WIBU if I complain about this teacher?

[Throwawaymama]

I need impartial advice in an awful situation.

my son (14) has got into a fight today at school. I am not happy about this obviously. Lots of stuff going on and I’m looking at getting him help.

There has been back and forth drama between him and another boy for the past few weeks, and today this other boy was being kept in isolation at lunch with his head of year (boy is year below so it’s a different HOY). I don’t know why but he was with her all afternoon.

my son has found out where he was and gone storming into the room with 3 of his friends (again this is NOT okay) and started to punch this boy.

here’s the bit I’m not happy with.

the head of year has forcibly got in the middle and told my son to get out - he did - but as he turned round again to say something to the other boy she has pushed him away from her and again screamed at him to get out. She’s not big or tall and she didn’t hurt him.

WIBU to complain about the teacher doing this? I thought they weren’t allowed to put hands on students?

throwaway for obvious reasons.

If I trawled through umpteen years on Mumsnet, I could probably count on the fingers of one hand the number of occasions that a parent ever got back to say how the awful treatment of their child went,

Funny that.

Thank you for protecting that boy and I'm so sorry that you had to go through such a shocking experience. Reading this must have brought it back, I hope you are feeling OK.

What do you bet this thread will disappear as the OP will be unable to stand the criticism rightfully directed at her for her poor parenting

I am thinking the same thing.

Four adult size (most 14 yo are) violent thugs burst into a room and start assaulting a boy in her care - wtf do you think she's supposed to do, say "please don't do that" and hope for the best? Sounds as if that's been your parenting method so far.
I hope your little darling is expelled - I wouldn't mind betting that he was the instigator of the "back and forth drama between him and another boy"

It’s alarming that being attacked as a teacher is becoming the norm.

I hope the teacher is OK. Poor woman.

This

Thank you for your very kind words. I’m fine thankyou, but I left teaching within a year of that incident following another aggressive incident directed at me personally by a female pupil at another school, and didn’t return to teaching for more than a decade. Have left the profession completely now, largely due to behaviour and nightmare parents like the OP.

I remember another breaktime when a pre-arranged mass brawl broke out between about 30 students and every nearby teacher ran out to intervene. It was total mayhem and one very brave 64 year old female teacher got crushed against a stairwell as she tried to separate people. In what other job does a 64 year old have to face something like that out of the blue?

I’m not saying teachers are perfect, but the general public really has no idea of how often teachers are faced with very sudden, volatile situations where they have to make snap decisions to protect the children in their care. Often placing themselves at risk in the process.

Wind up merchant 🤣

I am amazed he hasn't been permanently excluded.
He has barged into a teaching space and launched an unprovoked attacked on another pupil.
This is one of the most clear Cust cases for perm ex I have ever seen and I work in this field.
I have seen children permanently excluded for far less.
Your priorities are utterly upside down. You need to read him the riot act not complain about the teacher. Because if he carries on like this he is on a slippery slope.

Your kid planned, with three friends, to find a student who was safely sitting in a room supervised by his head of year. They plotted to find out his location and attack him. A boy who is also younger.

The ratio was 4 to 2. They entered the room extremely aggressively and both the younger student and teach felt threatened due to your son's volatile behaviour.

I'm sorry but you are down right wrong in this. Your son's actions were vile, put your effort into dealing with that. He definitely needs help.

Consider 4 teenagers entering a room were you were, in a planned attack against the only other person in that room. Think about how your heart would be racing, you wouldn't feel safe, it was planned so what else have these students planned? Scary stuff, right? And in today's school instant thoughts would be are they carrying weapons? Do I need to alert the school to go into lock down?

That teacher did nothing wrong in my eyes but protect herself and another student from a vicious, premeditated attack. This wasn't a sudden burst of anger that went too far.

Most schools would have permanently excluded or managed moved your child.

Where on earth have you got the idea that teachers must never touch pupils in any circumstance? This sort of ridiculous attitude from parents - thinking of making a formal complaint because their son while mid-fight was touched by a teacher - is why behaviour in schools is out of control and teacher retention is so poor. I actually despair. The issue is your son thought he could totally disrespect a teacher by storming into her room as a group of four to throw punches. Disgusting behaviour from him, horrific for a woman to deal with five lads first fighting while on her own and you’re sitting here thinking of trying to get a teacher into trouble for touching him when he wouldn’t shut up and get out?!

I haven't read the full thread so this may have already been covered.
Wrt she was not being attacked.

