To not want to be DP’s tenant?

[barhumbug]

DP and I have been together almost 4yrs. I moved in with him as he owns his own home and at the time we met I was in shared accommodation so it made a lot more sense. He has always wanted me to feel like it’s ‘my’ home rather than me living in his house but I can’t help but still feeling like I am. He’s never made me feel that way but it’s always in the back of my mind that I am and I hoped that one day this would change.

Since I moved in he has refused to allow me to contribute a penny to anything related to the house. I give a contribution to bills but that’s it. Mortgage, white goods that need replacing etc have all been paid by him 100%. I have offered to contribute to white goods but he has refused. I understand completely his reluctance to allow me to contribute to the mortgage as he doesn’t want me having any kind of claim to any part of his house if we were to split. Fair enough, I absolutely understand, he worked really hard to buy his home and I wouldn’t want to take away any part of that.

Due to an inheritance he has now paid off the mortgage in full so is mortgage free. Fantastic! He is now thinking about potentially upgrading to a bigger property with parking as we live in a very desirable area and parking is a nightmare. Plus maybe having an extra bedroom for guests to visit etc.

However, property is expensive here and the size/type he is looking at would be right at the top of his budget, meaning his living costs would increase a lot with a new mortgage. Basically, he could just about afford it on his own but it would be a stretch. His plan, as it currently stands is for me to pay ‘rent’ as a contribution to housing costs but I wouldn’t be on the mortgage or have a claim to any part of the house so he would keep everything in the event of a split.

Due to a combination of unfortunate circumstances when I met DP I was in the process of digging myself out of debt and had no savings. Since then I’m very proud of myself in that I’ve managed to completely clear my debts, rebuild my credit rating to excellent and have a few grand in savings. As such I have very little chance of getting a property on my own but we could easily afford a decent place together with our joint earnings.

Aibu in thinking I’m not ok with this? It doesn’t make sense (to me) for him to stretch himself super thin just to be able to keep 100% of the risk and responsibility of a new house while I pay him ‘rent’ and effectively build nothing for myself? I will obviously continue to save as much as I can anyway but I still would have no chance of buying my own place if we split in the future. He doesn’t have any immediate plans to buy, he’s thinking ahead for 5yrs time to enable him to
build a bigger deposit for a new place. He could change his mind in that time as by then we would have been together almost 9yrs but I’m not
sure I want take that risk. I see us very much as being in a long term, potentially life long partnership and I really want us to have something that is ‘ours’ and currently there is nothing. All our finances are separate, we won’t be getting married as he is staunchly against it. I’ve come to terms with that and I’m ok with it as I understand his reasoning but for some reason this feels like a hill I’m willing to die on. I’m sure he does love me and very much also sees us as a life long partnership but I know he also got badly burned by a previous long term partner and narrowly avoided losing his home when they split so I’m sure that’s a big factor here.

I just really don’t want to be his ‘tenant’. I want to be an equal partner and if this goes ahead I will still feel like I’m ’living in his house’ no matter how much he wants me to see it as ‘ours’. I can’t quite explain but it feels like the power dynamic would be totally off. I’m not even sure how the logistics would work, would I have a tenancy agreement etc?

I’m not sure if I’m making a bigger deal of it than it is? Tbh I’m only in the position I’m in now because of his encouragement and support and this feels a bit like I’m throwing my toys out the pram if I don’t get my way. I don’t know if it’s worth throwing away what is, in every other sense a fantastic relationship.

*We don’t have kids and will be staying child free so no need to worry about any of that!

@MrsBreadPitt I’d love to get married but he’s made it very clear that he doesn’t and I’ve accepted the relationship on those terms. I can’t force him, nor would I want to.

When my DH and I bought a house together, we weren’t married. He also had kids from a previous relationship. I was cautious about protecting what I’d paid in and him his share. We owned the house as ‘Tennants in common’ eventhough the split was 48/52, so pretty close to equally owned. It meant in our wills both of our individual interests were protected.

Could you not do something like this?

