To be devastated by what DS has done or am I over-reacting?

[Acunningruse]

Short version: DS (12yo) sent a message to a family friend’s daughter (call her Lucy) saying “mate I don’t like you so don’t put kisses on messages”
😢 I saw this when doing a random check of his phone, hit the roof and have banned his phone for Easter weekend and given him extra chores.

Long version:
DS (12) has struggled hugely with the transition from a tiny primary to big secondary school. He seems to be trying to be the big I am, the cool guy.

We are involved parents concerned about social media and we check his phone regularly. I am concerned about how he speaks to girls in messages- less respectful than he is with boys. He had a girlfriend for a short while but when they broke up he and his friends were name calling her (a play on her surname, eg her Surname is Bank…) she messaged him asking him to stop and he was unkind. I discovered the messages and made him apologise to her and he lost phone and gaming privileges for a week.

We visited these family friends a few weeks ago and the mum seemed to be “pushing DS and Lucy towards each other. Rather than leaving them to just be, it was “DS and Lucy, you go to the shop together, you both sit here to watch a film…” DS was mortified by this and kept saying afterwards I don’t want Lucy to think I like her in that way.

Lucy text DS yesterday with pictures of their holiday and DS response was “mate I don’t like you so don’t put kisses on messages “

I am hugely upset by this to think he could possibly think this is an acceptable way to speak to someone. Lucy is a very sweet very naive girl (suspect SEN) who would have been devastated to read this. Im hopeful i managed to delete the message before she saw it (no blue ticks) but I can’t be sure. I don’t know if I did the right thing by deleting I just wanted to spare her feelings.

when we confronted DS he just kept saying “I don’t want her to think I like her in that way”. We talked about men and women being friends, you can put kisses in messages and it doesn’t mean anything, but he was not as remorseful as we felt he should have been.

we go on holiday today and this has completely cast a shadow over it for me. Im terrified we are raising some kind of andrew Tate wannabe-despite us being the strictest parents ever around his phone and social media. Not to mention we are going away with friends whose kids will all have their phones so DS will be an absolute nightmare sulking about not having his but we feel we have to do something.

parenting a pre-teen is all new to us (DD is 9) and every other day I feel like we are getting it wrong.

Am I over reacting? under reacting? I haven’t slept in days (sick bug in house) and I just don’t know what to do any more.

I absolutely detest kisses/ xxxx in messages. YABVU and need to have your son's back when enforcing his boundaries.

Maybe it wasn't very tactful, but there's nothing really awful about being blunt. You admit you're a real people pleaser, OP. That's not entirely a good thing, is it? How would you react if a friend had been trying to push you together with a man you really weren't keen on, and he started sending you messages with kisses on the end? You'd probably feel really uncomfortable but wouldn't straightforwardly ask him not to, because you've been socialised to think that wouldn't be polite. Sometimes it's ok to be a bit blunt. We don't have to like everyone, or pretend that we do.

Of course they can but no-one needs to be an arsehole, do they?

Totally agree. But its really hard to teach young boys to be tactful!

They very often have no filter! Probs best to teach them to speak to an adult about something they are uncomfortable/annoyed by and help them craft a message. Thats what i always did, and even now do with my boys 😆

'Like' is actually defined in the urban dictionary as: "A term used, usually by middle schoolers, to say 'have a crush on'."

In that context, there's absolutely nothing wrong with what your DS said.

I agree he’s trying but I don’t honestly know too many 12 year olds who couldn’t work out that wording is a bit insulting. It was like she was a bit of poo he was wiping off his shoe in a panic.

It’s fine to have boundaries but in asserting them you can’t treat the other person in a way that’s actually worse than their boundary crossing. Lucy’s mum suggested they watch a film etc at a social event which sounds like it was otherwise guests not their age. The girl has sent ultimately harmless xx on a text. Ok he doesn’t like it, good that he can work through his feelings and articulate that to himself, but it’s not a free pass for him to be insulting.

