Sending love to trans people on MN and beyond

[cassandre]

This isn't an AIBU. I just wanted to send love to trans people, in the UK especially, and to other members of the LGBTQIA+ community.

This hasn't been the easiest week for trans people, but there are a lot of us out there who accept you for who you are. We have your backs and we believe that eventually, tolerance and compassion will win.💖💖💖

Love from a longtime MNer and trans-inclusive feminist.

I thought a man who identifies as a woman got all excited because he thought he’d come up with a test for ‘transgender’ but faced such a backlash from the rest of the ‘trans community’ that he deleted his findings and went very quiet. Does anyone remember er him?

How many young people could have saved their health, fertility and possibly even lives if he’d been allowed to continue?

ohhh I had forgotten about him. I wonder if he's still around.

I remember. They all hated the idea & he had to recant, I think.

Yes. Strange how reluctant the ‘trans community’ was for an actual diagnosis to be formulated.

Almost like they want to keep the category open for any random man to join at will?

I was once kicked out of an ADHD group for WOMEN for objecting to being described as a “cis” woman. They probably have more blokes in that group than they do women by now.

so, I’ll reserve my love and support for the WOMEN who have battled and successfully fought this nonsense.

Who was this? Do you have a link?

This is such unbelievable nonsense I can't even. Trans men (so, women) are not a THREAT. Your (imaginary) butch lesbian friend who looks like a fella is just fine, because she's a woman. It's amazing how many MN'ers suddenly have trans men friends who are 6 foot and muscled up to fuck. I've NEVER encountered one in 44 years, but every mumsnetter has one.

Or they know “lovely gentle” TW who’ve had all the surgeries.

I hear you. Had the same in a group for women with PCOS run by a major PCOS organisation. Apparently it's hate speech to suggest men can't have PCOS, as they don't have ovaries.

Indeed they are

Yours Faithfully,

A biologist

Just imagine though, a reliable diagnosis tool!

Obviously using those "measurable biological phenomenon” that we have been told by posters that are definitely known and testable.

And just think, the numerous countries who have released their reviews of the current treatment options using all known studies, and not one country yet has found a diagnosis tool. And every country so far has found the same thing: there far too low quality evidence to support the use of puberty blockers in children under 16 or even 18.

Yet apparently academics think there is ‘good’ evidence that there are measurable biological phenomenon.

And I remember the man Bundle refers to and I remember the outcry. And because I have been only half paying attention to this thread but I realise what has also been bugging me. So thanks Bundle.

A poster has posted on this thread this statement without one other trans ally picking up on what they posted and how transphobic it would be viewed if it was posted on somewhere like reddit:

"Being truly transgender is a measurable biological phenomenon”

‘truly’ transgender! Then I remember that I have recently read a reaction to the latest brain scan discussion at the European Society of Endocrinology’s annual meeting in Barcelona in 2024

https://www.gendergp.com/can-a-scan-reveal-you-are-trans/

On MN we have always said that no diagnosis tool is wanted by this group because all of a sudden, the ‘true trans’ group is a fraction of what the larger transgender grouping is.

And it also suddenly makes all these mantras based around society having to believe anyone who says they are transgender is transgender. It also certainly pretty much blows away the 130+ genders. Plus the growing number of people stating clearly that they are transgender because it was a lifestyle choice, that they find it fun etc.

Plus this will completely remove future insurance paid or public health paid extreme body modifications for any person who doesn’t those “measurable biological phenomenon”. I don’t see that being welcomed. How else can a man have a penis and get a cavity inserted between that penis and his anus under the guise of nullification, unless they are diagnosed? (Obviously they can privately pay)

Because remember, at the moment there are many ways to be transgender. Gender GP is quite right :

“The more tools we have to help us to provide the best possible treatment for this group of patients the better. The very real risk is that scans such as these become the litmus test for transgender validation – a tool that has the potential to divide the community and make them feel ever more exposed, vulnerable or alone”

Yet no trans ally has said a thing on this thread. And having seen the other posts from that poster, I assume they might class themselves as an ally considering their vile attack on Maya Forstater. Remarkable really.

