Should I ask to be a shareholder too? DH company etc

[isthisfairtodo]

Ok I’m going to try to explain this without completely outing myself here, so bear with me.

My DH has a good income, of which 50 percent flows into an investment company be co-owns with his father. This is for apparent company benefits.

I have work full time, but make around half of what my DH makes. The amount flowing into the investment company is equivalent to my entire salary.

my DH pays for all bills/ mortgage/ cars and one child’s education and I pay for our other child’s education , as well as quite a bit of our household expenses. Food shopping etc.

in any case, I am the default parent, I leave work early / work from home when kids are sick and I take care of our household. DH works long hours and I manage my job around his hours.

question is - is it fair for me not to be part of this investment company too ? Seeing as he’s putting so much money into it ( very little wise )? If he decides to leave me one day, I won’t have many rights over the investments that have grown over the years, seeing as his father is part of the company and I’m not. So my DH shares would be diluted.

I make a lot of sacrifices too, to enable my DH to work the hours he needs to, to enable him to even earn the money to put into the investments.

wouldn’t it be fairer if I was also a shareholder ?

thanks for your help!

Can you have a discussion about rebalancing costs so that a significant/fair proportion of cash can be used to invest for you of the monthly HH income? Whether that's investment, pension or both?

I agree you shouldn't be left empty-handed, but this is not true...
He would not be able to build his empire if I didn’t work and look after the kids and home.
He sounds economically savvy, probably learnt from hos dad and he has a well paid job. With or without you, he'd find a way.

May be worth finding a solicitor or some sort to help you figure out your position. Or he pays the second school fee amd you start your own investments.

You need to start from the ground up get an agreement on 50-50 childcare so you can work properly & build investments (especially if you have no household bills) & if that doesn't work for him work out a new financial arrangement

@Dweetfidiloveah ok so me taking work off him so he can focus on his work is worth nothing ? Also the fact I’m actually a high earner too and was an even better earner before we had kids, has enabled him to be able to save even more money etc. if I was on minimum wage, he’d need to pay for absolutely everything - I wouldn’t have been able to invest in our joint company OR pay 50-50 for our house.

we are in this together. He’d struggle to work the hours he does AND save as much money as he does- if he didn’t have me and had to pay a nanny upwards of 4k a month minimum.

get real, honestly. I know people love to stick the knife into women’s contributions but it really shouldn’t be other women doing that !

It does sound an unfair set up which I would not be happy with. I would see a solicitor just to question where this leaves you in case of divorce or the death of your husband or father in law. I think a solicitor is better to advise you how to protect yourself if the above happens rather than us on mumsnet. Go get legal advice & explain to husband why.

Of course your contribution is worth plenty, hence you should get a lawyer to work out what that is worth or hand him the second set of school fees.

Honestly, I'm not trying to stick the knife in or belittle your contributions, but men find a way - his mom, his sister, hired help, boarding school etc. He will do what is necessary to make that money and he won't feel bad about it. Women are generally the martyrs of this world.

I'm guessing there's a reason you're feeling the need to 'cement' your position, and I wish you every success in accomplishing that. And as a high earner, I trust you are as meticulous about securing your financial future, as he is.

How comfortable are your conversations around your family finances? Presumably he's doing this for the benefit of your family?

There are some mad people giving advice on here!

Women here are constantly advising other mums to get their “ducks in a row” which is all you’re proactively doing OP.

Pay for independent advice. You’re doing a disproportionate amount of the home and childcare to facilitate his job prospects so of course you’re concerned as there’s no obvious financial reward to yourself.

Perhaps he could top up your pensions with the extra cash he has. Get advice.

OP - you've said that the company is co-owned by your husband and his father. Everyone has assumed that they own the company 50/50, but I don't think you've explicitly said that. Apologies if you have said and I missed it. Do you know for sure if they have a 50/50 split? It's common for small one man band companies to have a 99/1 ownership split, where the legally required second person just owns 1 share.

You need to see a financial advisor.

You need to get some financial advice, more specifically you need to talk to someone to understand what questions you should be asking your husband.

