Disgusted by school’s response to complaint about pervy teacher - Update

[SophEll]

I have debated whether to post this update but I promised I would in the previous thread (www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5325717-disgusted-by-schools-response-to-complaint-about-pervy-teacher) and I’m someone who keeps their word.

I have had an acknowledgment of my email to the Chair of Governors who assures me they will ensure my previous correspondence with the school will be personally overseen by the Headteacher as opposed to the senior member of staff who replied previously.

The Governor has understandably explained that the school cannot share the details of any internal disciplinary action, but has assured me the head teacher will provide me with a further response in due course, and asked me to provide my contact number. I’ve also confirmed that should it be required, my friend would be happy to provide her account of the evening’s events.

This proves that the school previously dismissing this without investigation was inappropriate, so I must say I’m feeling rather smug right now at this vindication. Given their prompt response, the Governor clearly recognises the reputational impact something like this could have on the school.

Thanks to all those who provided suggestions on how best to proceed (including those who said I should have laughed it off, been flattered etc) - I’ll endeavour to provide a further update once the headteacher concludes their investigation. An impressively prompt response by the Chair - the joys of retirement I guess!

I sincerely hope they sack your complaint off. Your submissive DH is now wondering what might happen to him if he ever says anything you take objection to

His comment was crass and revolting but, as a point of semantics, he didn't refer to when he thought about his little fantasy so there's no evidence whatsoever that he was thinking about this at work. For all those frothing about him having sexual fantasies whilst there are children present, he didn't say he had.
He's an adult (albeit a sleazy one) and he is allowed to attempt to chat up women. OP is also an adult and is allowed to tell him to his face how inappropriate his behaviour is, which I feel would have been a better response than reporting him to his place of work.

Thank you 14.5...

Thank you for the high standards you uphold as a teacher. Genuinely. This thread had made me lose faith.

You really are completely delusional. Lots of teachers on here have told you that you are unreasonable and what an adult says to another adult in a bar is not relevant to their workplace, maybe try to listen to those rather than only the ones who agree with you.

And for the thousandth time, the new email just says it has been handed over to someone else.
They are trying to shut up the random woman who has contacted them, it doesn’t mean that anything is actually going to be done differently.

Lots of 'misinformation' here. Governors have a code of conduct. They have to disclose potential conflicts of interest. Many are co-opted based on their skill set, not voted in. They are responsible for holding the school to account, which does not mean running the school day to day. They cannot govern as they choose.

Edited for accuracy

Well firstly I am pretty sure nobody voted for me, I was approached and ask to join the Governing Body and if you don't like the truth then I make no apology for that
If you had any idea the nonsense we deal with on a daily basis you would know that this would hardly raise an eyebrow. It didn't happen at school and OP is not a parent so at best we would write Op a letter to shut here up. Many people with the same experience as me have told OP similar.
And Governors do adhere to certain standards, we have a strict code of conduct that we uphold, I am surprised that you don't know that since you seem to think you know so much about being a school Governor

I’d be repulsed too. I don’t think anyone has said they wouldn’t be.
They’ve just said it’s not something they would report to someone’s employer.

Why? It is this that I think makes you unpopular on the thread. The idea that this is about winning and you have been slighted etc all of which coupled with this makes you seem narcissistic - the whole they need to take me seriously because I am going to win I a fight.

because actually what happened to you was wrong and but the way you are handling it makes you seem narcissistic and unlikable.

You aren’t sure what response you want other than to win? And if you don’t get the response where are you going to go with it.

You say you don’t want to ruin his career but what a process that involved the Union and your friend called in for statements even though given where you were and alcohol being involved even a legal investigation wouldn’t have either of you are reliable witnesses and I have to say I am not sure you come across as well as you think you do

That’s ok as she isn’t a school parent. She was one years ago and now has nothing at all to do with the school.

If he had said it to a current school parent then that would be far more inappropriate.

@SophEll in 2022/23 40,000 teachers left the profession for reasons other than retirement. A similar number left in 2021/22. There is a huge recruitment crisis, and retention is becoming harder and harder.

And is it any wonder? The time spent investigating complaints like yours is considerable. At a crucial time in the academic year no less - exam season is underway.

I feel sad that this male teacher is being judged by you, in this manner, for his behaviour on a night out when he was probably trying hard to take a break from what is an incredibly demanding role. Tell me, OP, had you not have know this man would you have hunted him down to find out his employer? A solicitor, doctor, MP, business owner or whatever.

