To agree with Wes Streeting's statement that MH issues are overdiagnosed?

[Locutus2000]

Pretty controversial stuff.

Who decides?

I agree.

I agree

Yea, I think we are now pathologising normal (albeit uncomfortable) emotions and a range of personality traits.

That article and comment doesn’t really explain what he means.
Does he mean that people are getting diagnosed with formal mental health conditions when they don’t actually have one?
He talks about people not getting the support they need and support not coming early enough. Support for what? If there’s an over diagnosis of, say, anxiety and depression, surely more people should be getting treatment than actually warrant it?
If people are getting diagnosed but then left with no support, then it’s a support issue rather than the fact that they don’t really have MH issues.
Or is he saying that healthcare needs to be more proactive/ preventative? Because it’s absolutely the case at the moment that proper support isn’t really given until someone has reached crisis.

It’s unclear if he means doctors are over diagnosing people, in which case how’s he going to stop that, or the does he think the problem is the DWP writing people off irrespective of diagnosis. You can change the criteria for PIP but it’s unrelated to their diagnosis.

Weirdly I feel it is both over and under diagnosed.

I have a mental health condition I have suffered with my whole adult life. It impacts my quality of life quite a lot.

I have been to the GP countless times, been to private and NHS therapy, a private psychologist. I tried all the suggestions to help myself.

Eventually after about 13 years of struggling I did get a diagnosis and lovely validation from an amazing professional and he was quite upset on my behalf I hadn't been helped sooner.

I wasn't exactly begging for a diagnosis, and I am not a pushy personality in medical settings, so that may have had an impact.

But then I also know a lot of people diagnosed very, very quickly with Autism and ADHD including my own sister (who now sells her ADHD meds).

It has been eye opening getting back into working in school settings and seeing how many parents are adamant their child is SEN for what are very normal development stages and challenges.

(not denying some of the parents are completely valid).

So in my experience you have to be very pushy to get a diagnosis. I wonder how many do get a diagnosis because they were so adamant about it.

I've also heard in person and seen on social media people being angry they weren't given a diagnosis and they have been validated by comments that a self diagnosis is just as valid.

Whilst we know our own bodies and minds, I don't think the validity of a professional diagnosis should be ignored, especially when there are clearly people who abuse the system.

And a lot of more quiet people fall through the cracks and never get help.

yes, of course it's over diagnosed as you can see a doctor straight away and if you need to see a consultant because the needs are more complex, then there are no waiting lists. Because it's all so easy. and you never wait for years (I must image the 6 year waiting list one if my DC is currently on).

He's channeling his inner mini-Trump because UK politicians can only look west and never east.

He’s right. Unfortunately it’s all talk and no action. He’s neither bright, nor willing enough to do anything about it.

He’s saying all this just to push Two Tier off he cliff when he fails miserably at everything and needs replacing before the next election and then Streeting will swoop in and tell us all how he is the answer.

It’s playing on disablism. Over the last week alone on MN I had read people with no medical qualifications say medical professionals are over diagnosising medical conditions. Peoe not realising that the single biggest benefit is age related pension. Countless incorrect comments about PIP. I did a 30 second internet search to find out PIP is often paid to people in work and is based on need rather diagnosis. Far too many people forming opinions on very little knowledge.

Hmmm I think very few people are probably ‘neurotypical’ so perhaps we are too quick to diagnose compared to the past.

Absolutely, and using labels to opt out of every day life and responsibilities.

Weirdly I feel it is both over and under diagnosed.

I agree with this, I also think some do take the piss benefit wise whereas others deserve a lot more

Agree on both counts.

I support Wes Streeting on this.

A mixture. My late ADHD diagnosis has been a game changer for me, but I can see in my kids for example the tendancy to say things like "I can't because I have social anxiety" instead of "I'm nervous about XYZ". Pathologising a perfectly normal if uncomfortable feeling or emotion. "I have depression" as against "I didn't sleep well and am feeling too tired for school" or "my friends are being unkind so I'm sad".

I spent a long time with my middle child when he was around 10, cause he used to get very sad at bedtime about various issues because he was tired...and once he started he could spiral. I wanted him to feel able to cope with the feeling, so we would say things like "it is just a feeling, feelings can feel good or bad, they can't hurt you etc. Sometimes you'll feel sad, you need to let yourself feel that way and just sit with it for a while." He is now 13 and getting pretty resilient, he is still a deep thinker and feeler but doesn't get lost in it. 🤞

If a negative feeling doesn't pass for a long time, and no steps you can take help then yes, it may indicate an issue. But otherwise it is all part of the peaks and troughs of the human condition.

