To NOT feel guilty that my kids are in childcare?

[Kanfuzed123]

Inspired by the childcare eating a £45k salary and the anti nursery sentiment from a few posters on there as being inferior for a child.

anyone else not feel in the slightest guilty that there kids are in nursery and have been post maternity leave?

yeah when they cried at drop off was rough and I called into the check out they were but that soon settled. They do lovely events for the parents and upload lots of amazing activities they do, they’ve made fantastic friends.

I could’ve reduced my hours but I didn’t, we could’ve maybe managed on one salary (glad we didn’t when rates shot up) but I went back FT when dc 1 was 15 months (used annual leave for part time before then) and dc2 was 13 months.

anyone else just not feel guilty? I like the lifestyle we can get when we’re working, especially since the 15 funded hrs and now 30, it’s so affordable. (Eldest is in school and youngest now has the 30 hrs) bill is less than £400 a month inc club etc. I like having something else to focus on too.

im not alone or am I?

I think the is it optimal question is different to the guilt question.

I think it probably is optimal for a child to be at home with a parent until 2, but I don't think being at nursery from 1-2 is harmful so I don't feel guilty about having done it.

I think many things are optimal that I don't do. I think non processed food is optimal but my kids do eat some UPF because it's easy and convenient. I don't feel guilty about that either.

I think optimally I would always be in a brilliant mood and set up craft activities every day. I think optimally my kids would have no screens

At the end of the day, I do the best I can, not what is optimal all the time. Zero guilt.

I refute that.

My whole babies are awake anyway is to the chorus of ‘the day is too long for a baby’ (my children weren’t even babies when they went to nursery so I have no skin in the game for this point, but I think this line is trotted out to be guilt inducing in mothers, so I refute its premise)

and if you can’t tell my quip on holidays was tongue in cheek, well… that’s on you.

My kids are older now OP and we took them to Disney and all that a few times when they were younger. It is great for them in a certain way and why not? But the holidays they remember most are the simple ones, like camping with friends, or just messing round in Cornwall or France.

Good for you and them… I’m hoping you understand like that may be specific to you.

mine for instance, beg me to go back every year

Mine went from 8 months for 3 days a week until pre-school; youngest never needed to as husband was made redundant so he became a SAHD. Older boys were in pre-school then.

I have never ever regretted sending them. My children are 16 (twins) and 13 now, you'd never know which of them were in paid childcare and which weren't. I have great relationships with all of them.

What does the research say are the negative outcomes for children who go to nursery?

I have pretty much straight A achieving , happy, healthy, sporty children who went to nursery 3-5 days a week from age 6 month. What harm has it caused them?

It’s taking absolutely fucking forever for my kids to reach 18. They’re 10 and that’s taken a bloody lifetime 😂

I suspect you'll be accused of lying as that's not "peer reviewed research" like those posters that state they have it but won't cite it.

Quick search on google scholar doesn’t give any research that isn’t similar- outdated institutional or abusive settings where there is no attachment

As ever, it's interesting to note that it's only ever mothers who are made to feel less than for taking an interest in anything other than their children. Only mothers aren't allowed to ever consider themselves.

I’m a sahm with a toddler who goes in 5x a week! I don’t feel an ounce guilty. My dc is bored shitless from being home FT and it drives me crazy trying to find something to entertain them the entire day. She is SO much happier at school, has an excellent routine and has made many friends. We do play dates, she goes to parties and school does so many exciting activities that I could never do.

Why would I feel guilty if at the end of the day there’s a happy mum and baby. I need time away from my kids to be happier overall. Who wants to be run ragged when they have a choice not to?

Mine went 4 days a week from 9 months old, and full time from about 2. Zero regrets. She got a head start on things like basic maths and English ahead of starting school. She got to do fun activities with other kids her age that I could never have provided to that level. She has kept some of those friendships through primary school. It has built her self confidence and certainly had no impact on our bond, we are very close.

On the other side it allowed me to continue my career, which allowed me to feel like an individual person as well as a mum, which in turn made me a better mum when she was home. As it turns out, her dad and I are now divorced, and keeping my career meant I could afford to buy the marital home so she hasn’t had to move. I can also afford to spend my weekends with her doing fun activities and can go on holidays together.

For us, it was very much the right choice

💯.

I had one child who attended nursery from 9 months, 5 days a week until she started school.

my second child has a SAHP- her dad.

I don’t think she particularly got any more out of it (apart from speech delay, which is why she needed to attend pre school and in essence why the government fund that) but she had fun I think. We aren’t jumping around in sand pit parents either way.

but then I had a SAHM and she didn’t enrich me either- all this external enrichment with crafts and facilitated play “home economics” is relatively new.

