To ask my brother to visit us from abroad and refuse to meet in London

[JIMER202]

I live in Australia and haven’t been home since 2022.

I’m planning a trip back to the UK next year and my children will be 6 and 2 by then. My youngest was born out here and so it will be his first time meeting most of my family (including my brother). My eldest was a toddler when we moved and so it will basically be his first time meeting anyone too.

My family live rurally and so my children and I will be flying Australia-London and then driving another 3-4 hours to my hometown. We have an 8hr drive to the Airport on the Aus side too, so it is a lot of travel and jet lag is going to be an issue also.

We are coming for 10 days which sounds bonkers as it’s such a long way to come, but my partner is able to come for 10 days or I fly alone with both children. My grandad has had strokes and it’s likely this will sadly be one of the last times we see him (hopefully not the last but I am bracing myself it may be).

As this trip is such a big deal and costing so much £££ already, we are actually going to be staying in a holiday cottage with my parents and grandparents, so they can really spend as much time with my children as possible and to limit the driving to see different people. Anyone that has lived away from your hometown and gone back to visit will know that everyone usually ends up saying oh come meet me here, come over to ours etc and we are trying to keep that to a minimum.

My brother also lives abroad (a 2hr flight away) and has no children. He flies back to the UK and then drives to our hometown 2-3 times a year. He will often drive all the way to our hometown and then all the way to see some of his wife’s family who are 2 hours away from there in a single weekend, which is of course a lot of travelling.

Here is my AIBU. We told my brother of the plan for the big family accommodation and that as we are paying he won’t have to pay anything, the place has enough space for him and his wife (a bedroom if they would like to stay) and he said to me why can’t I just fly to London and meet you there? Why can’t I just see you and the kids in central London? (He was suggesting meeting on a weekend before we fly back)

My husband has said it’s my family and up to me but he would prefer to not take them in to Central London on tubes etc at the ages they are and they are so young they aren’t interested in seeing Central London, they really just want to see the grandparents. I agree.

My brother has said he has no interest in coming to the holiday let. I sent him a message to let him know that as we are paying for the holiday let to minimize extra travel as my children would already have done so much and likely be jet lagged and due to their ages we won’t be doing central London. He has now asked if we can meet at Heathrow, but I can’t think of what we would do there? He made it clear he does want to see us and our children but ‘I don’t want to travel all the way back home again.’ I think he’s being rigid and I can’t understand why he’s willing to do it at other times and to see his wife’s family which is way more traveling then we are asking him to do. I mentioned he doesn’t have children as I don’t think he’s quite grasping that taking my children for several hours on the train to central London for basically a lunch is far from appealing. We get on well so I don’t understand why it feels like he’s holding this boundary with us over London or nothing when they travel to our hometown at other times?! It’s like they have agreed to stop doing it all the time but I don’t understand why they can’t make an exception for us. They are doing their same trip home twice before we even fly there next year!

I have been in the position your brother is and resented being forced to meet the family hours and hours away from where I was also catching up with friends and former colleagues.

The trip to my country was longhaul and expensive also, and relatively short considering I work, have to adhere to my meagre annual leave and when 2-3 days of the holiday were devoted already to traveling there. Having my family asking to meet at the sticks took, at least, another 3 days off the trip, which left just 2 to 3 days to catch up with close friends who were far closer to me than most members of my family.

I so resented this I no longer travel when they decide to have a family get together far from where I can see other people.

You made a plan that suits keeping your young children comfortable, he has different plans to make his longhaul trip worth it. You don’t need to go to London if you don’t want to, he doesn’t need to be stuck at an Airbnb hours away because you want to either.

Exactly she's not gone out of her way at all, but now staying a bit longer at Heathrow which will probably be better for her family anyway as they'll be exhausted. She's also now added that she's disabled, having surgery and was forced to move to Australia as far as I can tell. Hard to keep up with this thread!! Glad its sorted OP, hope you and your brother have a lovely catch up and that you have a fabulous trip and quality time with the rest of your family too.

