Trans protest- sharing for balance

[Tandora]

There’s a thread sharing some really awful images from the protest, so I wanted to share some positive ones for the sake of some perspective/ balance.
A lot of people are really understandably incredibly angry and overwhelmed by the events of the last few days. But most people who support trans rights absolutely don’t condone fighting oppression and injustice with misogyny.

OP, I'm so so sorry to have to tell you this, but the Supreme Court made a ruling that Transwomen aren't women, just this week!

If only they'd seen those lovely, kind banners before hand, I'm sure it would have gone your way.

Which part of the UKSC judgment was "fascist"? Genuine question. Please give para references so we are all clear.

Why 'third spaces'?

Why can't transwomen just use existing facilities designated for their sex, i.e. the men's toilets? It's the most obvious solution: biological women use the women's, biological men use the men's, and disabled people use the accessible toilets.

In what way is a men's toilet not a safe space for transwomen?
I think we need some strong evidence that that was the case - note, an unsafe, not just un-preferred space - before deciding that so-called 'third spaces' [actually fourth spaces, accessible toilets are the third space required by law] were justified for the tiny percentage of people who identify as trans.

We can but hope!!

Not the same.

You going to answer my previous questions? They’ve been repeated by many of us and are fundamental to this debate.

Exactly. And of course Dr Upton has famously confirmed that he would treat a woman patient who asked to be treated by a woman.

That’s not what the ruling says

Because that would require something of men probably.

Some people think trans women are women. An equal number of people believe trans women are men. Its clearly a philosophical position for many. There is no way that people who believe that transwomen are men or viceversa can argue that this is a universal position.

Its well acknowledged that some women do not like being in places where they have to remove clothing when there are men in the proximity. Its well known that lots and lots of women have very good reason to feel this way, with the proportion of women who have experienced sexual assault being very high.

So, those people who believe that trans women have rights to be in women's toilets are basically saying, yes, we know you have trauma about being in the presence of men, yes we know you have good reason for this, and yes we know you believe these transwomen are men.

But we don't care because we think you're wrong. Suck it up - you are all at the same time: ignorant, misled and fascist.

All while trans rates of offending are HIGHER than in non-trans men. The fucking arrogance, the sheer hubris of it, is just beyond belief.

They are protesting against the Supreme Court confirming that trans people's rights do not trump women's rights.

Give us one good reason why any decent person would protest against that.

The most charitable explanation is that they don't actually know what they are protesting about because they haven't bothered to read and understand the judgment.

Sex is binary and transwomen are male. Otherwise they’d be female.

More attention needs to be given to the facts that the trans community have rights, they’re offered (in the case of Dr Upton, for example) their own space, but they don’t want that. They actively want to invade women’s space. If they were genuinely fearful of changing with other men, they’d snap at a chance of a private room to change in. But they don’t want that. And they all have mothers, grandmothers etc, but refuse to see why the safety of women means more than their demands.

And also why 95% want to retain their genitalia. That’s not gender dysphoria.

It is not the spaces they want access to - it is the women in them.

It literally is.

Well obviously it's not like 'apartheid' is it?

It is wholly normal for men and women's services to be provided separately.

No man is a sort of woman.

Women are fed to the back teeth of all this, they want and need their own resources and spaces, they are not NPCs in men's very important lives. Women who are happy to validate men with their bodies and see souls and revolve around enabling men can go and do it in the third spaces and leave the rest of us alone .

@Tandora you're back! Please now share the science that says I am the same as a transwoman.

Fifth time lucky?

Have you read it now?

Do your own research

starter for 10
https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/18973/pdf/

actually it says transwomen are more likely than men to have committed sexual offenses if you look at the percentages

the judgement is being interpreted as banning all trans women from any facilities designated for women and compelling them to use facilities associated with “biological sex” (not defined). This is not my understanding of what the judgement means/ does, but this is how it is already being presented/ used. If this is implemented fascism is an appropriate label.

Is it fascism when the same ruling is applied to non-trans men?

How would you know, when you've not bothered to read it?

She can't. Because we're not. And that's absolutely okay.

As far as the Equality Act, the keystone piece of equality and diversity legislation in England, Wales and Scotland, goes, it’s exactly what the ruling says. All “trans women” including those who have obtained a legal gender recognition certificate, are men under equality law in this country.

No man is a sort of woman.
Nice t-shirt slogan there, TheOtherRaven

That's just an excuse for them because they don't want to admit that being able to use the women's loo is arousing/validating/a way to show biological women who is boss.

They don't want third spaces. We've offered them that and also open categories in sport. That's not enough, they want women's bathrooms, women's prisons and women's medals on sports podiums.

Instead of looking to third spaces, men have to learn to be more tolerant of other men whom don't conform to their gender.

Tandora it's not fascism and you know it. Cop yourself on, you're making a dick of yourself.