To ask Ex not to do this whilst in my home?

[SaunterOff]

NC as previous posts are very identifiable.
Long and complicated back story to all of this so I’ll post the basics.

ExDH and I are divorced, completely separate homes and lives. However one of our DC has serious health issues so X comes and stays here for in total 12 nights a month, usually a weekend and possibly 1 night in the week. This is to help with ill DC and he can’t have them at his because of equipment etc.

When ExDH is here i give him my bed and stay in DC room on a pull out bed because ExDH won’t wake up if needed in the night.

Ex is on dating sites and has had contact with other women, he’s told me this without being asked, personally I think he did it in an attempt to make me jealous with the way it was said. However with DC being ill and needing so much of my time, I have absolutely no interest in what Ex is up to and it cemented in my mind who he really is. The one thing I have asked is that he doesn’t talk to these women on dating sites whilst in my bed, when he is supposed to be here helping with DC but also I find it really disrespectful and awful to think of him in there doing that whilst I’m next to our ill child. I have said if he is more focused on that then perhaps cut his time here or go back to his own place in the evenings. Just don’t do that in my bed.

Ex has now said I’m being unreasonable and abusive asking him not to talk to women whilst he’s here, I honestly don’t know if I am? I know exactly what he’s like and what he gets up to so I don’t feel I’m being unrealistic in that thought. I also believe by his reaction that it’s exactly what he has been doing. I’ve also thought to myself if it was the other way around I wouldn’t be doing that in his bed or his home. I’ve likened it to asking someone kindly not to smoke in the house or to take their shoes off. He has said that if he’s not allowed to then neither am I, which as I said I’m not but that’s because caring for DC has taken over my entire life, but also it’s my home and my bed.

So, am I being unreasonable/abusive asking him not to be talking dirty to women whilst in my bed?

He's a guest in your house - even if an unwanted one. So he should sleep on the guest bed / sofa / air-bed.

You only give up your bed if it's someone you want to , someone you respect, someone you care about - e.g. much loved mum come to stay.

Who is deciding the days when he comes over?

No you are quite within your rights to make the rules when he is in your home, let alone bed!
im confused as to what help he actually is if you have to give up your bed as he wont wake up tho??
I assumed you were not in the home and were having respite outside the home!
I wouldn’t have him taking my bed, reclaim it, otherwise its pointless him being there.
i had a similar thing with my ex insisting on coming to my mums, weekly visit, and to be sat texting women and ignoring our kids and being totally disconnected!

It sounds as if it suits you better that he wasn’t there at all, but you are stuck in a dynamic where he calls the shots. I have been in this situation and I know how difficult it is to say no to them.

I think you should double down on insisting my house, my rules. It doesn’t matter if your rules are reasonable or not and it doesn’t matter whether he calls you unreasonable or not. If you don’t really want him there, then perhaps make it restrictive enough that even he doesn’t want to be there. Definitely take your bed back.

Like me, you may have wanted a divorce to get away from being controlled and bullied by a partner.

My only caveat is that my ex H would find a way to ‘punish’ me if I ever, ever gainsaid his wishes - maybe yours will do the same?

Grow a backbone. Why are you giving him choice? It’s your home. Are you vulnerable or do you have carers of your own? It sounds very odd that an adult cannot tell another adult that they don’t have permission to stay over and certainly cannot sleep in your bed.

Well wanking in your bed is going to be the least of your concerns when he does have a "proper relationship". What's he going to do? Bring his new girlfriend with him and they have sex in your bed whilst you're sleeping on a pull out in your child's bedroom?!

Come on OP. Sorry to be harsh but he's using you / the situation massively to his advantage and you're being walked all over. He's getting a cosy night in a nice bed, chatting to other women and getting a good nights sleep and you're being made to feel like a guest in your own home.

@WellINeverrr exactly as @femfemlicious says - I think it's very helpful to try to understand that not all abuse is purposeful or done with full awareness (obviously, some is).

A lot of these men genuinely do not understand why they are getting push back on their demands. From what OP writes about her ex, I suspect he is very much in this camp.