How was she to know she wasn't about to be attacked? In these situations it's about perceived threat. Your child has already attacked the boy, and when told to leave he came towards them again. Given that he has just been violent, the teacher could reasonably believe that he was going to attack either herself or the boy again..
The teacher can justify in this situation the use of reasonable force.
She didn't run after him or hit him. She simply pushed him away.
Do some parents think that teachers just have to take a beating?
It's no wonder some kids are out of control and think they can get away with anything and are untouchable.
YABVU

Edit to add the post I meant to quote

im NOT okay with what my son did but im also not okay with a teacher putting her hands on my child.
i looked it up and I don’t feel it applies. She was not being attacked.

Yeah, you complain about the teacher protecting one younger child from four angry violent boys.

You need to address your sons behaviour
I hope he's permanently excluded, because that's the only consequence that might make hin & you understand how unacceptable his behaviour has been.

I am shocked at some of the replies here. Actually really awful to read to be honest.

This sounds like such a distressing situation, OP. I think it sounds like a very positive and responsible idea to get your son help, as you have already said, his violent behaviour was not ok.

I would suggest talking it through with the head teacher and teacher involved. I think it would help you to hear the teacher's side of the story first and also to see the school behaviour policy, and how they manage violent incidents.

I think it's reasonable to be honest and simply state how you felt, that you felt unhappy with your son being pushed while walking away. However, I don't think it would be reasonable or helpful to do this in an accusatory way.

It was a very difficult situation, for the student being punched and the teacher, trying to keep all students safe. I imagine she felt intimidated and scared even, with a real threat of being hurt due to the physicality of the incident.

It would be helpful to work with the school so that this doesn't happen again.

I hope you, your son and school staff get the help and support for the violence to stop.

He was NOT walking away, @HangryGooose - the OP says he had turned back. As far as the teacher knew, he was about to resume his attack. What should a small woman have done against FOUR aggressive boys who had come mob handed to attack another pupil? Pushing him was an entirely proportionate response to the threat he posed, imo.

I am shocked at some of the replies here. Actually really awful to read to be honest.
This sounds like such a distressing situation, OP. I think it sounds like a very positive and responsible idea to get your son help, as you have already said, his violent behaviour was not ok.

Yes @HangryGooose Very shocking and awful to read about a gang of boys attacking a child like that. I'm sure it was extremely distressing for the teacher and the poor lad who took a beating
🙄

She was probably quite scared of your almost-adult thug who in a very short amount of time will be in jail if he doesn't completely turn this around.

The way you're behaving about this is making it clear why your son behaves this way. A lifetime of criminality is within his reach unless you start being a parent right now.

@HangryGooose hopefully the teacher involved will be pushing for this child to be suspended pending a permanent exclusion , hopeful the child they attacked unprovoked will have reported the assault to the police . Hopefully once both of those things have happened the school will be free from the violence .

It’s not the teachers actions you need to be focusing on here it’s your violent son you need to be focused on before his next stop is prison.

But in the seconds it took for all this to happen, she probably thought that either she or the other child were going to be attacked.

Your son was told to leave, and looked as if he was going to, then turned around. I think most people would think he turned around to attack, either physically or verbally.

You have said the female teacher isn't big. Your son may therefore be physically larger and stronger than she is. He also had the support of his friends. The teacher acted to defend herself, and/or the other child by pushing him away. I would say that was reasonable force. She didn't punch him, as your son did to the other boy.

As a result of your sons actions (and those of his friends that backed him up), the teacher involved, and probably several other staff will (instead of teaching) had to spend time dealing with the situation that has been caused. You have admitted that your son assaulted the other boy, and not in self defence, because the other boy was sat with a teacher.

Instead of complaning about her, you should be apologising that your son put her in that situation.

Agree with this. Good on the teacher for trying to stop your violent son battering another child who is younger than him (for the second time!)

OP, you need to have a good look at your parenting here. Kids get into fights, but your teenager has taken it upon him to beat up the same boy again, this time with a gang of boys. It is thuggish behaviour and could result in your boy getting questioned by the police if the other parents decide to take it that far, which they have a right to.

The teacher is human too and would have been scared. Even a tiny bit of empathy for her situation is needed here. You should be apologising for your son's behaviour.

Wow you're clearly the problem here - no excuses, what an outrageous perspective when your son was the aggressor and clearly has no boundaries from his parent. You need to sign up to parenting classes quick, if your son's to have any chance in life. And send an apologetic letter, it's the very least you can do.

Yes all this. Thank goodness we are all on the same page here. How scary for the teacher.