All crime docs are about men killing women!

[SwoopDog]

I was trying to find somehing to watch on Netflix last night. Looked at crime documentaries. They're all about men killing women. Or men killing children.

I like a bit of true crime sometimes, but it's actually too much. What the hell have we been putting up with over decades and centuries! There was a guest on Steven Bartletts Diary of a CEO who said the most dangerous person to a woman is her husband! I believe it. We've taken this shit for too long.

The last time I remember being 'whistled' at. It was quite a while ago now. Large building site, London, afternoon, I was heading to a meeting.

Men: [whistles, growls] Look at that! Nice bit of stuff! Show us yer tits!
Me: Show us your dick first!
Some men: Hahaha.
Other men: Ugly bitch. Mouth on that.

Recently: white van, three men, approaching from behind me.

Men: [noisy horn toots, yells, growls]
Van passes ...
Men: Fucking hell, love, you looked all right from the back!
Men to each other: She aged 20 years in 100 yards, hahahaha!

At least the van men called me "she" instead of "it".

They're all harmless, right? It's part of a woman's job to decorate any scene. She ought to appreciate random men letting everyone know they're having a passing sexual fantasy about her; it means she's doing her job, right? What else is a woman for?

Again I don't see a woolfwhistle as the same as the whistle a man makes to call his dog. He knows the difference.

My DH agrees. He is disgusted by other men and has routinely stepped away from friendship groups.

He is a 50 year old man and in his exact words (he is beside me) "most men are scum".

It may not be in the form of murder or rape, but potentially sexual harassment, cheating, coersive control, being emotionally abusive or neglectful.

I was at a dinner party with 3 other couples last year and all the men joked that if they were women they would be lesbian because trying to find a decent guy is near impossible.

A few months later one of those wives left due to finding out the husband had been having a 7 year affair whilst working away.
I also know for a fact that one of the other wives is being financially and emotionally abused. She is on her way to leaving.

So even shitty men agree that most men are awful. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

I personally only know two decent men. I have been on this earth a while and I only know two men (including family and friends) who I with full faith could say are truly decent.

I know many, many, many more women who are beautiful people.

This isn't about hating men, it's about what I have experienced at the hands of men and what I see the women around me going through.

My husband has become very vocal about what women are facing and the rising violence. In no way is he offended by my opinions, as to him, they are simply fact.

Because if you are a decent, good person then why would you be offended? You can be confident in knowing it doesn't apply to you. You can have empathy for a group of people who have been systemically oppressed since the beginning of time.

Women are the most opressed group of people on earth. Yes it is to varying degrees, but in every culture, no matter how liberal vs misogynistic, women are at the bottom.

Again all that is very different from a lone woolfwhistle as a message of appreciation. And you must have great hearing if you heard their conversation to each other inside the van after driving past you!

Dear god, you're trying so hard you've imploded.

You've never been catcalled, have you? Probably not, as you seem to be a bloke.

They are very loud. The whole point is to call others' attention to their sexualised opinion of women they've never even spoken to.

@FeministUnderTheCatriarchy cool story, that's twice my specific question to the OP has been hijacked by others wanting to educate me.

The original question still stands for the OP

Again I don't see a woolfwhistle as the same as the whistle a man makes to call his dog. He knows the difference.

He's probably got more respect for his dog tbh.

You're on a public forum, this is how MN works. We all talk to each other and enjoy calling out BS when we see it.

The first time a grown man called me sexy, I was 12. That stranger tried to rape me. His mates stood around laughing.

Another one turned up and rescued me - he punched the man, then yelled at the others. He was the decent man: in my sample, one of seven.

You saw what I did, if only you could see the irony in your post

You’re not wrong at all OP and I’m sick to death of it. Netflix appear to have a men murdering women fetish and it’s nothing to do with our algorithms as we haven’t really watch much true crime. They keep releasing them and it’s the same formula over and over.

I dont agree women are at the bottom. They certainly are in some cultures unfortunately but that's a whole other issue. I think there are so many advantages to being a woman. I think women cope so much better than men with life in general. Women are more independent. I dont let the fact that a percentage of both men and women are arseholes affect my life and make me miserable. Yes as a woman you are physically weaker which is where a certain unfairness might come in but hey maybe one day there will be pills we can take to make as just as big and strong. Then we really will be a force to be reckoned with.

