on the tube recently people were giving up seats for a mother and a grandfather who in turn let the children sit

[EleanorReally]

surely the kids could have stood, or sat on their laps

i think this is a common scenario now but didnt used to be

DS8 has gone flying on the tube more than once - he’s too short to hold onto the overhead straps, and if he is in the aisle he usually ends up falling into somebody’s lap (even if he is holding onto a pole - the momentum spins him round it). He’s also exactly tall enough for everyone’s backpacks to hit him in the face when they turn around, and that has knocked him off his feet before (he is 130cm tall and weighs 25kg, so easily knocked over). Whereas I’m fine to stand.

I’d give DM (75) a seat over DS, but give DS a seat over myself. When DS was under 5, I’d have prioritised him.

I don’t have a car. So your assumption is wrong. We go by bike a lot. It depends on the line and what type of public transport so I’ll make the judgment on what’s safer thanks.

I’m a Londoner. My 15 year old is a Londoner. We’ve both stood on public transport throughout our lives. It’s not hard for either a 5 year old or a 10 year old (both ages mentioned on this thread).

Older people should always be allowed a seat over kids unless there’s a disability in play. Kids fall over all the time, or do parents who don’t like their kids standing never take them to a playground.

Not on a train but I remember the first time I slipped down the stairs at a station in my 40s (it’s happened a few times to me since) and it’s a really horrible sensation not just of the falling but “oh God, am I now starting to ‘have falls’?” I was really shaken up, physically and mentally. DD just picks herself up and dusts herself off, which is what I used to do.

And children being tired after a jolly day out is nothing to the bone-crushing tiredness after a day at work.

Intrresting, this is somrthing I thought was always the case. What time scale are you thinking?

Lots of things used to be considered good manners which are outdated.

See also men who get flustered about a woman holding a door open for them.

It’s all based on outdated norms about hierarchy and social worth.

There’s just no good reason that a child should give up their seat for an adult simply because they are adults. They have just as much right to a seat as anyone else.

Nope, don’t own a car. And live in London, so we’re on public transport every day.

It’s crowds and access to something to hold on to. In a half-empty carriage, there’s no issue. In rush hour, an adult should be able to reach a pole or strap, and will be visible to people pushing to get on or off. A five year old won’t be, and risks getting flattened.

On busy trains, I sit DS in the luggage rack (the vertical one near the doors, not the overhead one!). He loves it, and we aren’t taking up a seat.

On Tuesday in London I was on the circle line heading east, it was after work, rush hour so tube is packed. I was sitting, had my headphones on and my eyes are closed but suddenly feel someone really close to me. Opened my eyes to see a woman pushing a boy (about 8 years) down to sit but there weren’t any seats free so she pushing this kid to to squeeze in between me and the man next to me! I was too stunned to speak then the guy next me got up - he didn’t have a choice really unless he wanted a strange child on his lap.

Good point re backpacks, now you come to mention it. I’d give a kid my seat rather than see them whacked in the face by one.

Surely in that situation you hold onto a pole or strap and he holds onto you. That’s how we always did it.

And he doesn’t risk getting flattened, such hyperbole. He might risk someone pushing past him. Not the end of the world and something to get used to if you’re travelling on packed trains.

This definitely isn't new, I remember my grandparents putting the dc in seats and standing themselves and that was....a very long time ago! 😅

I rarely use public transport now (rural) but would likely prioritise my dc sitting over me, despite having a condition that makes it hard to stand in those conditions- im tall enough to use grab handles, I can anticipate corners and braking etc better than they can, and importantly, I'm tall enough that other adults standing will see me, whereas shorter dc likely to be jostled, knocked over etc (and hit in the face by backpacks!)

Not on the tube, but on the bus when DC was about 2. We were in the Lake District and had been pootling about in Buttermere. It's a tiny bus back into Keswick but over Whinlatter Pass. No one gave us a seat. The wee boy stood leaning on my leg with me holding onto him as best I could. He fell asleep standing up. We got off at the forest park stop and waited for the next bus.

Well, they don’t in a number of ways. Firstly they’re not paying the same price as adults (and in London they’re not paying at all). And secondly the impact of a child getting a little pushed about or even falling on a train or bus isn’t as severe as someone older and certainly someone elderly. Different centre of gravity, more likely to bounce rather than break etc.

I mean, those of us who grew up expected to give up our seats didn’t spend our childhoods in traction as a result, which is what some people seem to think would happen if their DC had to do that nowadays.

I think you do neither yourself nor your children a service in being such a martyr.

Well thank goodness things have changed then! The average adult is definitely more able to stand on a tube than a young child who can't reach the handles and is below eyeline so WAY more likely to get squashed or knocked over by adults who don't see them. Selfish adults who think young children should stand up and give them a seat need to rethink their entitlement!

I would give my seat ( on a journey of less than half an hour) to an elderly person or someone with visible mobility issues. Not so much a child.

They can sit on laps or if they're bigger just hold on while standing close to their parents.

I guess I have non visible disabilities and struggle to stand comfortably for more than five minutes, so I'm more attuned to looking at those who might be similar, though obviously you can't often tell.

It wouldn't occur to me to give up my seat for a child. I get panicky on the tube and if it's crowded I would struggle standing - sitting isn't great but I feel as though I have my own space. I would and have given up my seat on public transport for an elderly person but spent the rest of the journey panicking.

Much much safer for younger children to be seated. If we go to all the faff and effort of putting them in car seats, why shouldn't we make travelling on public transport as safe as we can?

Teenagers should be made to stand for adults all day long imo! 😉

I don't dispute that, I was just pointing out, in response to someone who thought this wasn't new that, to me, it IS new. Of course, new is relative. It probably isn't new to someone in their 20s, IYSWIM

another journey there was a family have great fun surfing on the tube, kids enjoyed it a lot

If you were to judge it based on who pays you’d have disabled snd elderly people standing so that’s clearly a nonsense argument.

And healthy adults are not routinely tumbling over like skittles on tubes snd buses. In my thousands of journeys on busy tubes and buses I think I’ve witnessed an adult fall over once and that was tripping over luggage. Young kids on the other hand are wobbling about all over the place. And as for the argument that children simply ‘bounce’ - visit the average school vs the average workplace snd see count how many limbs are in plaster.

The obvious etiquette is that someone more able to stand makes way for people who are less able to stand, regardless of age. Everyone else of equal ability has equal right to sit down.

Healthy kids aren't routinely tumbling over, either. I, too, use public transport a lot and haven't once seen it happen.

Would still rather a child (under 10) sit down than a healthy adult. Balance skills and strength to hold on aren’t quite there.

The reasoning behind who gets free passes is not the same.

I must say in all my years of using public transport I’ve never noticed adults running around, swinging off the poles etc as I often see these apparently wobbly children who absolutely need a seat do.

But plenty of us have seen it happen…

YABU, kids are not second class citizens and it’s often safer for them to sit rather than get flung around. Honestly I think some people see them as vermin.