to not understand why Christians think Jesus died for our sins?

[switcheroooo]

If Jesus died for everyone's sins, does that mean people are not accountable for their actions? You can kill people, steal and lie but have a protected status because Jesus died for your sins.

How does this work? Why are people not responsible for their own sins? Where is the justice?

I think I said before - Christianity is a FAITH, not a science based set of facts. I find it very comforting and I believe in what it says. I'm a believer and a Christian. If you have questions, you need to ask yourself why? I'm not a theologist, I can't answer your questions in detail. I can only state the facts - you cant be a Christian unless you believe in Trinity and unless you believe Jesus died on the cross for our sins and was resurrected. This is a fundamental difference between Christians and, for example, Jehovah's Witnesses (who are a non-Christian cult).

I fundamentally disagree that to learn about any religion one should look only to religious leaders and Google (or text books!).

It's so important that people experience and learn about a religion through others: those who follow it, those who doubt it, those who disagree wholeheartedly and those for whom they cannot but believe with their entire being.

Otherwise, people's only experience and understanding of a religion will be through religious leaders, dogma and reputation. Any faith is much more than that.

Jesus’ death is about being renewed and starting afresh.

Gives you the chance to shed all your earthly woes and carry on growing.

It’s also a great reminder of how humans (well, men) kill good and innocent people all
the time.

I find this video really helpful in understanding the meaning of the resurrection/ the overall storyline of the Bible

I'm afraid I must disagree that you cannot enter into a discussion about the various aspects of Christianity unless you're a religious leader.

I understand however you are uncomfortable with doing so and will only point out that there are many accepted denominations of Christianity which don't all agree on the various tenets of Christian faith.

I will also point out that much of the accepted dogma of established and orthodox christian churches has evolved through asking these same questions- and many more.

One question for you, though, if I may and which I hope you will answer: I don't know which Christian denomination you are part of (Orthodox Christianity is different in different parts of the world), but do you believe that only your denomination of Christianity is right? That the followers of all others aren't actually Christians, even if they call themselves so?

Yes. Specifically, Jewish people.

I do think, though, that you are at the stage where it would be really helpful to try reading one of the gospels to see how it all fits together. And someone to have a real conversation with as well. You can be really upfront about just wanting to understand it better and they will be glad to help.

Maybe one could be someone who submits to God? So still a believer.

The Jesus part is complicated as @bridgetreilly explained.

Died and rose again so didn’t stay dead? I’m confused. It confused me as a child and I still can’t make sense of it. It just seems like tall tales to me. I don’t think I’ll ever change my mind but I find it an interesting subject nevertheless.

That's interesting...Just curious, how does it feel different to you from someone who dies from a heart attack, say, but we manage to bring back to life through CPR?

It's not unusual these days for people to come back to life after being declared clinically dead. In light of this I would have thought the part of the resurrection which is hardest to believe is Jesus' ascendancy to Heaven?

This made me spit out my wine.

Brilliant.

Human beings are good at inventing stories. The human imagination is limitless. Christianity, to me, is no more true or false than Father Christmas, King Lear, or the Rocky films. It’s just stuff humans have made up.

Facts are different. It’s a fact that we are animals (a Chimpanzee in genetically closer to humans than it is to a gorilla). Did Jesus’ death wipe out the sins of the other primates? When there is a resurrection, will the other extinct species of human also be resurrected, like Homo Neanderthalis and Homo Florensis?

You shouldn't try to make sense of it, OP.

If it made sense, or was well-evidenced, believers wouldn't need to have faith.

To those of us without faith, it's just nonsensical (and a bit unpleasant).

God is, purportedly, all-knowing, all-powerful, benevolent (all-good) and, of course, created everything. This means that, when he made the world, he not only knew that Adam and/or Eve would commit the original sin - it was God's choice that they would do so (if he hadn't wanted them to, then he could have just make them or the world a little differently).

God knew about every subsequent sin that everyone would commit and, given that he chose to create the world and it's people that way, he essentially chose for every sin that had ever occurred, to occur. Free will isn't really reconcilable with Christianity, to my mind (though some have tried to offer explanations).

He also always knew that humanity would "need to be saved" from its (his) sins. Despite being all-powerful, meaning he could have waved the sins away, the specific way he decided to do this saving was by having his son (who is also him) killed.

It's very hard to understand if you're not coming from a starting point of believing it regardless.

Wait, I thought you'd taken a swig of water???

I am an Anglican. Anglicans believ the church to be 'one holy catholic and apostolic' church. The term 'catholic' here means 'universal', so that Jesus died for all humanity. A reading of the OT will show that the God of Israel is a universal god, this is repeatedly said, she/he* is not just the God of Israel, though in some aspects he/she acts in ways that favour Israel. However, the salvation offered is on offer to everyone.

*the spirit of God is often seen as female and in its personification as 'wisdom' is frequently called 'she' or spoken of as a woman, so in this sense God is she/he (if we can attribute sex to a spiritual being).

Would you include Unitarians as a non-Christian cult? This has never been suggested afaik. They do not believe in the Trinity.
Jehovah's Witnesses believe in the sacrifice Jesus made and that he is their/our saviour. They do not accept the Trinity, having a literal interpretation of the Bible on this point. A less literal interpretation sees God, the spirit of God (sometimes called 'wisdom') and Jesus as the Son of God. I am not theologian, but if you read any of the creeds accepted e.g. by the C of E (Nicene, Apostles, and Athanasian) they all say that God is one (I believe in one God) and then list the persons of the Trinity, which can be read as aspects of the same God e.g. God as Creator, God as wisdom (the Spirit of God/Holy Spirit), and God as the Word (the Word made flesh is Jesus).
It looks to me as though Jehovah's Witnesses are a schism of Christianity, not a non-Christian cult, as the core belief is that Jesus is Saviour (if you do not believe that then you are not a Christian). Same goes for Unitarians.

Unitarianism has roots in Christian tradition and many Unitarians hold Jesus in high regard but they reject the Trinity.

This is belief without the complex Jesus part.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarianism

A bit about Unitarianism for those who are curious. It's considered a denomination of Christianity rather than a belief system with Christian roots.

On another note, I wish my phone would stop trying to autocorrect 'denomination' to 'demonisation' 😳🙈

@Grammarnut it's been a long time since I had links to the CofE but I don't recall coming across the feminisation of God's spirit. Can you point me to examples? Is this in the Bible or in the language used by the church?

I mean the bible is literally just a fiction book so I wouldn’t put much time and effort into understanding something made up. No different to Harry Potter / Gruffalo etc

That makes fuck all sense. So glad my family have never been believers.

Jesus died for somebody's sins
But not mine
(Patti Smith)

Love all the posts that say “go online and research if you are interested” or “can’t wait to see the posts attacking other religions on their holy day”
it’s almost as if some Christian’s know it’s nonsense and see any question as an attack about what they believe in because it can’t be explained in a logical way so just look over there everyone at other religions

Matthew 12:36
36 But I tell you that everyone will have to give account on the day of judgment for every empty word they have spoken

God's going to be busy with all the Love Islanders and influencers. .

It's in the Bible. I am rubbish at chapter and verse, but wisdom is personified as a woman who runs her household, in Isaiah, for example. God is described as mothering her people in some of the psalms and various OT quote God as pointing out that he/she has looked after Israel just as a mother cares for a child. The example most often quoted is Jesus' parable of the woman looking for a lost coin, a straight personification of God as female. He also compares God's care for humanity as that of a hen gathering her chicks.