I have to ask people if they have "support needs" as part of a risk assessment. Can interview 20 people a day, have been for 5 years.

Can't remember the last time someone didn't answer with yes, they have support needs as they have depression and anxiety.

I've had bouts of depression and anxiety over my lifetime but never like people seem to have these days when it seemingly never goes away. I have also always managed to work despite these (in stressful jobs) because frankly I couldn't afford to live on sick pay or benefits so had no choice anyway!

I really do think there needs to be WAY more support about people with MH conditions being able to stay in (or get into) full time employment rather than the alternative of not working at all.

I actually think the wrong MH issues are over diagnosed - it’s really easy to say someone has “depression and anxiety” when actually it’s something else.

but I suppose there’s a wait list for other professionals and actual help.

I think jobs are more demanding now - there were jobs such as bank teller, secretary, filing clerk. Bin men and posties weren’t given targets they had to achieve.
With email now there is no relief from constantly being at work. Even supermarkets seem quite pressured.
So what are the depressed, anxious, inattentive etc to do. What they might want is quiet, part time, to be able to control demands on them, a choice of start time. How would this work?

Yes. My depression and anxiety was undiagnosed ADHD and B12 issues.

His interview is quite confused.

But my view on overdiagnosis is that it would be a medical issue around doctors acting properly, not a benefits one
.

I also have no idea what the right amount of diagnosis is? If we all catch the plague there's no point saying it's no longer plague because too many people have it.

He would say that, his government wants to cut disability benefits. The majority of young people on DB have been diagnosed with mental health issues.

There could be other reasons other than misdiagnosis for example, a generation brought up on screens with access to all sorts of weird shit including hard core porn or being brought up under Tory austerity with little access to support services.

It is more complex than just "is it A or B?". But there is strong evidence from professionals that over-diagnosis does happen. Obviously, not for everyone. Feelings of sadness, stress and anxiety are completely normal - they are part of the human condition, and we have to learn to deal with them. We don't need to pathologise and medicalise every emotion we have.

I think it's a difficult one and I think if more work was done on resilience and early help it'd be a lot better. I had a really awful time a couple of years ago and wasn't coping well which was resulting in me feeling overwhelmed and anxious about things I previously could've rationalised and dealt with. I went to my GP he actually said the problem isn't you and what you're feeling it's the world, you had a huge unexpected bereavement and then your own medical emergency, in the past people were given time and space to grieve, a year of mourning was normal. The world is too fast, you were back at work 3 weeks after the bereavement and then 6 weeks after your own emergency surgery. You haven't had time to process those emotions and that's what you need to do. He referred me for counselling, no diagnosis or anything just counselling, it helped massively.

As someone said, it's both over and underdiagnosis, and also incorrectly directed diagnosis. In our area, ADHD assessments are done by CAMHS, but it's not a mental health condition (although can, like many things cause MH challenges), it's neurodevelopmental, so should be done by specialist paediatricians. Leaving CAMHS for children in MH crisis, eating disorders.

It's a difficult one, it's much harder to concretely diagnose as there isn't a blood test or a scan for it. Which makes it no less valid a need, but open to abuse, both from patients and from drs denying care based on their opinion.

I had PNA, and it was a battle to get correctly diagnosed, and then to get the right support. My area were useless, it was only when I stayed with my parents (as i was suicidal and my DH needed to go to work but i couldn't safely be left on my own) that I got the right support, such a Postcode lottery.

And as above 2 posters accurately state, there are features of the human condition that are over medicalised, sadness is not always depression, stress is not always anxiety, being careful and methodical isn't always OCD, challenging behaviour isn't always PDA. Sometimes we just need rest, time, a good listener, but in this fast paced world it can be hard to get that.

Anxiety diagnoses are very dangerous imo. Real care needs to be taken when signing off on this.

I have a teenage daughter who tells me that practically every single one of her girl friends have anxiety. They don’t. They just get stressed like every teenager in the world, ever.
Telling children that they have anxiety is telling them that they can’t cope with lots of situations. Instead we should be telling them that getting stressed is a normal emotion and we should be teaching them how to deal with it. I have serious concerns for the generation coming through right now. Very few will be able to properly function in life because they’ve been told, formally, that they can’t.