To ask DM to stop smoking in her own house

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My mum, now in her 50s, has been a heavy smoker as long as I can remember. I was embarrassed by it as a teenager because my school uniform always smelled smoky, and people would make comments at school (none of my friends parents smoked then, and actually my DM is the only person I know who smokes to this day). I've never been a smoker myself and I can't stand the smell of stale smoke.

DM knows I dislike it and makes a point of smoking outside when I visit her (she lives alone). But it's really obvious that she smokes indoors the rest of the time. The smell of smoke hits as soon as you walk in the door. Every room smells of it, even those she doesn't use and definitely doesn't smoke in, such as the guest bedroom I sleep in. When she buys gifts, I have to wash them before use because they smell. When I visit her, I have to shower soon as I get home and wash everything I've taken into her house, the smell is so strong (DH avoids visiting her now because he hates it too, and won't come near me until I've showered after a visit). She herself smells very unpleasant, despite trying to mask with gum and perfume.

I'm about to have my first child, her first grandchild, as I'm an only child myself. She's very excited and I know she's picturing the kind of relationship she had with her gran and I had with mine - sleepovers at hers and quality time together just the two of them. And selfishly, I hope for the same thing, so that DH and I can catch the odd break and enjoy time together! But, I really hate the idea of my child going into a smoky environment, both for health reasons and the practical/aesthetic issue of everything being smelly and needing washing after every visit.

DM clearly doesn't realise that it smells and is "noseblind" to it; if she did, she wouldn't bother to go outside to smoke in my presence, and she obviously thinks she's being courteous to me by doing so. I'm sure she would do the same when her grandchild visits. But the problem isn't the fresh smoke, it's the embedded smoke. Would it be unreasonable for me to tell her how bad she and her house smells, and to request that she puts a stop to indoor smoking altogether, as a condition to have her GC in her house? (And if any MNetters agree this is fine, advice on how to handle it sensitively would be appreciated!).

YANBU - a smoky environment is horrible and not suitable for a child.
YABU - it's her house and she's entitled to smoke in it if she chooses.

Yes, this. OP, do you think you could have a conversation with her explaining about the smell of her house and anything that’s been in it? She probably honestly doesn’t realise.

Having a grandchild could be the impetus for her to make big changes in her life.

Smokers’ houses do stink. If they have been doing it for years it’s very hard to get the smell out even if the house is sold or they stop.
you have to pretty much remove all furniture and clothing, wash anything fabric and deep clean or repaint walls.

realistically she isn’t going to do that.

this isn’t necessarily a conversation that you need to have all at once.

before the baby is born start dropping into conversation things about smoking. Say how happy you are that she goes outside to smoke as you don’t like being exposed to it. Make up a friend whose relatives smoke and say oh my god she exposes her baby to smoke I could never do that.

basically start dripping into her ear how much you hate smoking. Do this over a period of time.

when the baby is born, start talking about how protective you feel about him/her and how much you want to give them a healthy start.

your mum will start to read the mood music, and get the hint. Then you can have the conversation later on about how you don’t want the baby exposed to smoke at all, and you have laid the groundwork for it.

It’s funny, though, how all these perfectly well-informed smokers stay quiet about the issue and do nothing to solve it.

Its always left others to raise it and, frequently, they kick off when it’s pointed out that 1) they stink and 2) they’re putting people like their grandkids at risk.

Just don't take your child there, there's second hand smoke and lingering foulness.

Tell her if she wants to see baby,she can't have smoked for X hours and she must wash and change clothes.

Get some evidence behind you to share. Your child, especially a newborn is at a real risk to her smoking. After that, the choice is really hers. I don't think you can tell her what to do in her own home, but you can let her know why you can't go with your baby.

What do you mean when you say my response is "pretty telling"? I didn't assume anything, I just didn't understand the practicality of what the poster was suggesting I do (it also happened to be the first reply, hence why I responded to it directly). I asked @faerietales a question about it, and they have politely explained further what they think I ought to do. Struggling to see what your argument with me is here.

Keep it all about you and what you need.

’I’m sorry I can’t have baby coming here at all as the house is so full of smoke. You can come to mine instead.’ Repeat. Ignore any complaining or arguing about it. If she says she’s upset about it, mirror it back to her - ‘yes mum, it upsets me too that your house isn’t a healthy environment for any of us.’

What she chooses to do from there is her responsibility and her business. Don’t give her any conditions or tell her what she needs to do, let her handle that. If she chooses to stop smoking and redecorate (replaster by the sounds of it!) - great.

Sometimes you only initiate change in others by focusing on yourself and staying firm to what you need. Then they reorganise themselves around you if they care enough.

Yes much better

I've never been a smoker, and I dislike it. But you can't tell a person what to do in their own house - that's ridiculous.

before the baby is born start dropping into conversation things about smoking. Say how happy you are that she goes outside to smoke as you don’t like being exposed to it. Make up a friend whose relatives smoke and say oh my god she exposes her baby to smoke I could never do that.
basically start dripping into her ear how much you hate smoking. Do this over a period of time.

Don’t do this - it’s manipulative. Have a straightforward, honest and calm conversation about it.

In my experience smoking is an addiction similar to many other 'nastier' types, in that people will persist regardless of any rational conversations to persuade them otherwise. My mum prioritised smoking - money for smoking and freedom to smoke above everything including her own life, and she told herself and others lies to excuse and justify it. It really was very similar to the behaviour of alcoholics and other addicts.

I think you just need to be really blunt.

Mum, I won't be visiting you any more because smoking isn't safe for pregnant women, babies or children and my baby will not be coming to your house at all. If you want to see me and baby you will need to visit us, and will need to shower and be smoke-free. I know you have never protected me or anyone else from your smoking, but I will be protecting my child from the harm smoking causes and it's not negotiable, so please have a think about what you will want to do and whether you are willing to make changes in order to meet your grandchild.