It is very reasonable after 4 years to say that you want to buy somewhere together and stick to this but as PP have said he should benefit from putting in more equity. So if he put in 100k and you put in 20k and then you split the mortgage 50:50 and the house went from 300k to 600k, then you need to work out how much of the capital has been repaid at the time of sale, then split that 50:50 and add to your initial sums. So if 20k in capital paid off then effectively he has put in 110k and you have put in 30k and then the sale proceeds are split based on that ratio (any interest paid shouldn't be taken into account).

If you have been contributing to bills then you haven't been paying rent - they are separate.

How much is he proposing you pay? I don't think it should be 'market rate' as he is also getting a benefit in having you live there and contribute. So perhaps you find a figure you are comfortable with, for example 50% of what you'd pay elsewhere.

On here women are allowed and advised to protect their assets, men are NOT

Then I don't think you are compatible. Surely?!

You'd 'love' to get married.

That's not something to compromise on?

You're basically his lodger, who probably provides sex and does all the cooking

No: you can’t be committed without marriage. He is specifically unwilling to commit to the level of marriage —I don’t blame him for it. Its his choice. But marriage is marriage and “live with me and pay me rent for a while” is exactly no commitment at all. maybe this man, and this lifestyle, seemed wonderful compared to what you endured before from men. But its not very loving, trusting, or safe for you. Because he doesn’t trust you or the “committed relationship “ enough to actually, you know, plan for a future with and for you. He has one eye in a future without you and ond foot out the door.

Do actually want to move? Do you get a say in the new house and furnishings / moving process and so on or is all the just happening to you?
it all sounds awful- and no I would not pay a penny for his investment.

@Pigsears I would love to but it’s not a deal breaker. He has so many other lovely qualities I felt he was worth it. I was married before to a twat so I know first hand marriage isn’t everything.

Agree, this is an outrageously cheeky plan on your part. He should absolutely not agree to this.

You can’t afford to buy, so you use his home to leverage you onto the property ladder. No risk, as your housing isn’t currently secure anyway. He takes all of the risk (potentially having to sell if you split) and then pays you your profit on your £10K, and your housing situation is just as insecure as it’s always been?

Fuck that. He’s right OP, sorry. Maybe there is too much discrepancy in your incomes to work, especially if he doesn’t see you as his life partner. Being totally against marriage is suspicious

But he must've given you a reason? If it is because he doesn't want the financial risk, then it also makes sense he doesn't want to buy a house together. If he doesn't want the commitment, then again this shouldn't be a surprise.

I think you have done very well out of him financially over the last three years, clearing your debt and getting yourself back on the level.

I think you need to have a conversation with him about your financial goals and long-term security.

If it is just the two of you, why is he wanting such a big next house and to financially stretch himself so much? Why not suggest rather than paying him full rent, you pay half and save half with a view to buying a small flat to rent out. Once you have achieved that, you then pay the mortgage on that, but then split the rental income with him. That way any down time between tenants you are protected from as you wouldn't owe rent those months, but you both benefit, plus you get the equity in that property.

If your relationship ends, you can walk away and you still own your own property.

This will be in 5 years time. Can you afford to save up as much as you can whilst you’re not paying much then get your own place. This financial imbalance is crazy and you must look after yourself even if that means leaving the relationship.

This. 100% this.

OP, you don’t want to turn round in fifteen years and have nothing.

What rent do you pay? Is it what a lodger pays? Or for a room in a shared house for example? If so then that should be a very small amount and you should be able to build up a substantial savings pot of your own.

If he stretches himself will this have an impact on your shared lifestyle eg can you both go out / go on holidays as much as before? As I wouldn't want to have to rein things in because my partner had bitten off more than he could chew rather than accept my help

Would you have any say where the house was / how to decorate / what sofa to buy etc (in the same way you would have if it was genuinely thought of as your home?)

If he genuinely is happy making joint decisions (eg location, furniture etc other than financial) I think I could live with this, other than if I was ever planning on having children. You can't have children with someone who won't share finances at all (eg what would happen if they were disabled and one of you had to give up work). And you can't have children with someone if you're effectively their lodger as they could kick you out at any point and then you'd be stuck as you'd be homeless so they would get custody.