Surely a 12 year old would say “ please “ don’t send kisses cos I “don’t like you like that” or “ in that way.”

Mind you, with the number of posters who seem genuinely nonplussed as to how it was rude maybe some don’t know. Full credit to op that she is trying to teach him that.

How was he an arsehole?

And really disgusting to call a 12yr old a nasty name.

Agree. Get a serious grip. He's allowed not to like this girl and say so.

Kids of both sexes really. DD often asks me what to say to so and so or even for me to talk to them (and she reads , approves or not and hopefully learns) when she’s proper stuck. She’s lucky I love her. I didn’t want to deal with teenage drama even when I was a teenager.

When did I say he was an arsehole?

I said that that of course boys can set boundaries but no-one needs to be an arsehole.

He was cruel and rude. He has form for being cruel to girls.

The male-defence squad are out en masse today.

He could have put please but he is hardly being by an arsehole for saying he doesn’t feel that way about her and don’t put kisses.
He probably feels very uncomfortable. If it were a girl that would probably be ok.

Think about it from a different perspective - if this was the other way round and a boy’s parent was forcing her son on to someone’s daughter, making them hang out together against the girl’s will, and the boy was sending her kisses on texts, and possibly sending A LOT of messages, or commenting on her sociaI media, I think your reaction would be very different. In this instance, the boy would probably be accused of being predatory and disrespectful.

These days it seems boys can’t do anything right. He’s not an Andrew Tate wannabe, he’s not the kid in Adolescence. He’s a boy who is (clumsily) trying to establish some boundaries and stave off unwanted female attention from this girl, and rightly so, she and her mother are making him uncomfortable.

If you are always strict like this, punishing him for asserting his boundaries, you’ll push him away and your fears will become a self-fulfilling prophecy. Offer guidance instead on how to establish boundaries in a way that is fair but firm.

I am increasingly concerned that this Adolescence show has done more harm than good.

Clearly there is an issue with the way some teen boys behave towards girls, but the vast majority of boys are not about to murder someone.

A more nuanced approach is needed rather than worrying that every boy is going to become Andrew Tait.

It’s interesting actually to see a male being so defended, but I think it’s less that than defending their right to boundary assertion, which lots of people hide behind to basically be disproportionately rude and assertive.

I could say to someone 'excuse me' or I could say 'get out my way' - delivery changes tone and intent, doesn't it?

The fact he's already bullied a girl once he wasn't interested in her and then a) assumes this girl is interested in him and b) 'asserts boundaries' so rudely is showing a pattern in his behaviour towards girls IMO. There are other ways he could have told her he wasn't interested, this has a sneery and arrogant undertone.

Exactly.

@MightAsWellBeGretel

He's not assuming anything about the girl's intentions though given that her mother has explicitly stated she wants them in a relationship!

But what is your issue with “ I’d prefer you don’t put kisses because I want to be clear I don’t see you as that kind of friend.”

Not : I don’t like you.

There’s a difference between knocking on a door and hammering it down.

@Calliopespa

He meant like as in 'be attracted to'.

I don’t see that she had.

Yes he did but he can use his words more accurately and say that.

ETA it’s not somehow weak to take care how we phrase things.

Nailed it. He’s 12 and HE was made to feel uncomfortable too by the girl’s mother. Empathise with him and suggest a ‘kinder’ way of dealing with these things. I don’t think he should be punished. I get you’re worried about the scary manosphere stuff. But id also be concerned that punishing him when he is just trying to put in place his own boundaries will have the opposite effect (ie possibly push him further towards the harmful attitudes.)

You are overreacting I completely understand why. It must be incredibly stressful rasing a boy in this current climate. And that netflix show probably has made you a little weary assuming you watched it.

Personally I'd validate his feelings but explain there are nicer ways of expressing ones self.

Last time I read it, it was the girl who messaged him, not her mother.