Am I as a grandmother being unreasonable?

[TheOpenBee]

Please excuse this wall of text...

I'm looking for some advice on what to do with our current situation.
I have a daughter 27 who has a 3 year old son. My daughter works 3 days a week and up until December last year we looked after our grandson while she was at work on those 3 days.

Last December she split up with my grandsons father and he moved away. My daughter started bringing our grandson to us every single day, on days she wasn't working she'd be dropping him off and going home to bed saying she was tired because my grandson wasn't sleeping well without his father's presence and she'd been having a hard time at work. We accepted this for a few weeks but then it started to get silly.

My daughter works a 15 minute drive from our home. She'd finish work at 5 and instead of coming to pick her son up at 5.30 ish like normal she'd start turning up at 7 with no explanation as to where she had been.

He'd be served his evening meal at 5.30 and start getting excited that mummy would be back soon then he'd wait and wait for her as she gets later and later arriving. It breaks my heart when he keeps asking for reassurance that mummy is coming back.

When she is at our home with her son she sits on her phone ignoring him. He has to ask her for affection or to be involved in something he is doing. One example was last weekend my daughter and grandson were at my home, my grandson got a sandpit for his birthday and was stupidly excited when we said he could play in it. He went around everyone in the room asking them to put their shoes on and come and see his new toy. His mum for a change actually did what he asked and came outside, you could see his eyes light up when he saw her coming outside. She stayed maybe 5 minutes then decided whoever she was texting on the phone was more interesting and went back inside. My grandson looked at his grandad and said "she's not coming back is she" got really sad, asked for a hug then decided he didn't want to play with sand anymore and asked to go back inside himself.

My grandson is without doubt missing his mummy, he sees her for less than an hour in the morning and as his bedtime is technically 7 a lot of nights she takes him straight home to bed.

On the rare occasion she's paying him enough attention and actually praises him he gets emotional and immediately starts to cry. He craves her attention so much that when he gets it he doesn't know what to do.

Now we move on to a few weeks later and grandson has still been at our house all-day 6 days a week (his daddy has him on a Sunday) the only difference is my daughter on the 3 days she's not been working has been coming up to our house with him. She will sit on her phone texting her new boyfriend all day while we look after the child.

We talked to my daughter mentioning that we were unhappy with the current situation and our grandson can't be with us all the time and needed some 'just mummy' time. She got really defensive saying we just didn't want her to have a life and stormed out.
The next week she actually spent a whole day with him taking him to a local activity centre and baking cupcakes with him which he loves to do. My grandson came to us the next day happy and super chatty telling us all the things he'd done with mummy. We hoped that things were getting a tiny bit better and the next week she spent a whole day with him too.

Now to today my daughter turned up at our house saying my grandson was obviously too much of a problem for us to keep looking after so she'd enrolled him in a local nursery from 8am to 6pm all 5 days a week.
This is not what we wanted at all. While we agree nursery would be a good thing for him 50 hours a week seems like torture for a child who is already worried that he's been left when his parents are out of sight for only a short while. We were and still are always happy to have him while my daughter works. He's going from missing his daddy, to missing his mummy (even when she is physically with him) to having his grandparents taken away too and it's breaking my heart. All we wanted was for her to spend some time with him and instead she's decided to send him away from all of us.

What can I do? Am I being unreasonable asking her to actually participate in her child's life more?

your child - even as an adult - is still your child. show up for both child and grandchild and be supportive / address concerns together and look after her at her time of need

Me too, utterly selfish cruel daughter, she is neglecting her child when he needs her most. Taking away the father and now the grandparents, l am sorry for you OP, l hope that she can see what she is doing to her DC.

Aww my heart breaks for this little boy, this sounds so tough. At the same time, she’s a young single Mum who’s probably just exhausted and doing her best and is maybe, from the way you describe her behaviour quite depressed. I’m sure she loves her son but it’s impossible to be present when you’re really down. I hope she’s gets better soon.