There is protecting yourself but by not letting you even have a small share of any future property he seems to be doing so on the assumption that you'll split rather than the possibility.

@fatgirlswims well exactly if it’s 100% his house then no I don’t really get a say because it’s his house. I’m sure he would still ask my opinion but he would get the deciding vote and if we disagreed well..tough?

I want to be able to make those decisions together, and all big life decisions really if we are planning on staying together permanently.

Like you I wouldn't have a problem with DP wanting to continue owning the property he had before you met, but I would have a problem with moving into a new one with him and not co-buying it with him. Puts you at a big disadvantage.

If the relationship and your financial wellbeing matter to him, he should be open to the suggestion that you buy a place that you can afford half of - why not suggest it and see what he says?

I haven’t been living ‘rent free’ the past 4yrs, I have been paying a contribution to the bills/running costs/paying for food etc which is roughly equivalent to a cheap rental price for the area

But you'd have had all those costs even if you were living elsewhere, @barhumbug, plus rent on top, so the PP wasn't wrong in saying that the savings you've built up have been facilitated by paying no actual rent

You've been very wise to clear all your debts rather than spend the money elsewhere, but the reality is that you're simply not in a financial position to be "equal partners" - at least not without marriage, and you've not mentioned that he wants that?

At least you know where you stand with this man (who, incidentally, is only doing what women in a similar position are advised to) and if this more expensive purchase is a longer term plan I'd personally spend the time saving even harder so you have the means to get out if it all falls apart

Edited to add sorry - I see you said he's adamant about not wanting marriage, in which case your situation's even clearer ... only for pity's sake don't get pregnant

I think you need to explain to him what you have said about understanding why he would want to protect his house up until now, but that if he doesn’t want to get married you need to think about what happens if you split up or if he dies and you are not named on the mortgage and become homeless.

the two options are that he either splits the mortgage as described by pps so that you have a small share that is fair for both of you, or you continue contributing the same amount financially as you have been up until now so you can continue to save and potential buy somewhere to rent out in the future or invest somehow. If he doesn’t want to look out for your future security in any way then I don’t think he really loves you. If you start paying more now then he is the only person to gain and you lose out - this isn’t fair after 4 years together.

It gives you financial security - which you want too- (this this thread).

It's two important things for you though? Could you really compromise on that?

It's not going to happen. You are unfortunately, with your debt history, basically a bigger financial risk overall and he's not wanting to be saddled with that (if it happens again) or dragged down by it. He's protecting his financial interests.

Why not save your money in a high interest acct and when you have enough, use as a deposit on a small place you can rent out - so you've invested and also got a separate stream of income?

Not true. The OP is almost always exhorted to be financially prudent—most OP are female but if the OP is judged to be improvident then posters routinely take the side of the party with assets to be hoarded. Thats the throughline here in discussions of parental wealth and wealth inequity within a couple. Absent children women are routinely chastised for failing to earn enough money for full financial independence.

I would not like this either.

I knew someone in this situation, and in her late 40s and terminally ill, she ended up homeless after finding her partner had been long term cheating on her.

I can see his point of view too, but essentially he is asking you to not only remain housing insecure but also to subsidise his ability to buy a nicer house, without you having claim to the house. He's taking the piss really.

He isn’t being fair, you would be mad to do this. Even if you bought for example a fifth of the new house it would give you the chance to build equity.

I’ve heard of so many women that have done this and ended up in their 50’s and 60’s with no assets and their P or ex P has masses of equity and often a large pension as well.

No way. You won’t even have tenants rights. You can be thrown out on a whim.

Why do you have to live with him? It’s a very precarious option. I would buy my own home on shared ownership as you described, and carry on the relationship. If he declines, that tells you everything you need to know surely?

Relatively recently before your relationship with him, you were homeless and sofa surfing. You don’t earn enough to buy a property.

I’m sorry, but you’re too big a financial risk to go fully into something with. Especially when the other party is the opposite and has got themselves into a good financial situation (even though some was luck and inheritance).

You need to accept being a lodger essentially, or look for a relationship with someone who wants to partner with you for life. I don’t think he sees you that way currently.