What do you want to happen? For this man to be put in front of the TRA? To be stripped of his ability to teach? Teachers are human too, they need to have a life outside of their job, just like all of us do. Can you imagine having to be absolutely perfect 24/7, 365 days of the year, for your entire working life? Never putting a foot out of line, never causing offence, holding a stiff upper lip, in every facet of your life?

If you didn’t like what he said, could you not have found your voice and told him you didn’t appreciate his comment and move on?

This post has made me feel very sad, and it will be our youngsters who ultimately miss out as more and more teachers leave the profession to once again be able
have a private life without judgement or scrutiny.

Bloody hell, not this argument again. if teachers don’t want to be subject to complaints then they shouldn’t make a sexually inappropriate comment regarding a school interaction.

It isn’t rocket science.

It doesn't matter whether he was at school or not. We get regular meetings reminding trainees, particularly those in their early 20s who may see school children in pubs/clubs (albeit they are underage) about their behaviour and lines that MUST NOT be crossed, with the Teaching Standards pointed out explicitly.

Then general reminders this includes behaviour like comments to friends when out at Costa and the like about parents etc

It's standard. Academy Trusts will NOT risk their reputation over some sleaze. If OP keeps evidence and follows the complaibts procedure to the letter, patiently, calmly, someone will notice sooner or later that yes, they are serious, yes the behaviour was out of order and yes, something needs to be done, hopefully if someone has some sense an apology to OP for such attitude.

Phoning up and speaking to the receptionists, or the receptionists speaking to someone else in whose interest it is for such a complaint to "disappear" and thus gets the message out that "there's nothing we can do" is both factually and legally (the Teachers' Standards are government standards) incorrect.

He has not harassed her though. He made one comment then walked away. I'd say it's her behaviour that's bordering on harassment, particularly with her latest comment with threatening implications of what will happen if she doesn't get the outcome she wants.

For the love of God OP stop posting.

A school governor does not have to be voted in.

I was approached by the school I was a governor in for 8 years to be community governor. No voting.

*I feel sad that this male teacher is being judged by you, in this manner, for his behaviour on a night out when he was probably trying hard to take a break from what is an incredibly demanding role’

Everybody needs to read this post. Because this is the kind of comment which is defending the man’s behaviour. Don’t say that nobody is defending this creep.

Some of you are claiming that you are not defending him or saying it is okay. But you are minimising it and putting his feelings above the women he has sexually harassed. And yes, that comment he made to the OP is an example of sexual harassment. It is unwelcome, unsolicited and an aggressive sexual comment..

My NHS job is extremely demanding with ridiculous hours and pressures, and we are losing staff and have massive issues with recruitment and retention. It’s absolutely not an excuse however for me to go out, and get drunk and make rude comments and make people feel uncomfortable. No way.

Investing complai lnts like yours, OP is NOT the reason teachers are leaving in droves.

Suffocating workloads, lack of autonomy, leaders backing kids over appalling behaviour, stress, health issues are amongst the top reasons.

His comment is an example of sexual harassment. Again, please do not minimise it.

Agree with you, NotFlown, 100%.

This is where the excusers of such behaviour come in. Teachers have standards to uphold. Teachers know this. Schools know this. People on here defending "poor he" are woefully ignorant and deplorable, to be honest.

How would you know if they have? The absolute most that will happen is a bit of a ticking off. Most likely nothing. Either way you'll get an update saying it's been dealt with and that's all you'll know.

Exactly. Teachers’ terms and conditions are awful. Endless inspections and government interference. Pointless admin. Difficult and challenging parents. All of that is hideous.

But complaints like this absolutely should be investigated properly. And shame on all the teachers here, retired or otherwise that are minimising this man’s behaviour.

The OP is being OTT and her attitude is odd. But I support this teacher being reported to the school and someone senior having a chat with him about it. If nothing else, to protect him and his career in the future. I can’t believe so many are against this.

You can't see the difference between talking about the pupil and making a comment to an adult?

I also don't consider "I thought about bending you over the desk" as graphic sexual harassment but as misguided comments. It's barely graphic

During parents' evening? Maybe after parents evening, over the desk? Who knows? Whatever. Inappropriate. Unprofessional. He needs to know that. I've had lots of conversations with members of staff about unprofessional conduct. We move on.

And here we have a clear threat ladies!