To ask a parent to move their buggy from a café so I can sit down?

[TheUmberFawn]

Went to a busy café at lunchtime. One table was occupied by a mum with a large pram taking up the space of two chairs. There were no other free tables, so I asked politely if she could move it so I could sit. She gave me a dirty look and mumbled something about needing space. I get that babies come with stuff but why should that mean no one else can sit? AIBU for asking?

Take the baby out of the highchair and have a cold water you selfish mother!!

Absolutely Op 💯 though the Mum should have given up her baby's space at the table.

We don't even know if the baby was asleep or awake. That coffee might have been Mums blessed 10mins of peace.
Not every baby sleeps for hours in the middle of the day.

Ah that's mega selfish, taking up a WHOLE table, and no money for the cafe in a glass of tap water 😜

You’re right, mothers should just stay out of cafes full stop! Other people are trying to enjoy a nice toastie.

And while we’re at it, mothers with babies in supermarkets! Surely there are moans to be had there too.

Now I'm going to sing the praises 👏 of my local Sainsbury's.
My youngest had a bad habit of falling asleep 😴 in the trolley seat. I'd end up trying to do the shopping holding his wee head in one hand and tossing stuff into the trolley with the other. Which was do able just.

Sainsbury's would end up having someone organise my shopping through the checkout. Putting it on the checkout and packing it. Never did I have to ask. It was offered, "would you like a hand?"

Hindsight I should have carried a sling but I never really thought it would keep happening.

She asked. I don't think she directed. It does seem strange you've never had to share a table. I'm not sure why you are changing language to things like 'directed the mum' to make OP sound unreasonable. Unless she stated that in another post and I missed it? I thought she asked. It's almost like you're changing the situation just so you can be outraged. You don't have to reword things prefixing it with "So basically what you're saying" just so you can get more annoyed.

In my whole life I've had to share a table plenty of times. It's not exactly a hardship. I really don't get the outrage about sharing a table in a busy cafe. Most people are actually friendly and don't mind sharing. In the last five years, I've willing shared a table at a hospital cafe which was always heaving, in a Costa, in a railway station in Switzerland, in London - frequently in a variety of places. I've even been asked by a mum to keep an eye on her four year old so she could pay for their food and drinks then share my table about six months ago. Why would I be angry about that?

If you go anywhere where it's busy, you absolutely can't assume there will be a table free by the time you've finished paying. I wonder if a lot of people in this thread don't go out much, or only go to huge mall style coffee shops with not many customers.

I'm not sure why you are changing language to things like 'directed the mum' to make OP sound unreasonable. Unless she stated that in another post and I missed it?

@DaniO2 I think some of the inference that the op wasn’t as polite as she made out, is coming from her now deleted post where she said that 80% of the people on mumsnet were ‘batshit crazy’ and ‘’miserable’ because they weren’t ‘getting a good f*’ at home.
possibly an incorrect assumption. But the op didn’t paint herself as someone who took being refuse / disagreed with well.

Wow! I definitely missed that! Thanks for pointing it out. It's much easier to understand why some posters are reacting the way they are knowing that background. Thank you.

@DontCallMeKidDontCallMeBaby

Thanks for pointing that out. It's fairly clear Op was unreasonable. Without that bit.

Let's hope she didn't really upset the Mum. Those first few months are hard going. Just trying to keep going. You get used to something then baby changes. Just to keep you on your toes.

This is the first time on MN I’ve ever see
n someone castigated for wanting to share a table in a crowded cafe!. Usually the response to crowded cafes is along the lines of Don’t be selfish/unreasonable. You must share tables particularly if there’s only one adult using a table which could accommodate 4 people.

@TheUmberFawn YANBU.

I don’t like sharing a table in a cafe but if there’s nowhere else, it’s really unpleasant or unkind not to if someone asks. I just don’t want them to try to talk to me!

I hate sharing a table with a stranger as I'm shy. However, I'm also polite and will say yes if someone asks.

But ... tables for two are usually very small and sitting immediately opposite someone at one of those is really quite intimate. It's something you do with family or friends, not strangers. It probably involves knees touching, having to move things on the table to accommodate the other person and being so close and not talking or making eye contact would be awkward. Sitting diagonally on a table for 4, whilst not my ideal choice, is far less uncomfortable.

What if you were at a 2 seat table with your baby in the other space (in place of the second chair)?

It was a tablet for 2.
Mum & Baby.

Op has no clue where she expected the Baby to go. Swing from the ceiling??