And as a result, they can never stop to think about any one else's perspective. The sad truth is that as a result, many of them alienate a lot of other people in their lives over time and land up sad and lonely. But while I feel sorry for them, I nonetheless am 100% on the side of their victims.

Examples of this I've seen in real life and heard on here in various versions:

• Being confused when other people (including police) did not understand that breaking into a bedroom to steal her phone was a legitimate response to the fact that he believed she was dating other men.

• Being angry that she will not allow him to continue living in her house post break up - she is breaking up the familiy/ causing trauma with the children.

• Believing, truly and deeply, that she is alienating him from the children because she insists that he needs to take them back to his/out of the house during his contact time. This one gets abuse added if she tells him that she does not have food to feed them so he must feed them, as per their agreement, before he brings them home (one friend had him threatening to call social services to tell them she was neglectful).

• My personal favourite - real life - contacting HER friends and family and shouting at them becuase they have a) not stopped her "behaviour" b) not invited him to their events/occassions post break up and c) to blame them for his break up.
• Threatening to take the children for full custody to get them away from her "toxic" "neglectful" "abusive" "manipulative" behaviour. Particularly amusing when said man has never made a meal, done a bedtime or a school run etc. But they truly BELIEVE it.

OK, so let’s look at the evidence
”When ExDH is here i give him my bed and stay in DC room on a pull out bed because ExDH won’t wake up if needed in the night.”
“he apparently wants to be here.
”this is his want to apparently see DC”
”I had offered the sofa, an airbed, or another pull out but apparently again all of that is abusive.”
“Carers are a lovely team and are often irritated by Ex presence”
”Ex would frequently undermine me”

So, it’s OK for you to sleep in a pull out bed, but not him - and he sleeps in your bed. OP, this really has to stop - he’s exerting control over you: you don’t even have your own bed that’s just for you.
He is hooking up with other women while in your bed - this is adding insult to injury.
You have offered him the use of your car to go home, but this is too much faff - I bet it is: he can’t control you if he’s not in your house.
He irritates the carers and undermines you - so what exactly is it that he’s doing to help, that’s so important that he has to stay overnight? He’s not waking up to be with DC; he’s not helping; he’s insisting on staying; he’s actively proving a hindrance. He needs to be gone. If he can only see DC in your home, then make it during the day/evening - but you need to INSIST that he leaves. This is such an unreasonable state of affairs - tell him to go home to communicate with his other women. You shouldn’t be putting rules in place in your own home because it’s a situation that should never have arisen. It needs to stop.

It sounds like with the stress and tiredness of having a poorly child - he has ground you down with his bullshit. It is not in the slightest bit abusive for you to sleep in your own bed in your own house. I would tell him the overnights need to stop unless he moves to the couch etc. If he says you won't cope then you can say well we will see how we go and revisit the situation if I can't .

You are divorced, do not have a friendly relationship, he is not supporting you and calling the shots in your home.

This. Even my most loved family members wouldn't be sleeping in my bed if they came to stay. Never mind my Ex.

Jesus fucking Christ.

Yes, it’s all of this. I am fearful of what he will do, and of course he will create, it will be distressing for DC especially the poorly one. This is what is putting me off. I felt I could appeal to his better nature by asking him just to be respectful of my bedroom, my space.
Now seeing how he’s reacted to that anything else is going to be a lot worse as he’ll see it as me not letting him see the DC. I know a little bit from before.

I bet any women he's getting involved with don't realise he's sleeping in his ex's bed half the month

Very good point!

I’ve likened it to asking someone kindly not to smoke in the house or to take their shoes off.

It's not like that at all. It's like asking a guest not to piss in your shower.

1. you can't really police it like you can shoes or smoking
2. decent people would not need to be told
3. if you have someone in your life who you suspect is that gross, you just don't have them over to stay.

Your DC's illness is clouding the issue here. You don't need or want your ex to stay over. He's gross and untrustworthy and deliberately trying to upset you. Tell him he's not welcome.

Be aware in advance (as you are) that he will whine and complain and accuse you of abuse blah blah blah. Look up grey rock techniques and have your answers ready.

Remind yourself that no decent parent would even WANT to do that when specifically staying over to see their poorly DC. Therefore his judgement is completely untrustworthy and anything that comes out of his mouth about abuse from you is so much bullshit.

