeverThePerson · 21/06/2025 14:15

when you pick her up from school don’t ask her anything, talk to her or make eye contact. Just get her and go.

She clearly needs a few moments to decompress and has formed a habit of yelling at you to do so. Give her no ins to shrieking.

given she is generally well behaved and polite she will probably hate that she’s lost it as much as you do and it is just escalating.

Sirzy · 21/06/2025 14:17

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 13:36

But again what is that actually teaching her? That she's fine to ask for something after school but if her mum dares to offer something she's fine to completely fly off the handle?

It’s teaching her that at a time you know someone finds stressful it’s good to respect their boundaries.

the child is making it perfectly clear this is a time she struggles with so it’s reasonable for the adults to make very simple adjustments to avoid the trigger point.

BertieBotts · 21/06/2025 14:19

olafandme · 21/06/2025 12:44

It’s jokey in a way. Mostly- I am exasperated.
But I don’t think it’s “roundabout” to not offer ice cream to someone who has screamed at you that that hate ice cream in response to being offered it. It’s literally what she asked for.

Sorry, only just noticed this quoted response.

I get the exasperation - my DS (nearly 7) is similar. He is diagnosed with ADHD. I do not think this is typical after school pick up behaviour. I don't think ADHD is the only explanation, just mentioning that because that's one factor in our case. We got a diagnosis fairly early because we have family history and because he's generally struggled in childcare/education since he was 2. Sometimes the stress behaviours came out in the setting and sometimes they just come out at home. But he is a much clearer case than my older son, who only displayed stress behaviours at home. I am explaining this because with both DS1 and DS2 I posted a lot about their behaviour on MN and would frequently receive these confusing split responses where half of the posters would say oh it's normal, he'll grow out of it, he's just tired from school etc. And others would suggest it was caused by being too soft and we should convert to some kind of boot camp - it was odd.

Anyway, I think it's important to give the context that it's not typical behaviour, because especially with DS1 I thought maybe his behaviour was typical for much longer than I should have. He was my first, had no close age siblings and I had nothing to compare to.

The reason I say it is roundabout is because the behaviour is not refusing ice cream. The behaviour is shouting and knee-jerk refusal of things and it is incidental what she is refusing. It sounds very impulsive and probably not something she is able to logically think through otherwise she would probably be biting your arm off for ice cream.

If you were to take the "look at the cause" approach you probably wouldn't be looking at what caused her to no longer like ice cream, because you are aware that she does actually like ice cream. You would probably look at what caused her to be so shouty and oppositional. And so I think if you're taking a behaviourist response, that is what you ought to target too. I wrote a longer comment replying to someone else with a more detailed explanation.

LancashireButterPie · 21/06/2025 14:23

If she is ND and I'm not saying that she is, she may have been struggling with sensory issues all day (esp in the heat). She may have been masking all day (because that's what society expects people to do, just "fit in").
Coming out to you and then having to start communicating, fitting in with your plans, waiting around for an ice cream......is just the straw that broke the camels back sometimes.

My ND daughter (who also has demand avoidance) used to just do a thumbs up or down coming out of school and was sometimes too burned out to speak until she had an hour in her quiet room, playing her piano to decompress.

It's not personal.

Northerngirl821 · 21/06/2025 14:25

Her behaviour needs work but “punishing” her by withholding ice cream later in the day is not the way to do it. The consequence needs to follow the behaviour and she needs to he given the opportunity to rectify things.

SENNeeds2 · 21/06/2025 14:26

“ Anytime we have ice cream / ice lolly, she will not be having one. I think I could do a year or the summer at least.?”
Rather over the top and dramatic? A bit like how she behaves?

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:27

Sirzy · 21/06/2025 14:17

It’s teaching her that at a time you know someone finds stressful it’s good to respect their boundaries.

the child is making it perfectly clear this is a time she struggles with so it’s reasonable for the adults to make very simple adjustments to avoid the trigger point.

And there is a way to assert your boundaries and shouting/screaming at someone is not it.

Sahara123 · 21/06/2025 14:28

UniversalTruth · 21/06/2025 14:02

Not smiling at pick up is among the very easy parts of parenting an ND child. I'm glad this thread has shone light on some of these things.

ETA: not sure that makes sense. Not smiling is easy compared with the million of other things we have to do to eg. keep ds in school.

Edited

My child has learning and physical disabilities, I get it. Apologies if I hadn’t quite understood your scenario.

LancashireButterPie · 21/06/2025 14:28

OP have a look at Dr Naomi Fisher's podcasts. She is brilliant at looking at the reasons behind behaviour and using strategies to prevent issues arising in the first place.
If your DD does have a degree of neurodiversity then punishment and sanctions is not the answer. Learning coping mechanisms is the way ahead.

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:29

Northerngirl821 · 21/06/2025 14:25

Her behaviour needs work but “punishing” her by withholding ice cream later in the day is not the way to do it. The consequence needs to follow the behaviour and she needs to he given the opportunity to rectify things.

That consequence is literally following the behaviour 🤦 she's not 2, she's not going to have forgotten what happened within a couple of hours.

RichHolidayPoorHoliday · 21/06/2025 14:30

UniversalTruth · 21/06/2025 13:59

@RichHolidayPoorHoliday I invite you to find out about the neurodivergent experience of society and how being forced to learn to behave in a way that is only acceptable to neurotypical people leads to burnout, being out of work, not coping.

To answer your question, many many people are not coping as a direct result of being expected to behave like you suggest.

Why does not making eye contact equate to not being invited for play dates with your children?

