Labour say transwomen should use the men’s toilet

[Kindersurprising]

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/trans-women-men-toilets-b8gt6l22c?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0BMQABHlJe7BiT-kgvjfusJpz2eq_AUSGDRI9eAMe5VNA0iX6U2qOUk-U0wPhPI98-_aem_Vfuvll1ZYKrZUa-vjh4QSA#Echobox=1745317525

Squeak squeak burrow burrow. Is that a ferret reversing?

Neither cis-men nor transwomen belong in female spaces.

They really don't see the inherent misogyny behind what they falsely believe is a clever gotcha.

It is bizarre to watch in action on this thread.

I think they are wrong.

Who's wrong?

Do you really think mens violence towards other men is OUR problem to solve?!???

I don't understand the hysteria. People who have transitioned pass as their chosen sex just fine, despite what the terfs would have you believe. They'll go on using the loos of their chosen sex and no one will be any the wiser, same as before the trans extremists and anarchists took over.

I know they'll never read it and will keep pretending it's a point, but the transman gotcha has been addressed in the judgement. Well actually it was already addressed in the law, which the judgement merely clarifies. If any of you people who all of a sudden care about transmen now that you think you can use them to undermine women's spaces (because don't pretend you gave a toss before), you can read it. https://x.com/MForstater/status/1913185931290460333

I've known a few transmen. Not a single one passes, even the one who got tattoos to cover the mastectomy scars. They look less male than some butch women I know, and the consensus from butch women seems to be that they are aware they may be questioned, they understand why, they aren't offended and it's always resolved once they actually speak and let the questioner look at them a little longer.

How is saying men are men, which is biology and now the LAW, 'sneering' at anyone?

However much you think that a man can look like a woman, they cannot. They just can't. There is no point trying to compete with women on being women because women have that. They've always had that.

How pathetic that being in women's space when you're not a woman is so, so important to you. You will never pass as a woman and you'll just have to cope with that.

And that's fine, but what they won't be able to do, is pretend to be female when a woman asks for care from a female practioner only, or be placed in a womens prison, or take part in women's sport, or be put on a womans shortlist/put in a role exclusively reserved for women, or strip search women if they work for the police, etc.

So, because you cannot correctly identify someone's sex and you have said this on a number of threads now, you assume that your experience is the norm. Despite it being highly likely that with interaction (even just watching someone move) a female person will correctly identify the sex of a male person.

And you also believe that male people with transgender identities will now deliberately break the law and enter the spaces they know they are excluded from?

YESSS! Thank you, Ive been trying to say this to dh much less succinctly.

I agree. I work in a building that has exactly that: individual cubicles, each with a toilet, handbasin, mirror and sanpro disposal unit and all of them are wheelchair accessible.

I don't know if the building was built like that or if it was adapted by a previous occupier, but it's been like that since at least the noughties. It solves all the issues of who pees where.

Oh dear.

Broaden your horizons a little, I’ve come across multiple trans men who appear far more “masculine” than many bio males: tall, strong, full beards. You’ve probably just never “spotted” them…

1)All transwomen have two things in common:

They're men.

They're deluded.

2. If 1/10 people are gay that must mean that 90% of transwomen are also straight, as in attracted to women.

3. And the number of transwomen currently in prison for sexual offences, against women and children especially, shows that some transwomen are dangerous. The behaviour of some of them this week and before proves some of them are cause for concern.

All the #bekind performative flagwaving this week can't hide these facts.

At risk of what? Having others shatter their delusions of how womanly they are?

Well fairly easy on an NHS ward I would have thought

I work somewhere with those loos and it does solve the problem except…

the men are disgusting. The women in my office are constantly complaining to building management about pee on the seats, skid marked toilet bowls and on occasion some men don’t shut the door properly and we catch them peeing (nothing nefarious about it, they are just used to being in male only spaces where they pee in front of other males and don’t give it any thought that they are in a mixed sex environment!). We hate it!

I also had a lock fail on me once as it was loose and I had a man almost walk in on me. I have never moved so fast to slam a door on someone’s face!

Also I’m amazed that suddenly transmen are the issue - it’s funny how they have been largely ignored (by the men) until now

is this the new stick to beat us with? Transmen are women it’s a non issue

also GC women have been shouted down again and again for apparently being obsessed with toilets- but now it’s the big issue

it’s not about toilets it’s about rape crisis centres, refuges, hospital wards, prisons, women only short lists and awards and sport - and it’s about bloody time

There's also the risk of someone passing out/blacking out for some reason, and it being harder to get to them to give first aid.

I worked at a school with an 18 year old autistic trans student who went by a male name and pronouns (born female). They frequently wore bows in their hair and wore gender neutral clothes.
I absolutely hate the idea of them using the men's toilet as they are clearly an incredibly vulnerable female.

Men need to start being concerned for trans women in their spaces in the same way and accept there are different ways you can present as a man - or trans women need to campaign for third spaces for themselves if they don't feel safe around men. Women shouldn't have to take responsibility for the threat men pose to trans women, they already have to deal with enough due to the threat men pose to women.

Sure 👍

That too! It does actually worry me quite a lot as there is literally no way of knowing if someone has been in there all day

Is Beth Upton not a GMC registered doctor?