I don’t want my mum to tag along to every holiday

[Birdsongjacky]

My dad is now in a care home, my mum has got a difficult personality (narcissistic/BPD/manipulative - not sure but you get the idea!) and has always had a major obsession with holidays and always been jealous of people on holiday. Since my dad can no longer go away and is only really with us in mind now, she has turned largely to me to take her on holiday with us (I am married with young children). The problem is, the 2 occasions we have taken her have essentially ruined it for me because I am a massive people pleaser and I find it is just another dependent human being who I have to factor in to plans. She doesn’t have the same ideas or priorities as me (my focus is on my children) she’s really demanding about being busy during the day and not returning to the accommodation for a chill or spending the day on the beach when we would prefer the pool etc. the most recent time I wanted to call time on a day out because we were soaked through, the kids were tired and grumpy, and she basically fell out with me for not giving her a full day experience.

any destination I mention she has started saying “can I come?” Which is also really awkward. To make matters worse when she is with us she is very dependent, she doesn’t eg prepare the evening meal, or bring a packed lunch, she sits there expectantly, and it really winds me up.

essentially, I don’t mind incorporating her in to some (shorter) trips, but want to preserve perhaps bigger family holidays to my little family unit, but am just overwhelmed with guilt and fear of telling her we want to go alone.

anyone had something similar?

Because I think saying to her that they don’t have enough money to go abroad, but then actually going abroad… is patently a bit of a daft idea 😂

I have a narcissistic dm. A day out is stressful enough. Mine would never find a travel companion, as long as we accommodated her. You might be creating the situation. Mine is so selfish that she would never consider herself a burden or comply with what everyone else wanted to do. Dc of people like this can have too much empathy. She needs to be told no. It is fine to say you'd rather it was just you, dh and the dc this time.

That's why you don't tell her.
Jesus I'm not the only one on the thread who suggested it, get off my back.

Yes awkward. People havent clue though if their mothers easy. It is exhausting. My siblings dont do it either. Its 24 7 of minding on your only break of the year.

So you don’t think this manipulative narcissist would wonder where the op was for a fortnight?

and you’d ask your kids to lie to granny, every year?

I mean personally I don’t think the op let alone her kids should have anything to do with a manipulative BPD narcissist, but if she’s not going to go NC than suggesting she sneak off once a year on a holiday abroad but tell her mum that actually she’s at home? Well, what? Is just…. Weird

@houwseevryweekend fair enough but nobody is being abused. That word is used too lightly now, there are people who actually are abused/have been abused and to say a PITA tag along granny is abusive to OPs children and DH just makes a mockery of real abuse victims.

The op is being abused
the children will witness their mother being bullied and mistreated like this
and soon enough… someone like this will turn their attentions upon them when they grow a voice and opinions

Hi OP
I have a similar situation although I get on very well with my Mum. She’s been coming in our family holidays for a few years, firstly as my Dad became ill and was in a nursing home and then he passed away. She tends to contribute in terms of cooking/paying for a meal etc.
Neither my husband or I mind her coming but it does change the dynamic. She isn’t difficult but there are always new considerations when there’s an extra adult with you. This year, we’ve booked a holiday just for the 4 of us and haven’t addressed the fact that we didn’t invite her but have pointed out subtly that it’s an ‘adventure’ holiday aimed at the children rather than a relaxing beach holiday. I’ve tried to soften it a bit by saying that we will aim to book something for us all for next year instead.
My advice would be to do something similar- just book and when you tell her, say that you’ll have to do something together next time instead.
My Mum has been really fine about it but I can tell she’s feeling lonely.
it’s tough and those saying not to tell her etc clearly don’t have a similar relationship with their Mums as we seem to have as this just wouldn’t happen.

Hi OP
Like you I’m a people pleaser (trying to be a former people pleaser!) and I cannot recommend this podcast enough.
I listened to it today and it’s amazing.
I haven’t read the whole thread yet but wanted to show you this podcast. I need to do some work on myself but like you I’ve got parents with completely disregulated emotions, that turned me into the people pleaser I am (was). No more!

Disregulated isn’t even a word I don’t think, but hopefully you know what I mean 🥴

Don’t lie OP. That’s insane and will only make life more complex for all of you.

Just calmly present the facts, don’t over explain and don’t give in to the guilt tactics. Easier said than done of course.

You are not a small child any more. You have power and agency. I have been there. It’s liberating.

OK you have your inside and outside all messed up! You internalise guilt, shame, fear, obligation and anxiety. Worry about everything, feel bad about everything and make everything emotionally your issue. However, you seem utterly powerless to externalise decisions and boundaries. Wrong way around! Your mum’s emotions and feeling are HERS. You have to work out what YOUR emotions are, they are the ones inside you. And your emotions are love for DH and DC, feeling you want a holiday, feeling that you need a break.

You need to make decisions, and set boundaries. Set that up around you as a defence. Capitulating to bullies just motivates them to bully more and more. ‘Kindness’ is not what that is. It’s weakness. The thing about boundaries is that they are very hard to set up, it’s painful and scary. But once you have defended them a few times, it gets massively easier. And is much less difficult than trying to make your mum happy, which is impossible.

As an aside, your earlier post about everyone telling you that you are abusive… that was trained communication from your mum. You let that feeling in without assessing it. Healthy is this; someone has an opinion of me <honest self inventory> well they’re right about x and wrong about y. I’ll internalise and work on ONLY x. And y I can safely ignore, it doesn’t affect me. Different to; x and y went straight in, I feel horrible, I’ll make them feel guilty about making me feel that. That conditioning is VERY VERY difficult to break and you will probably need help with it.

