To absolutely not want closer ties to Europe

[Viviennemary]

What is the matter with Stammer toadying up to the EU. We voted Out. Has he forgotten. I switched the TV off when I heard the word contribution and free movement. Here we go again. Shafted and ripped off at every turn and following their dumb rules. It's groundhog day. I'm furious.

What exactly is a "rule taker"? All international agreements, including trade agreements, involve a country agreeing to abide by certain standards. The UK having an independent trade policy and striking all these deals was a top justification for Brexit so is being a "rule taker" not an inherent part of Brexit?

The UK's accession to the CPTPP was supposedly a great triumph of Brexit but it involves us complying with CPTPP standards that we played no part in designing so is that not worse than what we had in the EU? We are also required to comply with rules as a result of NATO membership, WTO, IMF, the World Bank, ECHR and many many others. All the bilateral deals we have made with countries impose requirements on the UK too. So either surely we are a rule taker many times over already, in which case what difference does this deal make, or otherwise agreements like the one we've just struck don't actually make a country a rule taker.

A lot of people seem to have very strong views on an EU deal which is yet to be published but it seems like, in terms of rules and standards, we have agreed to some form of dynamic alignment with the EU. But I struggle to think of any pertinent areas where we could conceivably be found to not already have equivalent standards to the EU so I'm not sure what people think we are really giving away here in terms of rule making sovereignty.

I’m convinced that mumsnet has been infiltrated by Tufton street types. I think it’s a concerted effort.

Im sorry OP you won’t have to be in an endless non EU queue at the airport.

Join the club. Absolute traitor. Can't wait until he's gone. Labour are finished.

Then let Scotland & NI go.

I don’t think the OP meant any specific laws but rather the system whereby the EU passes a regulation, it must be implemented into members states legislation, even if those member states disagree with it.

Additionally, member states must interpret all domestic laws to be compatible with EU law and if that is not possible, a declaration of incompatibility must be made.

I am assuming that the OP meant the system but which laws are enacted and implemented into member states legislation.

Sorry to hear you're upset Nigel, don't let them get to you Hun xx

Yes you clearly did switch the tv off as you seem really ignorant as to details and what actually what has been agreed on. Typical leavers behaviour. Zero thought or substance, just empty incorrect drama.

There is no plan to bring back free movement.

Agreed.

Including IndyRef2 & an NI Border Poll within 10 years.

Why would you need to be at an airport for 6 hours? I travel regularly to countries where foreigners are all fingerprinTed and never been anywhere near that time waiting. .

And since Brexit tbh I've sailed past queues of eu passport holders and straight through " other passports" channels. No queues

In fact the longest I've ever been stuck in a passport queue was at London Stansted. Go figure

This is why I think the youth programme is great. It means that our children have those opportunities available to them but it is a controlled deal based on age.

Im happy with that as a compromise.

That is actually a load of old cobblers.

I live about 5 miles from the Sussex coast. I visit one or other of my local beaches most weeks, sometimes more than once. I have seen for myself tampons, sanitary towels and wipes washed up on the beaches here, not just occasionally, but regularly. There are some beaches I now avoid, because they are so awash with stuff that's been discharged via the sewers, and they stink in hot weather.

A river runs through my town, and there is a sewage treatment works on the edge of it that discharges treated sewage into the river. After heavy rain, it overflows and untreated sewage gets into the river. It's not uncommon to see turds and sanpro floating in the river downstream from the sewage works. It's fucking disgusting, it stinks and even record fines haven't given the water company the incentive to sort it out.

Regional news programmes here regularly carry news items about spillages of untreated sewage along the south coast. One spill approx 20 miles from me was on the news every night for a couple of weeks a year or two ago, complete with footage of shitty brown water almost constantly gushing out of a pipe and straight onto the beach at low tide and (presumably) into the sea when the tide was further in. People were advised to stay away from the beaches there for several days and the town's businesses lost loads of income as a result.