You poor thing op!! For having to persevere through some of the sheer bloody mindedness of some posters here. I swear some people open a thread, think I’ll reply, I wonder if they’ve clarified - oh no I remember MUST NOT READ THREAD BEFORE COMMENTING. And don’t forget rule 2 - absolutely do not consider what it’s like to be in the ops situation. I’m sure I’m exaggerating and all these people in your position would: phone your mum and dad and say I know I’m not a real child anymore now I’ve moved overseas since I don’t visit for a month every year and I know the surgery and pregnancies and lack of money for it are no excuses and my children will basically grow up without family and no one will ever make any effort for us even to do what they usually do a few times a year and honestly I’m just so honored any of them remember my name or that I have children.
really, I’m sure they would.
good luck and I hope your brother gets it! (Im in oz)

Your “D”H also, having forced you into this, isn’t willing to be accommodating towards your family and your needs. Which are totally reasonable by the way OP. I’m sure you would have spent longer in U.K. on this trip, if you had a choice. But this time, you are limited by the fact that you now have no autonomy to travel on your own, due to your accident and disability. You are reliant on your DH

OP was very clear in her first post that there was a choice - she either came with DH for ten days only because that’s all the time he has, or she travelled alone with two children if she wanted to stay longer. You’re infantilising OP by suggesting she is reliant on her DH, in an attempt to turn him into some kind of control freak when in fact OP has made these choices of her own free will.

All the talk about lack of compromise and ‘forcing’ OP into things makes me suspect there’s a fair bit of projection going on here.

I understand. Even if his life is fine, it's not automatic that you take precedence. This is something you need to understand. You did decide to have children, after all. I have childfree siblings and relatives who have made the choice to stay childfree.

Just as I feel I deserve to be top priority because of my kids' needs, they feel they have a right to certain things since they made the deliberate choice NOT to have kids.

It would be lovely if – and is lovely when – we can meet in the middle.

Your brother HAS been a bit of an arsehole here, it's true. But I also feel this isn't about kids or tragic life events or even this trip really, it's about willingness to consider other perspectives, even if just for 1 minute before dismissing them. Your first few posts seemed reasonable, but just based on your later replies which are honestly quite hard to read because they are just droning on about you you you repeatedly, you seem to have none of that. It is not a trait I would want in a friend or sibling.

Again it's just an impression I (and many PPs it seems) can't help being struck by. I'm sure you don't need my approval or commentary though and I wish you all the best in your family reunion.

You’re the one piling on!

Neither you or your brother are prepared to compromise to make this happen.

Are you actually that bothered about meeting up or are you just making the right noises to seem like the good guy?

Sometimes adult siblings don't have a close relationship. It's sad when that happens but forcing meet ups that don't suit anyone won't improve the bond.

No, definitely not.

Because it’s relevant. He has no idea what a 3 hour car drive entails with a 2 year old and 6 year old compared to two adults getting in the car. Let alone those kids having an 8 hour journey to the airport in Aus, 24 hrs on a plane, 4 hour journey UK side a few days before.

OP will have to take buggies, car seats, presumably they’re in a hire car, potties, snacks, nappies, change of clothes. They’ll have to stop for wee / poo breaks, nappy changes. It’s just not the same.

I’m not saying everyone should jump to OP’s tune but it’s very different traveling with NO kids compared to traveling with 2, one is only 2.

It seems like an odd move from your brother to change plans, given the travel distance.
Could he potentially be a bit put out that other family members are taking leave/staying with you in a holiday rental etc when the same effort isn't made for him?

It could be as simple as driving from London/Airport for several hours doesn't really suit either of you, and he's just more stubborn than you are.

You're probably right with the meet at Heathrow before you leave plan. Hopefully that gives you some quality time with him anyway so neither of you are split between other family members who want to see both of you as much as you want to see each other.

Your real problem is only coming over for 10 days. We have family in Australia and it’s 3 weeks usually, with 3-4 places to visit around the country. Work is fine, school is fine. It’s not like these trips happen every year!

However, you’re here for 10 days. So as that stands I would arrange to meet your brother at Heathrow. Who knows why he won’t come to the holiday cottage, but he won’t and he’s offered a couple of alternatives so that’s what I’d go with.

What does "piling on" even mean? Disagreeing with OP?

It's very hard for many people who haven't moved abroad to understand your situation, OP. I moved from NY to the UK for my husband's work. While here, we had three children. Each time we flew to NY (with varying numbers of children as our family grew), so many people said, oh come to us, it's just an hour's drive, we'll all meet for dinner, etc.

