Sister angry I “yanked” my nephew’s arm and told him off

[Mmemm]

So I live with my parents (saving up for flat in London). My sister often visits with her child and husband.

We have a gorgeous 12 yo Golden Retriever who is enjoying his golden years sunbathing on the sofa. Anyway, I was in the living room on my phone when I saw my little toddler nephew go up to my dog on the sofa and hit him on the head with a coaster. Obviously it’s not heavy but I reacted as I am protective of my elderly dog, poor boy was dozing. I ran up to my nephew and held him by arm and said “we do not throw things at ‘Lucky’, how would you like it if I hit you in the face? That was very mean of you”. I took the coaster away from him and said if he can’t use it nicely then he can’t have it. Not a big deal. Pretty normal way to deal with it in my view. I may have been a little cross.

But sister is now demanding an apology. BIL was sat sort of to the side reading a magazine and snitched. Didn’t say anything at the time. Errr how how about you parent your child mate.

But apparently I was very overboard. I don’t think I was. I refuse to apologise on principal. Dog took it in his stride but you can’t be allowing shit
like that to happen.

In my mind sister can do one but parents have literally begged me as apparently she won’t visit whilst I am home 😂

I'm a bit torn - on the one hand I think a short sharp shock does work in preventing children from repeating dangerous behaviour and imo there's nothing wrong in holding a child's arm so they don't hit a dog. Otoh, you do sound very intolerant and unloving towards your nephew, as if he's literally nothing to do with you and that makes me wonder if your sister's reaction is coming from a feeling that you don't love her baby.
What you did stemmed entirely from concern for the dog and no concern that your nephew might get bitten. Most aunties would have both concerns in mind.
Your sister is hurt because she thinks you live your dog more than her baby - that might be true but it's one of those things people don't ever say out loud and try not to make obvious!

But I swing back a bit on whether you are unreasonable because I've known some very aggressive toddlers, whose parents have done nothing about their hitting and think everything their child does is cute. Without knowing your sister and nephew, it is hard to judge.

Do you ever spend time with nephew playing? Are you affectionate with him generally, and pleased to see him? Do you buy him little things you see when out and about just because you thought of him and knew he'd like them? Because my siblings did all that with my children, and so I knew they were loved.
If you do, then I'd say your sister needs to keep all that in mind and see the balance. If you are generally of the 'not my kid, not my responsibility' pov then I can see that this is just one more thing that's part of a bigger picture for her.

Agree bil is a twat.

You did nothing wrong. I have two dogs and a toddler and if she hit the dog with a coaster I’d do similar. Children need to understand pets are living animals with feelings not objects.

The dog was ASLEEP.

I don’t think you need to apologise, but if I were in your shoes I’d reach out to your sister to talk about it.

For the sake of family harmony you might retell that story with a little more concern for your nephew. If that had been my child, I’d have stepped in and done the same thing, because I’d have been concerned for him, as well as the dog.

It does sound as if you regard him as a little menace or something, and maybe that’s a point on which you might reflect.

I’m feeling a bit sorry for your dsis of her dh didn’t deal with the toddler, and didn’t say something to you if he thought you were heavy handed. And I’d wonder if he’s stirring up trouble or trying to isolate her.

Good for you! Needed parenting in lieu of his useless dad

What would you call it? A promise? OP sounds pretty aggressive tbh.

I suppose it depends how hard you held his arm . You sounds quite angry . And not very nice about your nephew.
You give the impression you may have held it quite hard and aggressive.
Yes his dad should have been watching him. But that does not mean you can be heavy handed.
Imagine if all teachers did it this way when a child was hiting something.

They would all be struck off .
You can't be heavy handed with children .
You said yourself you were hungover. So probably lacking patience.
Also bitter that they visit so much.

Nobody has suggested not telling the child no. There are numerous good examples in this thread of how the situation should have been handled, all of which firmly involve telling the child no.

Yes you overreacted totally and given it’s your parents who are paying the price ( who are letting you live with them) I’d apologise for their sakes if nothing else . ( or you could move out sooner )

<Otoh, you do sound very intolerant and unloving towards your nephew, as if he's literally nothing to do with you and that makes me wonder if your sister's reaction is coming from a feeling that you don't love her baby.>

would you say this to a man? A much younger uncle who is hungover scrolling on their phone?

I really don't understand what you are saying.

They should be thanking you. Much better a telling off and physically stopped than a bite to the face.

If you’d done this to my child when they were small I’d have been grateful and my husband not supervising would have received my wrath.

