Living beyond our means.. will it ever end!

[Wharawho]

Aibu, to be completely fed up with living month to month and barely being able to pay for everything?

For context, we're a family of five... me, DH and 3DS.(7, 6 & 3)
Household income of £70k
3 bed semi- mortgaged (nearly £1k a month- this double last feb when the interest rate went up 😞)
2 cars (15yo car paid off and family car on pcp at £450p/m)
For context we need the family car to fit all 3 kids carseats in and I also require a big car for my business. I hate having finance, but we can't work without two cars or even go out as a family if we had one small car! And we definitely don't have the money to buy another outright.

Despite what I think is a reasonable household income, 1 week after being paid, almost every penny is claimed by our household bills and expenses and we spend the rest of the month penny pinching.
We're one big unexpected bill away from not being able to buy the shopping and I'm fed up of it to be honest!
We don't have big expensive holidays or eat out/ have lots of takeaways.
If anything I'd say we live quite modestly... we've lived in the same house for 6 years and still haven't be able to finish renovating it, as we don't have the money!
I haven't had my hair cut for 2 years, as I can't commit that much money to myself... I'm also in desperate need of a new pair of glasses, but I can't afford to buy a new pair ( I have to wear them all the time!)
Days out tend to be outdoor places, with a homemade picnic and maybe an ice cream for the kids!

We buy our clothes from places like Tesco and primark, rarely do me and DH get anything only when we really need something, just the kids and we pass down clothes through our boys as they grow to save on money.
The kids attend swimming lessons once a week, this is their only "luxury" or "extra thing" they do I'm all honesty, and something we prioritise, as we think it's important that they can swim! Even this I price shopped for the cheapest lessons to make sure we pay as little as possible!
We do have the typical Netflix, Disney etc and go for a Costa 2 times each month, but again nothing extravagant... just living and trying enjoy small pleasures and have something to look forward to!

I paid myself today and after all of our bills and food money we literally have £160 to last the month,.. which includes entertaining the kids, buying school clothes/shoes, treats, covering unexpected expenses or car/house repairs!
We don't have enough to save for a rainy day fund and the minute something comes up, any savings we do have are gone and we're back to square 1!
Last month the 15yo car needed new brakes/ discs and a few other bits to pass its mot, setting us back £500.... we paid for it on our monzo flex (we only use this in emergencies when we really can't afford and pay it back ASAP!) but now this has left us short last month and this month paying it back! (As I say... one bill away from despair)

I work for myself, from home and my business requires lots if space (I've converted our garage)... however my business is limited by my space and to grow and make more money I need a bigger work space/ bigger home.... which we can't afford!

How do people afford to go on holidays, have big flash cars and big 4 bed detached houses?!?!
18 year old me would have been thrilled to bring in £70k... but here we are struggling to make it through to the end of each month!

I guess this is just a rant really, as I'm feeling so deflated looking at our bank balance before the month has even started! 😞
Please tell me I'm not the only one experiencing this!

For me the answer is debt, plain and simple. I accept it as a fact of my life. I have been in debt since the age of 18 and now, pushing 50, I am still in debt. I take full responsibility for my debt, but without it, my life would be miserable. I want to take holidays, and buy books, and have expensive pets, so I have made my choices and I have to live with them.

Does your business actually make money? Would you be better off getting a paid job at this point and revisit the business later?

This probably isn’t the right forum as loads of people will be along soon to tell you you’re the equivalent of an oligarch, read the room, they live on £7 a week and eat moss and they love it etc. Apparently MSE has a good forum of budgeters that will help you.

I really don't know how people afford big cars and expensive holidays and pay a mortgage on what I consider (like you do) to be a decent income.
As to where your money goes, have you really checked your credit cards and bank statements?
We seem to have an extraordinary number of small Amazon purchases which we really should just stop, (you never want it once you've got it, you just want the next thing)
And we can have weeks where no one is very organised so we go the supermarket because there's nothing in for dinner, almost every day, and waste money there too. (I have just discovered the batch lady which is slightly changing my life with regard to cooking for the family)
Being frugal takes organisation and planning, sometimes I just don't want to bother, but it costs more and then I regret it.

It is frustrating and many people are on the same boat and worse. Wage stagnation in the UK has been awful while house prices and rents and the cost of public transport has been steadily rising.

However I think 70k isn’t a high income for two adults with three kids to be bringing in.

I’m on around 50K as a single person and I’d struggle with less.

Could you cut down on the subscriptions? I don't mean going without entirely, instead switching from one to another each month rather than having multiple going in parallel.

Do you really need both cars? I know that you say that you need your one for your business but what about the other one? Could your husband get away with cycling to work and using yours for the odd time that he needs a car?

They're is a big difference between a single income and joint incomes providing that household income in terms of tax.
As per a precious poster: does your business make money?
£450 per month is a lot for a car.
Plus lots of kids are expensive, but could make do with hand me downs.

Your mortgage isn't crazy, so what is your full budget? People might be able to help.
Stopping Disney and Netflix alone must be £20 per month. The is a lot of free Tele available.
The car is expensive.

Maybe a couple of very frugal months might give you a buffer for big bills.

@WinterMorn I don’t blame you. You only live once and and all that. People glorify frugal living on MN but it’s not for everyone.

I was having a hard time a few years back and I went on a 3 week trip to a country I used to live in to get a break, experience better weather and see old friends - and I absolutely didn’t regret it even though it put me in debt for a while.

Thank you colorifc. You are right in all that you say!