Twelve or so visits to the UK coast over a 3-4 year period means fuck all, frankly. The state of our seas and beaches are a disgrace.

And why did all those new arrivals come ? Boris wave by any chance ?

For no apparent good reason. What were you so affected by prior to Brexit.

I'm assuming you've got a bee in your bonnet about the ECHR? On that note, thank fuck we've got it before all the laws that protect us ie in the workplace are shredded to bits.

But then that's not what you're thinking about is it?

@Viviennemary what benefits have you personally seen since Brexit happened- I’m curious

Would you rather be governed by Trump's whims? Because at the moment, that's the main alternative.

@FedupofArsenalgame agree I've never waited long and when there has been a queue on one side but the eu is empty we've been waived across.
I don't know all of the detail of today's pact so I can't comment but I still struggle to believe that air port queues are of such importance to some people??
In the context of the monumental issues we had.

mummymeister I completely agree with you & cannot believe the fishing industry haven’t been spoken with about these ‘closer ties’.

For what it’s worth I don’t believe different communities are particularly good at taking other communities into consideration when making these decisions. No one in Europe puts another country before their own….. apart from ours?! over fishing/looking after coastal waters.

From Hansard.....'Since the referendum, the UK economy has grown faster than those of Germany, Italy and Japan, and is equal with the French. The IMF is now predicting that the UK will have the fastest growth in the G7 in the next five years. Meanwhile, our exports have reached £870 billion, and we are well on target to reach our overall target of £1 trillion. That growth in trade is greatly assisted by our free trade agreements, now signed with 73 countries globally plus the EU.'

The UK's gross public sector contribution to the EU Budget in 2019-20, the final financial year before Brexit, was £18.3bn, equivalent to around £352m per week, according to the Treasury. After everything else is taken into consideration, it's actually nearer 9 billion - but I'd still rather keep 9 billion in the UK rather than fund the EU.
There are good aspects to leaving the EU as well as challenges. I'm just glad we are no longer funding an organisation which costs millions to run and whose functionaries we can't vote for. If we don't like the UK government, we can vote them out. If we don't like Von der Leyan etc, it's rather more difficult. Extra tiers of government are what we DON'T need.

@ToWhitToWhoo really?
How so...

And if kier was really bad what can we do with him?

What if a trump like figure heads up the eu soon?
What can the eu do then? What could we do?

@mummymeister and @Catwalking

Considering that - according to what I'm reading - this is essentially a continuation of the deal that was negotiated after leaving, how did you feel about it then?

If it's changed, can you explain how so?

No wonder the aliens aren't making contact. Imagine them looking down and watching us bitch with our neighbours about fucking fish. If you look at the last thousand years of progress, and chart it forward, it's basically a choice between world peace, with an interconnected global consciousness, or complete distruction.

Ultimately, some kind of world governance is inevitable, why not participate in that rather then trying to isolate and resist? You can fly right across the world in a day, how long do you think the relevence of imaginary lines in the dirt called countries are going to last?

The world is set to change at a pace previously unimagined, it's just pointless to resist integration with our neighbours. Our great grandkids will think of us as morons.

I just can’t get my head around the general lack of comprehension of people who voted Leave. Unless @RedToothBrush is incorrect, but she seems to be quoting the new agreement - Fishing rules are an extension of the current agreement negotiated posts Brexit and by a Brexiteer??
I don’t understand what more you want?!
UK has left the EU… no one is talking about going back.
From what I can see lots of people are moaning about Brexit - in NI, Scotland, in the major English cities, now Farmers seem a bit grumbly, small businesses have reduced trade… but we are still sticking with it. Starmer is just trying to improve some aspects especially involving younger people. Who do not want separation from the EU.

@Topseyt123 When the U.K. was a member state, it was not up to our own parliament whether EU regulations were implemented into law. There was no choice in the matter. EU Directives gave parliament more flexibility where they could implement domestic legislation how they decided, but as long as it had the outcome outlined in the directive.