OP, I'm so sorry that your Mum spoilt your last holiday. In your shoes the next time she asks if she can come with you, I would say, 'No, sorry Mum, you can't, you really spoiled our last holiday, and it's shown me that we don't want the same things when we're on holiday. However, I've given it some thought, and wondered whether you've considered going on a coach holiday, as lots of people of your age go on them, and they organise all sorts of trips for you, so you won't be bored, but equally if you don't want to go on one, you don't have to, I've heard they're really good'. Then see what she says, unless of course you've already suggested this, and she's turned the idea down, but I would definitely tell her that she spoiled the last holiday, so you don't think it's a good idea to go away together again.

Meanwhile please don't take any notice of the nasty posters on here, MN seems to be getting worse, when there's absolutely NO NEED!!

But it's not kind is it ? Not to you, not to your DH, not to your kids.

There's more to life than sacrificing yours and others' happiness for a narcissist who won't appreciate it anyway.

Prioritise your family. Learn to love yourself and prioritise your own family. You will gradually build strength and resilience.

Don’t know where these heartless people come from tbh. I know what you mean - you love your mum, there’s good things and positives along with the negatives, you’re trying to role model love kindness and family life …
it’s complicated and “just don’t tell her” feels impossible.

but - as the only person in mum’s life, I reached the end of my tolerance. I explained to her that I love her and want to spend time with her, as I do during the year, and that holidays for me have to mean a break from the other 50 weeks a year. That a holiday for me allows me to be there for her for the rest of the year. That a holiday should be novelty change and excitement, or peace calm and easiness whatever holiday means to each of us. That a holiday with me and her means neither of us get the real hold we need. So she needs to find other ways of having a holiday, that’s a break from the usual (me and the kids blah blah).
my mum has since taken herself on Riveriera cruises, saga tail tours, a tour of Crete … while I’ve had hols on the beach elsewhere doing naff all.
and we both feel better for it!

Don't bring the subject up.
If she presses, say pointedly that 'dh wants a 2nd honeymoon'
or 'just me the kids and dh this year'

Tough situation @Birdsongjacky you need to give a bit of tough love back.
Weekend away with mum?

These kind of threads are a wake up call for all of us to future proof our lives as we age. I don’t want my DC to feel they have to take me on holidays and I don’t want to holiday in family resorts!!

OP - honestly the only solution here is to do a separate short break with your mum. I take my mum away every year and do my family holiday with that the 5 of us.

Would your DM pay for a holiday rental for a few days and you and the kids go with her or does she want to be paid for. My mother wants to go places but doesn’t want to pay whereas my MIL rents a place and says come if you like, no problem if not.

Just book it and say no…

I understand how hard this is for you as I have a narcissistic mother who is on her own. I’m also an only child. This means I carry a heavy burden feeling I need to make my mum happy; she puts her daily happiness and expectations all on me despite me having a very busy career and family. I have no advice but can only say I know why you feel like you do - but everything you’ve done to date has not made her happy, so making yourself happy (saying no), is not that different to her coming along and being unhappy anyway!

Don't let your mother spoil your kids' holidays!

My grandma used to invite herself on our holidays. I hated it. I think my dad had this idea that she would be happy to sit on the beach or on the pier in a deckchair and read a book, do her knitting or just watch the world go by.

Did she fuck. She followed us round everywhere, which pissed my mum off no end, and also meant we frequently couldn't do what we wanted to do.

When my sister and I asked if we could go on a boat or go somewhere that involved a lot of walking or climbing, we got told,

"No, we can't go there because Grandma can't walk that far."
"No, Grandma won't like that."
"No, we can't do that .Grandma won't be able to do that."

Instead we ended up doing boring activities like walking round gardens, because that's the sort of thing that Grandma liked doing.

To add insult to injury, we also had to share a room with Grandma.

I was not impressed and I've never forgotten those holidays.

Don’t tell her book your holidays, keep it quiet and go on holiday.

There's an amazing reddit board 'raised by narcissists' that I recommend. The demographic is on average (not all) younger, some of them are still right in the thick of it at home.

There's also a 'raised by borderlines' which describes similar but different behaviour, that I find very cathartic to read. I've got one parent with each, lucky me.

It's through reading this sort of thing plus books and youtube vids (Jay Reid is incredible) that I've let go of all guilt about keeping my distance.

I have no interest in being a 'good daughter' to people who did and said such horrific things to me. You have to be ok with being the baddie in their eyes. Also top tip: make yourself as dull and boring as possible.

Just put her on the mailing lists for solo holidays 😁
A few of my older friends enjoy coach holidays where they get picked up really locally, the fitter amongst them enjoy walking holidays.

Came here to recommend the exact same podcast episode. It’s brilliant.

OP - I know that saying no to your mum is not as easy as it sounds but feeling a bit guilty for a moment is better than resentment building and building. Like other posters have suggested, I would say something like, “Not this time, mum, but I was thinking of a weekend away to X, would you be interested in that?” There may still be some fall out but the important thing is that you managed to say no. Each time, saying no will get easier. I would also recommend the book “running on empty” by Dr Jonice Webb or “set boundaries find peace” by Nedra glover tawwab to help empower you when you’re trying to put boundaries in place.

You are a great daughter. What I would suggest is offer her a three day city break for you & her.