At the moment she's living in a fantasy and you're not meeting that with reality.

I think the birth of her first grandchild might be the catalyst for her to stop smoking, it worked for my DH!
You could buy her the Allen Carr's Easyway to stop smoking book, they do an audio version and courses. There's a website too. She'll need your support but it really could be the best thing to happen to her, alongside your precious child.

You can’t tell her what to do and if she’s that nose blind anyway, she will just carry on and think opening a window will solve it. I sympathise - a step parent of mine smokes and whilst we are there it’s outside the house but it still lingers from when they smoke the rest of the time. Truly nothing worse for a baby.

Could she stay at yours for sleepovers/babysitting? To be honest if it’s in her clothes it won’t be good for her to snuggle your newborn either! :(

Because they're addicted and addiction is a powerful drug.

They don't need people to tell them they smell or whatever - they know - they just don't care enough to change. You can't pressure someone out of an addiction - they have to want to do it themselves.

My granddad stopped smoking the second I got diagnosed with a potentially fatal lung/heart complication a few weeks after birth. He stopped so he would be able to see me, as the first grandchild, as otherwise the medical risks were way too high. My husband quit when he realised how much it could affect my health, wasn’t concerned for himself but was for me. 1 week into our relationship and he had stopped buying them and finished his last.
I firmly believe in being upfront and honest;
“Hi mum, I love you very much, and I’m looking forward to baby loving you just as much. However, you have become blind to the smell in your house. It seeps into everything and you must have noticed DH stopped coming around. Well, this baby is very precious and we have decided we don’t want him/her around your house because of the embedded smoke. It gets trapped in everything and is incredibly harmful to babies and children. If you continue smoking in the house, we will have to have visits at my house only, especially as I don’t want my baby getting sick from second hand smoke.
I know the truth sometimes hurts, but this is why I want to clear the air now. I know you smoked around me growing up, but these days we know better so we do better. The choice is up to you, but I really don’t want you to miss on baby growing up because of something like this that can be sorted!”
Then let the chips fall where they may. Your mum can make choices having all the facts. And you don’t need to leave your baby somewhere stinky.

It’s a super tricky one op and I feel for you.

Smoke smells awful and it is dangerous.

Yet I kind of agree that she’s entitled to live how she wants.

I think the best course here is total honesty. Tell her there is something you want to chat about. Maybe at a cafe so she is less likely to blow up and not hear you out - unless you feel that she’d feel manipulated by that. I think just say what you have told us: you love your mum and you really want her involved in the life of your baby. However you have to do your best for your baby’s health and passive smoking is a problem. Tell her you know you can’t ask her to live her life the way you want her to, but it would really mean a lot to you for her to be active as a grandparent.

And ask her what you can do?

It may cause her to think. What you have on your side is the fact you have been tolerant(ish) up till now. You can use that to make the point it is simply an issue of your baby’s health. She might be upset at first but it may get her thinking.

Ultimately you need to hand this to her to solve as she’s the only one who can.

OP's mum is 55 years old. She knows smoking is bad for her - she doesn't live under a rock.

To be clear, when I said leaflets about dangers, I didn't mean about danger of smoking to the OP's mum. Yes, obviously OP's mum knows that!

I meant danger to the baby - OP's mum might not know that. It's a long time since OP was a baby, research and advice has changed significantly in that time. Also so that OP would have the official advice to hand to back her up, so her mum can't dismiss her as OTT or too fussy.

OP wanted advice of how to approach her mum. That was mine.

Unless she stops smoking now and entirely redecorates/replaces all soft furnishings, the smell will remain. My mum is the same. Her very small house stinks. She gave me 2 items of clothing last year, I had to wash them before I could go near them. She wanted me to sell a lovely teddy bear fleece coat for her recently and I had to tell her it would only get a few quid. Trouble was, it had been hung up in her entrance hall which is open so stank. Even stuff in the drawers upstairs (she only smokes downstairs) absolutely reeks.

You can’t ask her to stop smoking but obviously you won’t want to expose your baby to secondhand smoke. You need to tell her that you won’t be able to visit her. She will be aware of why. If she’s an hour away, can’t she use public transport to visit you? Even then, I think the advice is no smoking for (don’t know how long) before holding the baby, wash hands, change clothes etc.

Yes I agree. Only maybe don’t use the phrase “ I want to clear the air!” 🤣

You can't tell her not to smoke in her own house but you can tell her that you won't be bringing the baby round to see her and there will be no sleep-overs either.

It's then her choice to carry on smoking and deal with the consequences of having a very different relationship with her grandchild that you did with your grandparents.

Hopefully, this will encourage her to stop smoking. Does she know about how awful you felt as a child as the only one who stank of cigarettes at school?

You can’t tell her not to smoke in her own home but you must explain that you and dc won’t be visiting her there so you’ll need to meet up elsewhere.

My die hard smoker mother stopped smoking in her house when the first grandchild came along nearly 20 years ago.
She thought it was fine just to not smoke in the house when he was there but I pointed out to her the dangers of 3rd hand smoke and that absolutely everything was covered in it. I also guilted her for the health risks to my poor non smoking dad. She still to this day only smokes outside even though all the grandkids are almost adults now.
This was a woman who smoked in the house throughout my own childhood, on the buses next to me, in restaurants, everywhere! Smoking indoors is grim and I told her she wouldn't be seeing her grandchild if she continued smoking indoors. Can you not just be straight with your mum?

Clear the air, literally and figuratively! 😂

She will know - smokers aren't stupid. She's just addicted.