We don't even know if the baby was awake. Golden rule of baby's don't wake a sleeping baby.

Ordinarily if I was on my own at a table I probably wouldn't object to much to someone else sharing.

But the Mum wasn't alone. She had a baby 👶 And we have zero knowledge of her. For all we know she could be BFing. And the thought of a stranger male or female sitting directly opposite me while I was trying to feed my first would have filled me with horror.

Exactly then imagine getting your boob's out. Or the faff that is trying to sort a bottle (as I said earlier I've zero experience, but it looks a faff and seems to be a ton of stuff, tubs of powder, flasks of water & the actual bottle) that's a lot of stuff on a tiny table.

Even if I was on my own at a cafe, op should ask if she can take a seat at my table. I could be waiting for someone, I could have anxiety and struggle with strangers. I think it’s rude to just assume you can sit on someone’s table.

And here comes the prejudice and discrimination against mothers on a platform designed to be a voice for parents… it’s no wonder we are still fighting for equality.

So it was a 2 person table with two people at it op. Her baby and their pram being the second person. Yabu.

Buggies have wheels and are literally made to move the baby around? Is this really a question?

What is confusing about this? You shift it along a bit so that another paying adult can sit down. It's a cafe, it's not hot desking or trying to eat a sit down meal.

Honestly the disingenuous rigidity of some people.

You need to seriously get a grip.

You cannot be serious that you're ok with "getting your 'boob's'"* out in a public place, but sitting across the table from a stranger is a step too far?!

I'm willing to understand and accept that some people might feel uncomfortable, but I'm sorry, that's for you to deal with, and you don't deal with it by shooting nasty glances at a person who has completely reasonably asked to take the spare chair at your table because you happen to have a baby.

PS if you want my credentials, I have three children, two of whom are twins, and I managed to take them out without shooting shitty looks at people who wanted to share my table or whatever.

@Sofiewoo is there a difference between having a coffee with a friend at the same table when your child is in attendance, or just when it's a stranger? Do you ensure that you're sitting somewhere where you guarantee no one is going to have an accident? I mean, by all means take a personal risk assessment and don't do things you're uncomfortable with, but if you think shooting someone a shitty look when they ask a reasonable question is appropriate then you're the problem here.

I'm deadly serious i would happily BF anywhere but especially with my first my seat was carefully choosen.
I'd opt for the seat with my back to the majority of the cafe.
I really wouldn't be impressed if someone plonked themselves facing me at the other side of MY table completely invading MY privacy.

The chair might be spare but the space is taken with the buggy and child. She might be using the buggy itself to provide a bit of privacy too.

I’m shocked at the amount of people that think it’s completely normal to expect to share a table for 2 with a complete stranger. It’s not at the establishments I frequent, thank god!

I suspect she might have been banned.

Cafes tend to be tightly packed, esp independent cafes.
If the mum moved the buggy from the other side of her 2 seater table, where would she put it, without it getting in the way of other people or other tables?

I can't believe on a Mums forum how many people have forgotten what life is actually like with a small baby.
How is the world so hostile to a new mum and a tiny baby?

I cannot believe the only table with a empty seat, and not even a spare place was the Mums.

The Op hasn't actually come back to say what she eventually did. I bet the answer is she joined a different table with someone else on it. Or waited for somebody to leave.

This is totally unrealistic though - if I was in a cafe with a buggy I firstly would have looked to see if there was space where I could leave it to the side unless ds was asleep in it. Often there wasn't because that's wasted space that could have been filled with tables and seats. So next best option is to find the smallest table and remove a chair and have the buggy in place of the chair.

"Its a cafe its not... trying to eat a sit down meal" I don't know about others but I usually sit down to eat my meals in cafés... and when you've a small baby you certainly don't want to be eating or drinking hot things over the top of them.

Blow that. Very often when ours were small, the only time I got to eat hot food was at a cafe. My husband worked away all week and cooked at weekends. I went to a cafe when I was sick of sandwiches and cold coffee 😁

The sort of person who wants to muscle in on a tiny, two seat table with someone they don’t know often wants to talk to that someone too. Last thing I wanted when I just needed 10 minutes peace and a hot drink whilst baby slept.

I wouldn't be moving my pram that had my baby in it, where was she supposed to put it if the cafe was that busy? My pram can't fold unless I take the seat off and it's a 2 handed job so hers might be the same, can't reasonably expect a mother alone with her baby to do that just so you could sit at the same table as her