Then sit down with him and have an honest, calm and civilised conversation.
You are both on a treadmill. He has no time with his family and does not give you any support other than financial due to this obligation.
You are on an exhausting treadmill to juggle everything else and it's a) limiting your earning abilities and b) you have no sight of whether or not any of it is worth it.

You are worried about his health and have reasonable concerns as to where joint family money is going. What happens if he suddenly dies, what happens if his father dies? What is the will? What are the risks around his father's share? What is the share? 50% having made no contribution or a 1% ownership? Is he expecting that his father's inheritors will do the decent thing or is it specifically and legally protected?

Specifically a financial advisor may ask questions around the nature of the investment. Is it a company or actually just an investment vehicle. Will it legally be considered a marital asset in the event of a split? Is it in a trust, who are the beneficiaries? Are there exit fees on the funds? Is there an obligation to maintain contributions? What are the ramifications in the event of a sudden change in family circumstances?

Not knowing any of this is causing you significant stress. It's not unreasonable to ask for financial transparency in a marriage.

Then, depending on the answers you can make a plan* together. Or not as the case may be.

This could take several forms. You make a smaller financial contribution; you both buy in more help allowing you to spend more time at work; you change the ownership of the house into your name if his funds are in his and will be challenging; could be lots of ways to balance this

Ultimately, it sounds like you need more of a balance in your relationship and family responsibilities, before you even get to this investment fund. Asking you to take the load and kill your career in return for an unspecific outcome is a patronising joke.

thanks for everyone’s advice. I’m really really trying to make more money and do a good job at work. I think it will start paying off but it’s a high risk / high reward kind of work that I do. I do work full time but I am the one to pick up all the rest of things. Let’s just say there are men in my industry, doing my job - who have wives at home with maybe a part time job, as they say they wouldn’t be able to do the job without their wives support..

yet I’m trying to do the same job, while being the one that’s also supporting my husbands job. And potentially if he leaves me or something happens, I will have nothing to show for that.

lots have asked why I’m worrying about this now. Nothing has happened specifically, but you just never know what the future holds.

I think the kicker is that he could be sending half his income into our joint company and we could make our investments there, but he refuses to do it because I can’t contribute the same at the moment, until I am able to save more money etc and pay in the same as he can.

I think the kicker is that he could be sending half his income into our joint company and we could make our investments there, but he refuses to do it because I can’t contribute the same at the moment, until I am able to save more money etc and pay in the same as he can.

This is the thing that stands out so much to me. You have a joint company between you and realistically this is where he should be putting his money but is choosing not to until you can match it.

But in the meantime he is perfectly happy to divert his money into another company that you are not part of.

To make matters worse his father co owns this other company with your DH and the father contributes nothing financially to said company. So why does your DH have no problem with his father's lack of financial commitment, and keeps injecting funds in himself, when he refuses to do so to a company that you two jointly own because you are unable to contribute financially at the moment yourself?

The fact that he won't have open and honest discussion about all of this is hugely worrying. I would also be extremely wary of the fact that the father owns 50% of this other company without actually contributing to it at all. What is that all about? Why should the father benefit from the company without any financial input and at the expense of his son?

There's quite a lot of things that just don't add up here. Is this other company some form of retirement option for the father that his son is paying for?

He sounds economically savvy, probably learnt from hos dad and he has a well paid job. With or without you, he'd find a way.

Actually that’s not sure at all.
Without the OP, who would look after the dcs, pay for private school/nanny, clean the house, do the shopping, take them to all their activities? Oh and take time off when they are ill.
Just now he is living the life of a single man who can put his job as a high priority. Without the OP? He’d have to reassess. Take time off etc etc… and of course pay proportionately to his income, which he doesn’t atm.

Rather than savvy, he looks selfish. And the type of person who wants his cake and eat it. No consideration or respect at all to the OP and the work she is putting in to keep the show running AND still be a high earner.