I would get rid of the smaller car you still have outgoings on it even if it’s paid off. You said you wfh anyway. I would cut out the Costa trips they are unnecessary. Also I don’t have Netflix and Disney at the same time. It’s one or the other and we flip between them at points in the year. If you just need reading glasses could you just get the cheapie pairs from Poundland? You don’t say what your other expenses but I’m wondering about contract phones? It’s cheaper to get reconditioned handset from CEX or wherever and cheap sim only deal? Sorry if you’ve done all this already but hope this helps? Get some kids clothes etc or even for yourself off vinted? Just until you become more comfortable?

This probably isn’t the right forum as loads of people will be along soon to tell you you’re the equivalent of an oligarch, read the room, they live on £7 a week and eat moss and they love it etc

This made me laugh but it’s very accurate 😆

I hope this is not going to come across too blunt - but to put it candidly 70k in this day and age is not enough if you have 3 kids. But from what you listed what really sticks out is the 450 p/month for the car - that is an insane amount of money. And is t pcp - something like a lease so it’s never paid off? Not sure I would have made that choice. Any chance you can get a job until you can get a nest egg?

My business is relatively new- 2 years old.... its finally making enough that I can pay myself minimum wage, but as I say I'm limited due to my workspace ... a real catch 22! We've looked at moving, but ot would be financial suicide and just isn't worth the risk when things are so tight already!
I left a 16 year career in the NHS, after burning out and also coming to the realisation that I was working for nothing in a job I detested, because of having to pay for childcare.
Whilst I make a fraction of what I did, my business allows me to work around the kids, we don't have to pay for childcare now and I'm actually 1000% times happier (excluding the financial woes 😬)
I've definitely considered doing a salaried job or even adding some part time hours on top of my business, but i know I'd likely be looking at an entry level pay, which would leave us worse off, as we'd have to pay before and after school childcare for the 3 kids (in our area its £75 per day!). Now I'm able to do the school runs and work whilst they're home with me!

🤣🤣 I'm waiting for it... unfortunately me the DH and DS's need to live off more than Moss to survive!

Honestly, I think those people who are doing better will have a combo of:

family help
both parents having professional well remunerated jobs or skilled trades that bring in lots of income; your combined salary is my single salary in a single adult household but I really struggle these days
fewer children
lower material expectations.£450 on a car is crazy. You’d be much better off getting a cheap , older, Japanese car on repayment finance. I can recommend Honda Jazz for space - second to none.

£70k and you are struggling?

Your situation is really similar to mine. We don't have a pcp, just a paid-off 5 year old and a 25 year old banger, but our mortgage is higher.

I realised that we have stagnated. We were alright before kids, but now we need to grow to keep up with the bits and bobs that kids require and in fact just to keep up with inflation. A job that I do contracting for raised the rate I receive by 2.2% this year. Despite this being the official inflation rate, it doesnt come close to the real year on year cost changes we are seeing.

I am looking at ways to move in a different direction and I am hopeful after years of despair.

I also realised that I had become my parents in that everything seems more expensive than I imagine it should be. Similar to how supposedly no-one listens to new music after the age of 35, no-one keeps up mentally with inflation after the age of about 25.

So, my age 25 salary seemed healthy at the time, and a potential future wage of £70k looked huge from there. Now, I still see £70k as huge, but it really isn't, it's closer to what I was earning at 25, but in "today's money". My income hasn't gone up to match my needs as I've built a family, it has only really gone up to follow inflation, and even then, not really.

ETA I'm not even on £70k but I don't think it's mega bucks for a family as a combined income. To all of us managing (or not) on much less, even less so, and good luck to us all. It isn't a race to the bottom and whether we're on 25k or 70k, life is hard.

Yea the car is a lot isn’t it. It’s half your mortgage. There must be a way to get a cheaper big car.

They’ve arrived. Is there a Bat Signal that goes out?

@Wharawho Civil service is great to work around the kids. They are very flexible. It’s stressful and you don’t get paid as much as the private sector but great when kids are small.

What do you mean by that?

£70k between two people is a rather modest salary. Hopefully, once your business takes off, you will have more money coming in.

I've thought about the civil service.... I've thought about a lot of avenues and selfishly, maybe more my self preservation, I've realised that after 16 years in a "good" nhs career that I hated and made me a shell of a person, I can never work in something that I don't love. 😞
My business is small, pays me a fraction of what I used to earn and isn't likely to ever reach the same salary, but goodness me, it makes me so happy! I literally adore what I do and genuinely can't wait to work!

I just don't know what's better, work in a career that I adore, but pays peanuts or in a career that pays ok money, but breaks me as a person! 😞😞😞

@BlessedBeTheGroot I mean the people like yourself who arrive on every. single. thread. where people earn above tuppence a week to castigate them, mockingly say “if you earn so much money why can’t you google this yourself”, call them names, informed they are crap at budgeting and/or thick, tell them to fuck off in some cases, because people who earn more than minimum wage are not allowed to discuss it on Mumsnet unless to get on their knees in supplication and apology at earning So Much.

I appreciate your position and applaude you for your f* it, I'm going to enjoy myself position... I wish i could do this!
Debt scares me in all honesty, so I don't think I could ever do this personally!
But I don't blame you in the slightest!

I think you are making your own choice there then. You could increase the earning capacity of the family but choosing not to…. Completely fair enough but it comes with not having enough money to do all the things you want to do.
How about an evening job with no childcare needed? Pub/petrol station etc?

I don't do that. I have never told anyone to Google anything about budgeting, or told them to fuck off, or call them thick. Feel free to quote me where I have done that.
I used to be in a high earning household myself. I am now on benefits. I have seen both sides of it all.