Serious question @SaunterOff - do you not feel him being in your bedroom is a massive invasion of privacy? Or do you like him being there (just when he's not texting other women)?

Because your bedroom should be your safe space and haven from the rest of the house. And yours is being taken over for 1/3 of a month by someone else whilst you have to vacate it. Just the thought of that makes me feel very uncomfortable...

Nobody’s ex husband should be in their bedroom let alone their bed.

Having had a very ill child I think this isn’t necessarily a great thing for ds either. My child had seizures too. Do you have a monitor? The consultant could help or your epilepsy nurse.

Exactly this!

You sound exhausted OP. I don't envy your situation.
I can imagine sometimes it's less exhausting & time consuming to just let him win his petty battles than go through the torturous arguments with a manipulator.

But despite being tired and overloaded, this is clearly bothering you, so it's a fight with having.

Tell him no more sleepovers in your bed. No debate, it's blurring the boundaries and you're uncomfortable.
In response to 'thats abusive' - neutral voice 'No Steve, just because something's not to your liking doesnt mean it's abusive. You cant sleep in my bed anymore' on repeat. Again & again.

You have validation and confirmation here that you are not being unreasonable to want your space & your bed back. .I think the dating sites are a red herring, it's not really that.

If he chucks his dolly and refuses to 'help' anymore, might it be for the best in terms of you getting more outside help?

This. And a lock on the OPs bedroom door for her use only so he can't take over her bed IF he is invited over

So, if you don't do as he says, you're the "abusive one"?

Sounds like a classic case of DARVO. It's something an abuser would say.

I felt I could appeal to his better nature by asking him just to be respectful of my bedroom, my space.

OP, I completely get this. And this is the sort of thing SIL used to say. But you can't. he does not have a "better" nature because he is intrinsically entitled, and his thinking is irrational.

She has spent years tying herself in nots to be fair, to be kind, to be accomodating, always thinking that if she just shows him how reasonable and accomodating and compromising she is being, he will respond in turn. But he does not. Because he cannot. That's not how he thinks and operates (and yes, as he rapidly approaches 60 - he has no friends, can't hold down a job etc becuase these behaviours have caused endless issues in every aspect of his life over time, not just in his relationship with her and his DC).

I can't emphasise this enogh - you need to decide on what you 100% know is fair and reasonable, and then ignore everything he says/accuses you of. tell other people and ask their advice (on MN, in real life, the carers) so that you can feel 100% confident in what you are saying to him no matter what.

@SaunterOff - But you can't ask / tell him what to do on his phone. What you CAN do is tell him that you don't want him in the house / don't want him to stay over / aren't giving him lifts anymore. But you have lay down and accepted he makes all the rules. But then you want to be in charge of his phone usage! You have your priorities all wrong I'm afraid....

Do you seriously think - given that you have said he won't listen to anything else you have asked of him - that he's going to take on board and respect your request that he doesn't text other women?!

I totally agree. It's because they were brought up thinking they need to be in control as a "man". They are supposed to be able to control their families, when they can't, they become irate

When I left an abusive relationship I was still firmly under his control for the first couple of years. He made so many threats against me, accused me if abuse, tired to isolate me etc. In some ways it was worse than when we were still together.

Womens aid were really helpful in proving counselling and support to put more firm boundaries in place. That was for my sake as well as the kids.

It's much easier said than done but I think you need suppor from specialist DV services to be able to stand up to him more. From what you describe I don't think overnights are helpful at all. If he has to come to your house to provide care can you average it so you go out for the evening to see friends, join a club, go to the gym etc?

And OP, this is the man who told you you were being abusive by asking him to sleep downstairs / on an airbed in your home. Do you really, seriously think he has a "better nature" or cares about respecting you?!

He’s the abusive one not you, it’s all about his control over you. Get him out of your bed and if he’s not helping with your child then there’s no need for him to be there. I know you probably want him to take accountability for your child but this is the wrong way.

Send him a text saying you won’t be able to put him up going forward. You don’t have to do it, it’s not helping, and you don’t like it.