Death in nursing home - is this normal - a bit shocked.

[MistressoftheDarkSide]

I'm posting here because I have no-one I can really contact at this time of night.

My MIL has been on palliative care for the last couple of weeks - end stage dementia and possible bowel cancer which wasn't investigated fully after long conversations with her GP. She stopped recognising anyone over 5 years ago. I saw her on Tuesday and it was heartbreaking.

I had a call just after midnight to say she had passed away, and basically the nurse who called immediately asked me to arrange for her to be removed immediately. I am two hours away and my father died in the middle of April, so I am in the middle of organising his funeral. I had mentioned at a meeting with tge funeral director on Tuesday afternoon that my MIL would likely be their next customer but hadn't formally engaged them in respect of her because from experience of several deathbeds one can never be sure how long these things will take and it felt disrespectful. To be frank I'm struggling emotionally with losing my Dad and my MIL became my sole responsibility when my DP died three years ago.

I'm posting because I'm so taken aback by the almost indecent haste of all this. The nurse said she had passed literally ten minutes before they called me.

Nobody explained to me any sort of procedure when I was there on Tuesday. I was asked if anything was in place and said I would make arrangements, but nobody said that if she passed in the night I would be expected to organise everything then and there. They were most insistent that they couldn't keep her till morning even.

Fortunately the funeral directors have a 24 hour line so the nursing home contacted them, but because they are out if area it's all being done through another firm in the interim until all paperwork is completed.

I don't want to over react if this is standard procedure and this is all my fault, so has anyone else had a similar experience? I was left feeling as though I've just done everything wrong, and I'm in bits to be honest. I can't contact anyone for support till the morning, so if anyone can talk me down I'd be really grateful.

It's usual for them to want the body taken away fairly swiftly. That's why the undertaker has a 24 hour call and someone's on duty all the time. They take it in turns to be on call.

I'm sorry for your loss and how impolite their request may have felt.

they don’t have facilities that they do in hospitals and funeral homes to preserve bodies

considering how much they charge - it's a poor show they don't have something in place

im so sorry that you are going through this and certainly they haven't seemed to have much compassion for you at the nursing home

My MIL died in our home, we were caring for her, at about 10.25 am. The local nurse called to confirm, she was 99 and on end if life, contacted undertakers whi came and took her away within a couple of hours. My son works in a care home, and obviously, patients dying is a regular occurance,, and can become routine. We were driving to see my mum in a care home and she died while we were on our way. By the time we got there about an hour later, she had been moved to90s the funeral directors. In both cases they were in their 90s so no shock, all expected. I feel for your loss, we lost both of our last parents within a few months of each other, so know how you must be feeling, but you have to try to be practical, sort out the arrangements and grieve when you are able. I was surprised that I wasn't that upset at the time, but 3 years later little things bring back memories. I like getting upset at random times when I hear a certain record, or smell or hear something. The memories are with you for ever.

I haven’t worked in care for a few years but I was the manager of a care home for over 12 years. We never said that to relatives, we’d ask if they wanted us to make the arrangements and the room could be cleared when they were ready to do so. I’m shocked reading this post that it seems to be the norm.

How to announce that you get a kick out of kicking someone who is already down from the safety of the Internet.
How sad and shameful.
OP please ignore this spiteful reply....

@MistressoftheDarkSide oh my God, I am so sorry. I know what you've been through and I can't believe that they've added to it in this way.

Maybe it is normal, I don't know. I think it's more likely to be a sign of the times if you know what I mean.

Is there someone who can make the calls for you? Don't be nervous of asking people - I'd do this for a friend. Or someone who can take any administrative burden off you.

I've worked in a (dementia) nursing home for almost 7 years now. Obviously a lot of residents have passed during my time there. Not once have I ever come across what you have experienced, I am so sorry for your losses and also having this extra stress on top. For example say a resident passes at 2am, they could still be with us until 9/10am or later the next morning depending on if family wish to visit etc.
I would definitely take this further when you feel able to.
Love to you and your family

Hope you're OK OP? You've been through a lot lately, be kind to yourself 💐

If you're going to try and be a insensitive, smug smartarse, at least get it right:

OP wrote " was asked if anything was in place and said I would make arrangements"

I agree, I just cannot understand the mentality of reading a post like this, and thinking, I know, I’ll be snarky about exactly how they should’ve gone about it.