We just went around with her all day whilst she visited friends for tea, did chores, went to see our grandparents.
She spent loads of time cleaning and organising which I hated, but now I have my own children I recognise the same reaction from them because I can’t drop making dinner to go and play frisbee 😂

And thinking about my own experiences the value of my SAHm was really when I was older and needing support to manage a slightly more independent life - someone to talk through friendship problems with, or help with managing homework, or listen to me read. Not to build blocks or make me purées.

babies need an attachment. Once they have this it isn’t broken without concerted long term effort/ like adoption.
Not making an attachment with a mother who is available (which almost all are in this country due to mat leave) is very rare and indicated serious problems with the child, tbh.

that’s why referring to attachment theory in this conversation is flawed

Why do people talk about 'outcomes' as if that means anything? Nobody is disputing that children who spend the majority of their early years in childcare can be academic or successful or whatever. It's not about outcomes - what does that even mean? And at what point in life do you measure it? Surely it's about deciding in the best quality of life for your children in the here and now, not projected outcomes. I'm NOT saying 'childcare = bad quality of life' by the way because that's ridiculously simplistic and 'quality of life ' obviously depends on so many factors and the wider context which is different for every family. But equally, it's a bit weird to say, my child got a first at uni therefore childcare had a good outcome.

As a sort of comparison, my DH was sent to a boarding school the day after his 7th birthday. It suited his parents and their priorities and they will now claim it had a good outcome because of where he got to in life. But that doesn't mean he wouldn't have been happier elsewhere along the way.

A woman’s place is in the wrong

It was a long while ago now, but my oldest 3 went to Day Nursery full time, I didn't feel guilty at all. My youngest was at home with me and I don't feel like she was at any sort of advantage

Outcomes are at population level which is why people are asking for evidence of the claims made

I do think, by the way, if you know you need to work because being a stay-home mum would make you depressed, or financially unstable or mentally ill, then you should work obviously because a depressed mum, bored and staring into space all day, is no good for anyone. I have a friend who freely admits she can't be with her baby, one on one, for more than a few hours at a stretch and I think she's quite brave to admit that and seek help instead (in the form of a live-in nanny).

yes happiness is an outcome as much as academic success.

I have not seen any evidence that children who go to nursery are less happy than children who don’t. How on earth can that be measured?

I think there is also a world of difference between putting you child in nursery and seeing them in the mornings/ evenings and weekends (at a time when they are likely not not remember much long term anyway) and sending a 7 year old away from family completely for long periods.

I don’t think that’s very common tbh. I don’t think there are many women who would be genuinely impacted medically by being SAHM. They might not get much satisfaction out of it, they might be bored and sad but if it led to a serious medical issue I’d suspect they’d struggle more in the workplace anyway tbh.

Id rather hope the solution when this is the case for the dad to step up, but you know, lazy men and their patriarchy.

Yes for comparison boarding school syndrome is a recognised psychological trauma, yet there is no equivalent for condition for children who went to day nursery

I’m at other side of this with an adult teen dc. Lots with young children just focus on baby/toddler stage. Parenting is a long haul with different chapters.
I know some mums tied selves in knots to avoid nursery but then ended up struggling to find work and ended up with children in wrap around at school all week whereas those who had kept going often had scope to work flexibly or pt. You’re so lucky they said. Wasn’t luck if I’d jacked in job for 3 years I’d have found it virtually impossible to go back to my profession and probably had to suck up a ft role and long commute if I had managed it. Instead I worked pt and mainly from home way before it was more common.
She materially benefited from me working - hobbies, extra curricular, trips, nice holidays, driving lessons, uni funding. I was able to give lots of advice and input at sixth form stage as she’s going into same field.
The nursery staff weren’t disinterested. Just totally different to me and what I’d have done with her. She remembers walking in one day and they were reenacting X factor, her 3 yr old friend loudly announced I’m Cheryl. The football coach called her Miss Pink, she wouldn’t have been playing football each Friday with me. They had a nice retired lady called Jean who did French with them, took them to the park, the allotment, walked them across to dance school to do street dance, she only did ballet with me. Takes a village and all that.
We have a nursery at end of street. Children are always playing out. They take them out daily in high viz walking or in double prams if babies - people stop and interact with them. Never been inside but they always look happy and staff engaged and the staff aren’t all young.

This is why I’m not a SAHM. I feel like working makes me a better mother and I don’t see how an unhappy SAHM benefits children.

Idk, my husband misses us during the day and feels badly about having had to work so much with his first two daughters. He’s cut back some since he had our DD, but still expresses guilt over the nights he has to work late. I would think hardly any parents prefer to see their children for an hour in the morning and maybe an hour or two at night, for 5 days a week.

(I also think men aren’t as suited for childcare as women are, as a general rule.)