I see many people absent themselves from reality by constantly being on social media it can be an addiction and detracts from the ebb and flow of personal interaction it seems very normal because everyone is doing it
most “addicts ‘ will not stop until they are personally set to loose something they value more than the buzz of what they’re doing
I see many families eating their meals together while all on the internet adults and kids
how do they expect children to become socially functioning when they are not given an example of how to interact /concentrate on what’s happening in their environment
live in reality
I think in years to come social media will be like the new “tobacco”
and may come with a health warning
no doubt I will be slammed for my opinion -bring it on
people will go to any lengths to defend an addiction !

I hope the nursery has loving and patient teachers. This child must be feeling very confused right now. He probably feels abandoned by everyone in his life. Most likely he will be expressing his insecurity in some way by the way he behaves. Probably with anger or sadness. I've witnessed this as a teacher and in my own family. His grandmother is exactly right about what care her grandson needs but is missing. My heart goes out to her and her precious grandson.

What a non mum beach!!

I feel heartbroken for your grandson😢 your daughter will never get this time with him back. He’s be better off adopted by a couple who really want to spend time with him.

That poor little mite
Thank goodness he has such a lovely grandmother looking out for him.

If you are in the uk. I think the government pay for a number of child care hours but not grandparents to do these hours.think it’s about 30 hours but parents can tell me if that’s right or not.
Maybe she needs to work full time now the partners gone?
she sounds like she needs emotional support whatever.
And her little boy does too.Are social services involved? They can organise nursery places under some circumstances.
my heart goes out to you all,it’s so hard to negotiate.

This would not be an empty thread I would be telling your DD if does not step and be a decent parent I would be calling SS myself, I am sick of excuses used because people choose to parent and dont want the responsibility children are not the latest must have accessory it time she grew up

Won't she get heavily subsidised childcare for 30 hours as he's 3?

It sounds like she is to wrapped up with the new boyfriend

I’m so sorry you are your husband are going through this. Reading this is actually heartbreaking. You not only sound like such loving and amazing grandparents your grandson, but also amazing parents to your daughter. I wish I’d had a mother as loving and supportive as you when I was bringing up my daughter on my own, whilst also working. I’m sorry to say this, but your daughter sounds very entitled and self absorbed and in an ideal world I’d keep a bit of distance for a while, However given the circumstances with your poor little grandson and the fact that he now needs both of you more than ever. I would arrange to have a talk with her and just be positive about the good stuff she’s doing, for example working hard and just say you realise it must have been difficult for her after splitting up from her son’s father, and say you really want to spend time with your grandson before he starts school and ask her to think of all the money she’ll save by not sending him to nursery full time ( hopefully that will help in changing her mind) When my daughter was 2 and a half just before I started a 3 day course. I enrolled her into a nursery gradually for a year for just 2 afternoons a week because she used to love to play with other children her age at the mother and toddler’s groups I frequently took her too. She absolutely loved the nursery, but what your daughter is doing, feels like she’s actually punishing you by sending your grandson to nursery full time. That poor boy is going from being with his loving grandparents full time to then being sent to a nursery which is a totally different environment and where he doesn’t know anyone. I really urge you, for the sake of your poor grandson, who really needs you now more than ever. To try and get your daughter to change her mind about sending him to nursery full- time. I wish you all the best and please keep us updated.

Me too. I have tears in my eyes for this poor little guy 🥺

So sorry this has happened OP.

You sound like a very caring mum and grandmother, this must be very difficult for you.

Was your daughter like this with your grandson when she was still together with his father? Or is this a sudden change in her personality?

It can't have been easy, her ex moving away and leaving her to do most of the parenting. Of course she still needs to take responsibility and was very fortunate that you were helping her out so much.

I hope that you are able to sort this out. You are clearly a positive influence in their lives and I hope that your daughter doesn't keep punishing you for settling some boundaries.

Before the split DD and GS had an amazing relationship there was never a problem with them. She’d take care of him wonderfully. He’s an arty child and she’d always be coming up with ways to nurture his imagination and have fun with him.

I just read this from one of your replies.

If DD used to be like this, it sounds like she needs some help as there's obviously a massive change in her behaviour.

