To feel lied to about the menopause

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I’m struggling hideously, cry at the drop of a hat and want to scream with frustration.

Why does no one tell you this.

I remember clear as day being told at school that one day when you’re about 50 your periods will stop. Fantastic I thought one day this hell of monthly inconvenience will cease. And cease it did, brilliant. But then. The past three years have been the worse years of my life.

I tried HRT and it didn’t seem to help, it made me irritable and experience anxiety that was difficult for me to cope with. That was a year ago. I’m now in the same place. Someone please tell me it gets better.

If HRT taken properly at a decent dose doesn't help, then menopause isn't the issue. It's depression, or anxiety, or a crap lifestyle.

Japanese women eat a vast amount of soya, which contains phytoestrogens. So it's not that they don't have symptoms because they don't make a fuss. It's that their symptoms are likely less, and they don't report them in any case, so nobody knows.

Not reporting symptoms is a very certain way of minimising the actual significance of something, and not at all a sign that somehow the menopause is fulfilling, or a conspiracy on the part of the patriarchy.

It's different for everyone, some sail through it, some struggle a bit and some really suffer

But it's been all over the place in the last couple of years so I don't know why you think it's been hidden away

Forgot to add the brain fog as well honestly thought I was going mad or had early stage dementia.
Its all very well saying information is out there but when it happens to you overnight it’s scary and makes you feel so isolated.

@User14March Can you explain where you're coming from with this?
The dose of estrogen is licenced. With gel it's a max of 4 pumps day, patches are 100mcgs, tablets 2 mgs, etc.

Any dose above that would be through a consultant who was willing to prescribe that dose for a particular reason, with caveats like pelvic scans to check the womb lining or a higher dose of progesterone to balance it.

What are you using and why are you unwittingly at risk perhaps?

There was a discussion about very high doses last year and the advice from the British Menopause Society was what I've said here. Doses should be within the licenced amount.

I’ve lived in Japan. They don’t all eat vast amounts of soya. Maybe a bit more than here with tofu but not in the quantities you would need for it to have a massive impact. Japanese men also eat more soya but don’t sprout breasts.
I do feel for those who suffer badly with symptoms but by telling women that it’s definitely going to be absolutely awful, that they will become suicidal, get permanent brain fog and not want to leave the house (all of which I have been told, totally unsolicited, by several people who seem to do nothing but talk about perimenopause) it’s really not helping. It makes me anxious and dreading of it.
There’s also loads of supplements, menopause coaches, private consultants, menopause reps at work and constant articles in the media about it. It’s in no way hidden away - quite the opposite. In the past, women got on with it, managed to hold down their jobs and lives without some discourse of doom. I genuinely think that was better.

Not in my case, obviously I can't speak for others. I had awful periods, heavy, irregular very painful, etc, yet I had an easy menopause. My sisters were the complete opposite.

In the past, women got on with it, managed to hold down their jobs and lives without some discourse of doom. I genuinely think that was better.

Except they didn't.

The vast majority of women were stay ay home mums and wives. There were professional women of course but many weren't. And they often stopped work around 50. OR like so many of my mum's friends, they were prescribed tranquillisers. (These are the women now in their 90s.)

And until relatively recently, women were not living for 35 or 40+ years post menopause.

There's lot of talk about oestrogen replacement. I for example have always produced oestrogen in excess hence the intermittent painful breasts at over 60. I believe I still produce too much which helps in many ways like no loss of libido etc although I also believe it makes me more prone to breast cancer. I wouldn't take HRT when I think I actually need less hormones not more. We are a strange bunch. Men are the fortunate ones. Ah well,one day at a time is all you can do.

Simplepink's question was about PMT not painful periods.

I think we all feel we could kiss you for that encouragement @Applesonthelawn ! 🤣

Might you need more progesterone to balance it out? I suspect I may be oestrogen dominant at the moment too as that seems normal in early perimenopause and I have fibroids.
Someone else mentioned oestrogen dominance earlier in the thread, but the last time I mentioned it on MN I was told that UK medics don't believe in it...

I felt like I’d been lied to about five years ago when I turned 40, so I know what op means. It was around the time media coverage of menopause exploded and I joked that it was because I’d become middle-aged, ha ha! Then, reading some of those stories, realised it wasn’t a joke since I wasn’t a decade or so away as I’d assumed.

Like others, I had previously had a mental picture of a couple of years of hot flushes in my mid-50s - if I was unlucky.