For the first few trips, we tried to accommodate everyone. On one memorable trip, we figured out that over a weekend, we spent more time in a car (with
a baby and a toddler) than we did collectively visiting the people we were driving to. It was awful for the kids and awful and tiring for us.

The next time we visited we "set up shop" at my brother's house and my PILs - they lived about 40min from each other. With advanced notice, we told my friends and family that if they wanted to see us, they were invited to my brother's house. If my DH's friends and family wanted to see us, they were welcome to come to my PILs house. Most people came to see us. We certainly missed the people who didn't come, but we had to let it go. Everyone has their own lives.

With a year's warning, it seems strange that your brother can't accommodate your wishes. But if he deep down doesn't want to see you or meet your kids, then that's on him, and there's unfortunately nothing you can do.

100%

Yeah, I think I'd do this if it was me.
Must be a cafe for some lunch and plane watching, see them take off and land.
Get the flight24 app on your phone and you can even see where they're going to/coming from to keep the kids amused ,🙂
You'll still get to catch up with your brother.

I live 14 hrs away from my family. I also understand her brother messed up the plans and I'd be dead annoyed here.

But what I don't get is the lack of willingness to even CONSIDER or find out her brother's/his wife's perspective. Particularly as someone who lives so far from my family and wouldn't know 100% of what's going on in their life, I find it odd that she keeps insisting they have perfect and easy lives, and then it's repeated reams and reams of text about her life. We've heard about her kids and surgery so many times that the self-centred vibes can't help being present. And anyone who offers a nice civil perspective is "attacking" her husband.

As I said, it doesn't have to be anything big or tragic on her brother's end. It could be a stupid, simple reason. But she doesn't seem interested in finding out the reason at all. She seems to like it when PPs say it's just laziness and selfishness so if that IS the reason, ok fair enough, I'd be pissed off too. But again the certainty that she can mind-read her brother and his wife perfectly is very weird to me.

Also, she seems genuinely unable to grasp that she should not be top priority just because she has children. Just as I feel I deserve to be top priority because of my kids' needs, my childfree friends/siblings feel they have a right to certain things since they made the deliberate choice NOT to have kids... Some things are just not possible with children but reasonable compromises are still possible.

Say goodbye to your grandparents early in the morning, drive to hobbledown heath near Heathrow that your kids than therefore have a really good play before a long flight ask your brother to meet you there between his flights. Kids get a nice day out, its not travelling to central London and your only changing your plans by a few hours to see him.

Could his wife be pregnant OP? Too early to tell anyone but the baby would be young enough when you visit for him not to want to leave his wife overnight?

OP’s brother isn’t the one making the long haul flight - it’s two hours. OP is travelling from Australia.

But what I don't get is the lack of willingness to even CONSIDER or find out her brother's/his wife's perspective.

If people come concentrated on reading the OPs posts you would see she has already done this. If you're too busy wringing your hands, projecting your own emotions and coming up with creative ways to be a passive little spaff to OP then you might have missed it.

You haven't read the thread, have you?

OP arranged and paid for a holiday let, and offered him and his wife a room for free. And gave them a years’ notice. That doesn’t sound as though OP is the one not wanting to meet up. It’s her brother who is now demanding OP accommodate him.

Why are you writing this when virtually none of your situation aligns with the OP's brother except to get your own resentments off your chest and pile on. The Db is not flying long haul, the OP and her family are. The brother wouldn't be using days of precious holiday, he could've come at the weekend and not used any leave. Of course it's different traveling with little ones - they need longer sleep in a more rigid time period for a start.

OP I think your DB just likes to please himself and like many men will put himself out for his wife but not for others. If I were him of course I'd see you and your kids but some people just can't empathise as your thread demonstrates! For your own sanity focus on the joy of seeing your loved ones and try and ignore how inflexible your DB is being. I hope the surgery goes well.

I've read all the posts thoroughly and that's my genuine takeaway tbh. All I see is OP repeatedly insisting they're fine, perfect, happy, easy lives, easy work arrangements, etc. Zero curiosity and the immediate jump to just lazy and selfish. Again if that is the reason, fair enough, and as I said it doesn't have to be a big tragic reason at all, it could be a small stupid reason... But as someone who has to deal with a lot of family meetups across the globe, I cannot identify with such a self-obsessed line of thinking.

She posted for advice. Someone suggested something that made her think about it from a different angle and she changed her mind. Isn’t that the definition of taking the advice offered ?