It sounds like you have been through, and are going through, so much op. I’m so sorry. Sending hugs. No wonder you are in pieces! Please look after yourself x

When my dad died in a nursing home seven years ago, my mum and brother went to see him straight away through choice. There had been previous discussions about his end of life care and death plans, I think that the home actually contacted our Funeral director on our behalf. We collected Dad's things the next day as we felt we had to be doing something. They hadn't asked to so this quickly. This was a Bupa home by the way and was always well run from our experience.

Im so sorry you've lost so many people in such a short space of time. Please accept my condolences. Are you in the UK? Basically no that's not the proper protocol and the nursing home should know better, they should know the protocol and rules and have some compation.

The rules are, if someone dies, yes she was expected to pass, a Dr or trained medical profession has to certify life extinct (this is the correct terminology), it's rare anyone in a nursing or care home have that training so they, not you, should have called ooh GP or paramedics, once they've done this and checked the body, something else they have to do, their control room will organise duty undertakers to collect. Also, if her own GP wasn't available to confirm they're able to provide a death certificate police have to attend to complete a sudden death form. This form goes to the coroner for the coroners officers to contact her GP and hopefully arrange the GP to provide the death certificate. The care home have completely ballsed up and quite rightly you've raised this on here.

Thank you for this, it's really helpful.

I've a few friends in health care and they have all expressed shock at how this has been handled.

Funnily enough, when my DF died in hospital I and my sons were with him. It was about 10.30 so night shift had started. My son went out and told the desk staff and it was similarly awkward. They were later identified as agency staff, as I hadn't met them before and I had been a permanent fixture on the ward for three weeks at that point, and had built a bit of a rapport with many of the regular nurses.

That night the nurse walked into the room, peered at him from the end of the bed, didn't check for signs of life, was quite awkward about it all and went off to get a bereavement pack. We were then left alone for "time if we needed it". So we gathered all his belongings and just left. I appreciate in a hospital the living are more of a priority than the dead, but again it was all a bit perfunctory.

As it happens I know my Dad's consultant socially, so I spoke to him the next morning, and he was sympathetic and said he'd feed back to the ward manager that communication in such circumstances could be improved.

I honestly do understand how hard working in healthcare is, and Lord knows I've certainly experienced enough death related awkwardness after losing my DM and DP to make huge allowances, but in situations where death is "routine" it would be nice if the air of desensitisation could be addressed, and clear and empathetic communication could be prioritised.

I'm not a weeper and wailer and try to be stoic. But everyone reacts differently in these situations, and no shade on those who do fall apart, it's only human. I think how these things are handled is important because it does compound the distress of bereavement if it's "off".

Thank you all again for your kindness and support, and the insights given here. This will help inform how I address the situation. The email didn't get written yesterday as I was, in between wallowing a bit, sorting photos for the montage for my Dad's funeral. I may have to rename my cats Kleenex and Andrex, bless them.

Onwards and upwards and much love to you all ❤️

Im sorry to read this OP it makes me cross when bereaved relatives are treated with little compassion and understanding. I’m also sorry for recent your losses.
I’m an HCP my colleagues and I regularly certify death in care homes. At night evenings and weekends because we cover a huge area and are often busy we frequently don’t get to out to do the paperwork for 2-3 hours after we’ve been informed of the death, the body can’t be moved until we’ve done this. We’ve never had a care home complain and I never get the impression that they are rushing to move the body. Most of our patients die at home and families regularly keep their relative for 4-5 hours before moving it nothing overly dramatic happens to it in that time.
Writing this has reminded me that going back 40 + years those who died in hospital wards were kept on the ward for at least 2 hours out of a mark of respect.

I'm so sorry for all your losses.
Rest homes are a business. They only care about income rolling in.

Grief and loss is very isolating. The world goes on around you.

This is what happened with us. We had given them the details for the funeral director and although I was there they contacted them for me although checked I was ready.
also a BUPA hone

Correct.

Allow your grief to flow. It's soothing and healing. I am glad you were able to focus on activities for your DF funeral. Please reach out to your DSs and friends at this time - this might not be your 'normal' as an only child you may be emotionally more independent than others but what you are going through is beyond solitary and needs connection, expression and support from others - who will be delighted to support you. No requirement to be stoic in these days - it will achieve nothing. Ask for a hug, a coffee or just someones presence. These recent losses will likely kick up the dust from the untimely loss of your DH which will be painful - so please take any opportunity for care and connection.