Lets be honest, he is berating the OP for not earning enough (that’s why she isn’t the ‘scheme’ with his dad) whilst not paying in proportion to his wage (he insists it has to be 50/50). Just that is pretty shit

@Kipperandarthur i agree with you there.
Thats also why she needs to see a lawyer, not a financial advisor.

Let me try to rephrase the problem. You are getting increasingly angry that DH is putting a lot of time and money into something, which means you spend more time on the kids than he does, yet you see no benefit for you nor the children from his extra work because it's being done 50% for his father and you have no say over that nor over the time/ benefit of the other 50%. Is that correct? It might help to take the money out of it. "DH, I'm spending a lot more time on the kids than you are, I'd like to rebalance things now." If he says "Well I'm busy with work", then you can articulate that his "busy" is not set up to benefit the family unit as it stands, so it's actually a hobby instead. He can do it in his hobby time, or he can even up the savings.

How long have you been married BTW? We were together about 10 years before I finally put DH on my company, it didn't seem appropriate initially and then time flew by when I should have done. If he'd raised it, then I would have sorted it out earlier but he never did. It might be that statements on equality of contributions from years ago are less relevant now you've been together for longer. Maybe do worry slightly if not.

The father is in it to benefit the company because he has history in the business / benefits it in that way. Even though he doesn’t pay into it. His name appearing helps apparently. Like I described - he brings with him, benefits.

I do believe that to be true. Rather than the father wanting to milk it for his retirement. He doesn’t need to.

but he doesn’t work in the company or provide funds. Does that make sense to anyone ?

OK.

But why does your husband need another separate business that has the father as a figurehead, that your DH injects money into, when he has this other business with you that is operating in the same field? Your joint business that he now refuses to inject money into unless you match it?

Why does the father not have shares in your joint company instead as a figurehead?

So how does the investment company work? How would the company work you could put funds in if you had funds?

That only makes full sense to me if your DH is scamming people. Perhaps there is some nuance I'm not getting here though.

Regardless, not your money, so it's a hobby, so he needs to start pulling his weight. If he wants to treat it as family investment worth family time, then it needs to be shared.

If your H wanted to keep money in his immediate family he would be giving you 50% of the share in the investment company, NOT his Dad!

He’s a nasty dick op, exploiting you essentially. Thats what this is- oh no we can’t save together until you can pull your weight, I’ll be home late again because im busy making more money just for meee. What are you going to do to change? How nuclear can you go? Or just tell him you’re leaving, since he doesn’t see you as an equal, respect your contribution or parent his children so he doesn’t deserve the outside world thinking he has a family. Say you’ll tell people the truth- he focused on work and ignored his family, kept his money to himself and told you it was because you didn’t earn enough in the job you fitted in between looking after your family and supporting him. Women will look at him with that expression, that says they know who he is.

It wouldn't though as she can't make FIL giver her any of his shares . So it would be sharing her husbands fifty percent. So no better off

This actually does make sense to me.

My husband has shares in a number of companies for essentially this reason (he hasn’t purchased them, he’s provided expert consultancy/ongoing advisory role etc and been given shares).

However, if it’s to do with who is running the company, you’d be a director rather than a shareholder really - directors actually operate the company and they don’t need to be shareholders to do this. That’s what would give people confidence in person X being associated with it. And you certainly wouldn’t have 50% shares.

If his dad was (for example) a director of the business and held 10% shares, what you’re saying (he’s saying) would make sense. But you don’t give someone 50% shares just for lending their name and reputation to it…

I reckon the dad has 50% shares so if you ever divorce H he only has to give you 25% of the business rather than 50.si 75% of the business stays with him and his in event of divorce.

Yes. Yes you do.

There is nothing stopping him reducing his share of the company to 1% in the event of an impending divorce or signing it all over to his father.

You are correct - you make it possible for him to make these investments by sacrificing your own career trajectory to bring up your children. Leaving him free to focus on his career and investing.

The posters suggesting your are gold digging clearly have no idea what equality and equity look like in a marriage. All you are asking for is equal protection, equal reward and equal ownership of the benefits mutually attained during your marriage - in performing your various roles in the "family unit"