As much as I know men are physically more dangerous its actually women that I am fearful (not the right word but cant think of the right one) of the most. Men seem simpler to me, easier to read, women though can really be vicious if they want and very clever with it.

We may appear to cope better.... Because we have been raised in a patriarchal society where anything we get or achieve has been more difficult that it would be for a man doing the exact same thing.

We HAVE to just get on with it.

Everything we do, from being alone with a man in a room to walking to our car in a secluded area brings a level of self awareness that men never have to have, because they are consistently the more powerful force, unless faced with another man.

It builds resilience. We have the ability to self sooth, to manage our emotions, all because we have to. Because we would be called hormonal or hysterical if we behaved the same way as men in the workplace.

Sometimes if you have led a relatively privileged life (I don't necessarily mean financially) it can be difficult to see the layers of oppression that women in general face, in all societies.

I agree about the self awareness in dark secluded places. That will never change no matter what as there will always be murderers and rapists.

MN is not the only place I've been involved in these sort of discussions and women's opinions on these things do seem to vary quite a lot. Not whether murder etc is right of course, just the whole other views of men and women in general. Woolfwhistling is definitely a 50/50 one I've noticed.

From what you have said I am similar age to you. I don't know a single woman who has ever said they enjoy being shouted at and wolf whistled on the street. It is not something most self-respecting women feel flattered by, it's the public version of someone pinching your arse as they sidle past you on the bus. It isn't done to flatter but to shame and draw attention. You must be a fair bit older than 40 if you have any idea it might be a flattering thing for a man to do to a woman. Men who flirt with me open doors, smile, generally chat about nice things. They don't make crass remarks about my clothes or body let alone shout them in the street.

I'm 50. I've never considered wolf whistling to he flattering or a compliment.

IME, the only women who do are the ones who put an awful lot of stock in what men think of them.

I can think of 2 women I know who would find wolf whistling flattering.
One is in her 40's but her self esteem has always been tied up in being attractive to men.
The other is 69 but recently she's started to reflect on behaviour she's encountered throughout her life and realises that much of it was completely inappropriate and has says she'd be upset if her grand daughter experienced anything similar.

When your the only one on the street its hardly to shame you and draw attention to you. Honestly sometimes its just a message from them to you that they think your hot, attractive, nice figure whatever it may be. A subconscious attempt at seeing if they have a chance based on your reaction. Sometimes it's just a verbal flirt. Sometimes they are feeling good and horny and cheeky. It's not always dark and sinister.

I've had plenty negative comments about my appearance over the years from both men and women and weirdly at the same time I've had plenty nice comments about my appearance from both men and women and the compliments whatever form they take are always nicer to hear than the insults.

On holiday last year a very hunky guy was working on a building in a square and I had no reason to go there but walked over there just to take in the nice view of this hunky guy working. Yes maybe that makes me a pervert but I wouldn't say so, Im just a woman attracted to men and was appreciating his physique. And no I didnt whistle at him because I dont have the balls! for that but if I was more confident I might have.

When your the only one on the street its hardly to shame you and draw attention to you. Honestly sometimes its just a message from them to you that they think your hot, attractive, nice figure whatever it may be. A subconscious attempt at seeing if they have a chance based on your reaction. Sometimes it's just a verbal flirt. Sometimes they are feeling good and horny and cheeky. It's not always dark and sinister.

Oh dear 🙄 do you really think that? Poor men who are so horny they just have to harass women in the street.

Firstly, it's not subconscious. It's a deliberate act.
Secondly, are you actually suggesting this is a legitimate dating technique? How many people do you know who have ended up in a relationship because he wolf whistled at her while he was driving past in his van?

And I hate to break it to you, these men aren't as discerning as you think. I wouldn't be flattered, they're whistling a pair of tits and they've forgotten you as soon as you're out of sight.

Why would any woman be even mildly attracted to any man who does this though? It isn't about seeing if they have a chance at all, it's a power play pure and simple.

Judging by you apparently staring at some poor lad doing his job, yes, you do sound like a pervert. I assume you didn't shout out at him or draw attention to him so others would come and stare? Along with most women on this thread I agree that you do seem to have quite masculine attitudes.

I'm well aware that men in white vans giving woolfwhistles are not the discerning type 🤣

Of course you did 🙄
A pathetic attempt to justify men harassing women by pretending women are desperate to do it too.