Why does not making eye contact equate to not being invited for play dates with your children?
It's not the making eye contact as such, it's having a very careful behaviour so different and that you can't reasonably expect from anyone else. It's encouraging your child to expect what is not reasonable.
Other parents won't do it, which means your child won't be picked up by someone else.

she screams that I don’t know her at all because she HATES COLD THINGS and runs away from me dramatically. Proceeds to walk 5 steps behind me entire way home.
We've all done school runs. Is it not fair to say that children who are seen behaving like this don't tend to get invited by other parents?

I am not attacking you, I am just pointing out that parents are already dealing with their own, they generally don't have the energy or will to spend time and efforts on other kids for a playdate.

Okiedokie123 · 21/06/2025 14:30

To me she sounds tired and overwhelmed after a full day at school. So rather than help her deal with her emotions. Your plan is to torment her instead. Great way to ruin the bond between you.

Sirzy · 21/06/2025 14:31

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:27

And there is a way to assert your boundaries and shouting/screaming at someone is not it.

And she will learn that but the moment she is a 7 year old and she doesn’t have all those skills yet when stressed. That’s why her mum needs to respect the boundaries so she can learn as she matures.

you are expecting a 7 year old to change the behaviour when in this case it’s the parent who is pushing the child when she knows it causes issues.

GFBurger · 21/06/2025 14:36

Iwontlethtesungodownonme · 21/06/2025 14:13

Ok, I'm out. Was trying to be helpful and I'm being ridiculed.
I have a neuro diverse son who found the transition between school and home difficult. Keeping it very low key helped him.

I get it totally… I was agreeing with you.

I do find it funny that I sometimes can’t even smile at my daughter, because that implies I want her to react in a certain way!

But only funny internally of course. 😆

I just offered lunch with a ‘I was thinking it might be lunchtime’ and had to laugh (internally) at how that’s normal now.

You just don’t know til you know.

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:36

Sirzy · 21/06/2025 14:31

And she will learn that but the moment she is a 7 year old and she doesn’t have all those skills yet when stressed. That’s why her mum needs to respect the boundaries so she can learn as she matures.

you are expecting a 7 year old to change the behaviour when in this case it’s the parent who is pushing the child when she knows it causes issues.

I'm sorry but offering your child an ice cream is not pushing them. And she will learn a whole lot quicker if she's actually shown consequences to her actions. There are lots of abusive adults out there who go around treating their "loved ones" like absolute shite because their parents never actually taught them how their words/actions affected others and just allowed this kind of behaviour to continue and excused it with reasons like "they are hot/tired/don't like to be asked things"

LancashireButterPie · 21/06/2025 14:37

RichHolidayPoorHoliday · 21/06/2025 14:30

Why does not making eye contact equate to not being invited for play dates with your children?
It's not the making eye contact as such, it's having a very careful behaviour so different and that you can't reasonably expect from anyone else. It's encouraging your child to expect what is not reasonable.
Other parents won't do it, which means your child won't be picked up by someone else.

she screams that I don’t know her at all because she HATES COLD THINGS and runs away from me dramatically. Proceeds to walk 5 steps behind me entire way home.
We've all done school runs. Is it not fair to say that children who are seen behaving like this don't tend to get invited by other parents?

I am not attacking you, I am just pointing out that parents are already dealing with their own, they generally don't have the energy or will to spend time and efforts on other kids for a playdate.

Oh Dear.
Why do play dates matter so much to you?
A lot of DC (especially those with ASD) couldn't give a flying monkeys about playdates. They'd rather be engrossed in their hobbies.
Did you know that eye contact is actually painful for some people? It's not something that should be forced.
Heaven forbid a child isn't popular.

Sirzy · 21/06/2025 14:40

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:36

I'm sorry but offering your child an ice cream is not pushing them. And she will learn a whole lot quicker if she's actually shown consequences to her actions. There are lots of abusive adults out there who go around treating their "loved ones" like absolute shite because their parents never actually taught them how their words/actions affected others and just allowed this kind of behaviour to continue and excused it with reasons like "they are hot/tired/don't like to be asked things"

Edited

If you know you child can’t cope with things like that after school then it is pushing them unnecessarily. It doesn’t matter what the offer is if you know your child can’t process it in that moment.

you can teach them when they aren’t in a state of distress. The OP has already said the vast majority of the time she is lovely and able to cope a lot better so the OP needs to address her own expectations for this short part of every day.

DeffoNeedANameChange · 21/06/2025 14:40

Yes it's a totally psycho thing to do. But also, I have that same 7yo and have often had those same thoughts (to be fair, I think my own mum might say that she also had that same 7yo 35 years ago....)

Dramatic · 21/06/2025 14:41

Sirzy · 21/06/2025 14:40

If you know you child can’t cope with things like that after school then it is pushing them unnecessarily. It doesn’t matter what the offer is if you know your child can’t process it in that moment.

you can teach them when they aren’t in a state of distress. The OP has already said the vast majority of the time she is lovely and able to cope a lot better so the OP needs to address her own expectations for this short part of every day.

Ok well I think we'll have to agree to disagree on that.

OhSolero · 21/06/2025 14:42

Tell your dd the as she was very clear she doesn't like ice cream, you won't be offering her any but if she ever would like one, she can ask for it. To keep asking if she wants and ice cream would be weird, like you didn't listen to her at all, she said she doesn't like cold things.

But in my opinion, there must be more behind your dds behaviour, do you have a blended family, new step dad, siblings or any radical changes in your family life? Because the way your dd is acting up isn't typical of a child who is feeling safe and happy. Or of course, there could be SEN.