The transwoman who said it wouldn't matter if there was a slight spike in women being murdered , so men in dresses could use women's single sex facilities, was Sophie Grace Chapell.

Chapell (how I wish I was making this up) is now advising BACP, the UKs biggest counselling organisation, on their ethical framework.

Edited cos I forgot the link

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12711047/Transgender-activist-female-murders-ethics-rules-therapists.html

When I see someone defend using the term ‘transgender children’ saying that science professionals use it so it must be ok, I then think of the ocassional peer reviewed study or paper that uses the word ‘cis’. Cis is a meaningless term for scientific purposes. Because it creates a false grouping based on philosophical belief. In the ‘cis’ group is included the majority of people who have no gender identity and / or don’t believe in gender identity theory.

The use of transgender children strikes me as being similar.

It.does strike me as ill advised to suggest some forms of data are immune to manipulation. Tell that to the discredited IQ and race scientists.

What always surprises me on threads like this is how these male people who are leaders and spokespeople for this community can be still platformed, still considered inspirational voices despite the things they say that show just how little respect for others they actually have.

Chappell is still out there in influential positions. There has been nothing mentioned about Kane and the admission in that interview. Faye, the extreme porn and lowering the age of porn actors and don’t forget the thing he said about women’s murder (below), has also been platformed this week.

“Most murder is boring, pedestrian,
even accidental stuff. Somewhere between a third and a half result from too much alcohol. A high proportion are domestic violence "gone wrong". A blow struck one time too many: an egg-shell skull.” (J Fae: 26/03/2018)

These male people are out there as spokespeople for this group. No one who is declaring their support for the group even mentions the issues with these spokespeople, instead we have threads and threads of posters telling us how hateful we are. And pages and pages of demonising Maya Forstater for making a reply to a interviewer using accurate language following the conventions of the English language.

Apparently, no questions should be asked or answered if it has been peer reviewed, published in a good journal and is considered ‘good evidenced’ by academics.

I missed this question from @LittlerCharlotte - sorry for not responding but thanks for providing the info @Nameychangington ‘Sophie’ was indeed the man I was referring to I think there is an audio recording of the interview around somewhere as well. For someone who thinks he’s a woman, he has remarkably little regard for women. In fact I would go to far as to say he was rather contemptuous on the topic. I feel very sorry for his female students.

For "WHO" they are! I'm sure we've been through this. "Whom" is not more correct just because it sounds proper-er.

Yep Chapell said it wasn't about that sort of thing because it's a human right issue. Men in dresses being allowed to go where they like being the human right issue obviously, not women being allowed to not be murdered because that's not nearly as important.

He's just a common or garden misogynist with a fetish, and BACP are the most captured organisation this side of Amnesty.

A quick online will find stories and accounts from masc presententing lesbians who have been challenged in women’s toilets. I know people who have experienced this too.

I don’t know why you believe everybody is lying.

Presumably these all happened before Wednesday?

How do you feel about the rapes by TW of women in prisons, shelters, NHS wards and other female only spaces?

Ill say it again and again: toilets are the thin end of the wedge

What?

??

What didn’t you understand?

Your post was just so….weird.

Somebody claimed it’s a lie that any butch lesbians have ever been challenged in toilets.

I said nope, there are multiple accounts of this occurring.

To which you replied “HoW dO yOUA FEel abOUt woMEn bEIng RAPED!111!”

Which is just a really batshit response.

What was weird about it?

Writing something on the internet doesn’t make it true. And my response was to ask you if this all happened before the ruling.

So you’re not going to share how you feel about women being raped, you’re just going to mock it and focus on toilets?

God misogynists have really done a number on women haven’t they. The hatred is absolutely palpable