I hope she is able to reach out and things improve. It sounds like she needs you and is hurting. As will be your grandson, who clearly wants to spend quality time with his mum and will need his GPs too.

This morning l reread your post and that made me cry for your little GS. I am so sorry that you are in this position, if you threaten your DD with SS ( which she deserves) she may withdraw completely and your GS will be the loser. If there anyone she is close to that she would listen to, and you could explain the situation. She will be harming the child if she continues neglecting him, she may want a life but the child should be her priority. It sounds that she has it easy working only 3 days a week, you taking care of her child and her XP paying the rent, she needs to wake up, just hope that the new bf is a decent person and will treat your GS better than she does.
Please let us know how the situation involves.

I don't think you're unreasonable, you're being very kind to your grandson, but I do feel very sad for your daughter. She.sounds unhappy.and depressed. Is she possibly in the painful phase of a relationship break up, when life is a struggle? A small child's dependency is really painful too, when someone temporarily feels like an abandoned small child herself. That old cliché of not being able to give when you're empty, comes to mind.
Look at the judgement on here in some replies. I bet she's already telling herself exactly those horrible punitive statements. I hope you all find ways to take a deep breath and be kind to each other, for your own and the little boy's sake.

Tbh nursery might be a good shout atm. I just hope you still get to see him x

You sound like fantastic grandparents , very supportive.
Your grandson is 3. So maybe 2 days a week at nursery could be good for him when she’s at work and he can spend the day with other little ones his own age
You could also have him for one day while she’s at work so that’s her 3 work days covered .
Then you could possibly have him a 2nd day so that gives your daughter a day to herself and you get to spend 2 full days with him .
You say grandson spends one day of the week with his dad ..so that only leaves 2 days and in my opinion she needs to be parenting him and looking after him herself !!!

What a horrifically misogynistic viewpoint.

He has moved away leaving the mum the sole carer for a child who is distresses he's not there. Some would argue mum isn't coping brilliantly, but if he is housed, warm, fed well, tended to when he wakes at night, secure because she goes to work and earns etc who the fuck is the dad to waltz in and 'intervene'.

Tbh it sounds to me like her mental health has taken a hit with the end of her relationship and being left to look after her son (who has been affected by dad moving away) alone.

She sounds depressed and zoned out, but she is still managing to pull the basics together, going to work, making sure he's fed, clean, comforted when he wakes at night attending medical appointments living in a clean house. I am assuming this because OP hasn't referenced any issues with these things.

So she's not Mary Poppins at the moment. I am sure she will move forward and feel better able to engage with playing games etc. tbh at the end of a work day I'm not sure I was a particularly fun mum but we survived and did nice things on other days.

And booking him into nursery if she recognises she is struggling is a responsible thing to do. Some people make it sounds like she's leaving him to fend for himself. He will be cared for by appropriately trained and qualified adults in a suitable environment. She will get the chance to recover a bit from all that has gone on and the stress of single parenting and being in a fit state to be more present when she is with him.

If she is on a lower income for 3 days pw the. She can probably get some help with the cost of this through UC.

The number of threads I read on here from older, professional, married women where they are struggling and the posters will pile in with advice like get a cleaner, put them in nursery and extra day and have some time to yourself, make sure you and dad are getting equal leisure time. Apparently none of that applies to a single, younger mum whose child's father has buffered off and left her carrying all of the parenting.

I can't believe people are talking about social services. What are you going to say to the triage team? My daughter is putting her son in nursery. He's safe and his physical needs are met, but she doesn't interact with him as much as is ideal since a traumatic event only a few months ago.

Some people must have very perfect and sheltered lives .

I’m always horrified at how quickly women will jump on other women when they’re down.

Where’s the support and understanding?!

I’ve been reading some of these comments with my mouth open at times.

It’s one of these situations that unless you’ve walked in those shoes you’ve absolutely zero idea of what life is like for OP’s daughter.

Definitely. And really sad that her own mum is so critical.

If my child was totally neglecting my grandchild's basic needs I'd be critical and so disappointed.