Op is not a parent and isn’t expected to know the most appropriate speech for managing a toddler. An occasional stern telling off harmed no one and she removed him from a potentially dangerous situation. If the dog had reacted no doubt DSIS and BIL would be the first demanding the dog was put to sleep.

If you leave your children in the supervision of others you need to accept that they will parent in your absence.

Because to a 2 year old an angrily expressed "how would you like it if I hit you in the face" said by a much bigger person who is holding his arm, will very likely sound/feel threatening. We as adults can see the nuance in the phrase but a 2 year old child cannot.

I agree with the op stepping in, with explaining and removing the coaster. I agree bil should have stepped in before she had to.

I do not agree with carrying on after that with "how would you like it" and I also wouldn't be surprised if (in her panic, hungover-ness, and from her attitude towards people on here) she reacted in a way that was maybe rougher/louder than she's willing to let on here and That is where the issue is.

In a family house, the whole family need to take some responsibility for supervising dog and child. Otherwise, the dog and child need to be physically kept apart.

Like I said in my subsequent post, I think a lot of people are deluded about the amount of supervision required of young children around dogs. Someone needs to be physically between them at all times.

OP your wording wasn’t great at the time but I understand a quick reaction can come off more stern than rational if you were worried/annoyed. Was your nephew frightened and upset by your response, if so I can understand why your sister might react and feel protective. Either way your BIL should have been supervising or suggest a better way of handling it at the time.

What exactly is your sister wanting you to do now. Apologise? To whom? Unless your nephew is now scared of you an apology to him won’t mean anything, he’s probably forgotten the whole thing (although hopefully not the part about leaving the dog alone). Does she want you to apologise to her? Again for what? You say you didn’t yank his arm and unless you terrified him then she is just being over the top.

She expects you to do de facto “gentle parenting” in the heat of the moment but she is allowed to be OTT angry when she wasn’t even there and that’s what I’d point out, we’re not all perfect. I would suggest you apologise for your wording but explain you were annoyed in the moment and worried for the dog’s reaction and hoped you were being firm so it wouldn’t happen again. If nephew was fine point that out and also that BIL was in theory supervising and he didn’t do anything to prevent or stop his son and didn’t feel the need to leap to his defence, so you can’t have been too overboard!

The best thing she could have done is say that she heard what happened and show you the way that she would have handled it. It didn’t have to become a big thing. Finally though, if things are usually okay with your sister perhaps have some understanding - as a mum you can feel crazily overprotective of your little darlings. I remember my sisters ex snapping unjustly at my son once, I saw the look of hurt and bewilderment on my son’s face and honestly I’ve never forgotten it.

To parents on here saying what should have been done (demonstrate a gentle stroke instead) Dog was sleeping...

parents should be teaching children to never touch a sleeping dog

No yanbu. Dad should have watched his child. If the dog had been frightened and snapped or even bitten then what?
so you didn’t say really nice words, better that the the dog bitting.
next time the parents watch their own child.
i’m not sure if the child should know better, but it’s the parents fault anyway rather than the child’s.
i wouldn't apologise.

The issue of her reaction is a moot point as she should not have had to react. Fault is entirely on the active parent.

Are you serious? I'd call it a question designed to make someone see a thing from the point of view of the person they had done it to.
You honestly think "How would you like it it if someone did that to you?" means "I'm going to do that to you"? As an adult you think that?

I'm not sure why you don't understand, so I can't really explain any more clearly.

I love my nephew. I take him on days out and sort out crafts for him I see on Pinterest. I will babysit him occasionally but seeing as I have chosen not to be a parent I enjoy not having to constantly
supervise him when his parents are around.

I think we have a very nice bond. He is quite lovely most of the time.

I thought you were going to say you reacted harshly because you were worried the dog would react and hurt the child.
honesty he’s 2-3 - would have no idea what you said - better to have said no please don’t hurt the dog. Not you are mean etc - I would not let you near kid either as you were mean to a toddler. Your at your parents house suck it up and apologise or leave.

The child wasn’t left unsupervised around her. The child’s father was there…

OP you are not an abuser, you were just trying to get him to understand how it feels from another person/animal's position. At nearly 3 he should understand actually, and if he doesn't so what? He was not bloody threatened! If he'd hit another child I bet you'd get different replies.
When my kids were little I never once saw them hurt anyone including animals, but there were some kids who did, just randomly or maliciously (e.g. to snatch their toys or push them off the slide). Parents often didn't react or not immediately anyway, saying little to their child - as if that's completely normal because "they're just little". I stopped seeing a friend for awhile for that reason, dreading that my son would get hurt again by her DC - who'd previously hit him on the head with a heavy object. I just didn't think her parenting was stern enough and feared her child had learned nothing, so just stopped the playdates.