Instead, I found myself contemplating massive deterioration of quality of life starting now and lasting many years before segueing into old age.

I don’t know what I think about the deluge of info. Obviously knowledge is power. But I find it has caused me to worry about what can or will happen, which isn’t great or useful. Worst case scenarios. Lists of symptoms that include anything and everything under the sun. Vehement advice about what you must or mustn’t do. I presently have some changes which are due to this, but I don’t feel the need to take medication (or frankly get into the headache that finding the right solution seems to be) for them. Should I be? If I leave it until I feel I need it, is that too late?

Thanks for recognising this. I know I produce too much oestrogen. I don't have all the common symptoms but on a positive note it keeps my skin soft & unbelievably wrinkle free. It definitely comes with its negatives too. I might look into progesterone to balance it out especially the random painful swollen breasts. It's worse than in pregnancy when it happens. I'll do some research 😊

How is there no correlation. You said you had PMS so bad you felt suicidal the day before your period and the question was about women who suffer from PMS potentially suffering in menopause.

There is no condition of estrogen dominance,

It was something that was started in the US about 25 years ago by the late Dr John Lee who wanted to sell bucket loads of progesterone cream (which doesn't work) to 'balance' it.

It's not a condition, you're right.

If someone like another poster @Luv2luv9 here has sore breasts they need looking at with maybe a consultation with a breast specialist. Sore breasts over 60 when you're not ovulating is not usual.

Thanks, I was/am on 75 patches & the gynae said if possible I should try to be on lower strength as this was safer/optimal. She generally had a very conservative approach.

My bloods showed a within range/‘normal’ level of oestrogen but she frowned & said higher than she liked menopausal woman to be.

The meno clinic GP said she thought this level was too low. So am confused especially as I thought blood tests re: prog/oestro/test only a snapshot & unreliable anyway?

On continuous HRT if prog/oestro balance ‘off’ you can bleed? Do you need to apply patch at same time each day you change it? Do most change patches twice a week?

Yes I had bad PMT.

I don't see why she was worried. 75mcg is high(er) but not very the very highest which is 100mcg patch.A patch has the correct amount of progesterone in it to balance out the estrogen dose. Assume you're on a combined patch?
Not sure if you're on sequential or combined continuous.

(If you're using Utrogestan daily, the dose with 75mcg patch can be 100 or 200mgs a day - 200mgs is if you're bleeding when you shouldn't be.)

Blood tests for estrogen are unreliable. My consultant won't do them and I've asked why - says they are not accurate but also meaningless because dose is supposed to be about relieving symptoms.

I don't know what criteria she was using for 'safer' - safer in what respect?
Everything I have read from the BMS and other top specialists says that there is no evidence that higher estrogen is related (for example) to a higher risk of breast cancer. In fact it's only when progesterone is added to estrogen than the BC risk rises.

If she was meaning hyperplasia (thicker womb lining) then she should reassure you that unless you have spotting at odd times, there is unlikely to be anything wrong. If there is spotting, the next step is a scan.

All of this is from the BMS report on 'progesterone in HRT' so it's not my opinion- it's online as guidance, if you want to read it.

You need to follow the instructions in the pack.
If you don't you may bleed.
If you're bleeding you should be referred for a scan.

Yes I’ve been told that too.

I know you can’t have oestrogen alone but I had also been told no progesterone alone.

There is lots of talk but not so much information …

Thank you, I got feeling re: cancer risk & lower the patch, the better, in this regard. I will clarify. Don’t doubt anything you’ve said. The blood test was what slightly concerned re: oestrogen & meno clinic thought looked low where expert thought high leaving me confused.

Prog x1 tab. Re: bleeding on continuous HRT by scan you mean trans vag ultrasound?

I spoke to a Doctor a few years ago. When I suggested I thought I produced too much oestrogen he replied 'very clever' My occasional swollen breasts are cyclical in the same way as it happened when I had periods & lasts for a few days then goes away. It's definitely hormonal. I've had it since my 40s.

Regarding 'not usual' there's not a lot about my hormonal make-up which is usual as you will see if you look back on my previous posts 😂I think I produce too much testosterone too which all women have 😂

TBH I think you should be referred to see a breast specialist. Hormonal doesn't apply once you're 60+. It can't because you're not longer ovulating with fluctuating hormones.

At least get a 2nd opinion to be sure.