Is it unreasonable to bribe my son to watch the show ' adolescence '

[atmywitsend1989]

Posted here recently but thought I would get input on a different issue.. My son is 16. He has made misogynistic comments before. I've given him tough love (yes.. I've also tried gentle parenting) and have consistently shut down his comments before. He has a teenaged sister and I really don't want her to feel disrespected.

He's been in therapy- the attitude hasn't changed. I binge-watched 'adolescence' yesterday and I'm hooked, it really opened my eyes. I want to rewatch it with him.. Tate and these influencers are ruining young men. They should show this to young boys in schools, but son hasn't been in education for a while.

Am I being unreasonable if I insist that he should watch it ? He doesn't live at home so I was thinking that I could offer him a day back if he watches this + speaks to his therapist again this week.

My only concern is that he's been diagnosed with obsessive compulsive disorder and claims to have obsessive thoughts. I don't want him to believe that he'll end up doing what the boy in the TV show has done but his comments and attitude really are unacceptable

And I’m more convinced religion is a scourge.

It’s just so sad that you and your brother attacked your son at a vulnerable moment. He has seen violence and he has experienced violence. It’s not surprising he has been violent himself. It’s all very predictable and nothing to do with Andrew Tate.

So the poor boy grew up watching his Dad hit his Mum. Then he was physically assaulted by both his Mum and his Uncle.

But Andrew Tate or a disorder/disability are to blame for him now displaying abusive behaviour himself.

And you think “bribing” him to watch a TV show with you is the answer to all this.

I want to weep for your poor son. I’ve never hoped more that this is a troll post.

Being middle class has sod all to do with anything.

And no - you’re showing again that you cannot help him. Do you really think he had all of his needs met?

Children need a safe, violence free environment. He didn’t have that, due to your ex husband.

Children need to be accepted and loved for who they are. He didn’t have that due to your adverse and violent reaction to him coming out.

Children need to be free from mental abuse. But you subjected him to conversion therapy.

This boys father abused him when he abused you. And then you went on to abuse him. As did members of your family, and your community. You’ve now disclosed three separate examples of him experiencing violent abuse - when he witnessed his fathers abuse of you, when you hit him for being bisexual, and when that uncle hit him for same.

And that’s only what you’ve told us so far.

No one has said your son has a right to abuse you. And no one wants him to be an abusive husband. But trying to pretend that he is the way he is because of conduct disorder or anything else rather than a lifetime of abuse he has experienced is self-serving and makes it more rather than less likely he will get the help he needs to avoid that future.

Frankly his best hope is to go fully no-contact with you, and hopefully at some point he will be open to the right support and it will be available. Maybe with the support of his sister (though goodness knows what she’s been through…).

But any involvement from you would appear to be actively harmful to him.

Actually I disagree with this.

This boy has experienced violent biphobia at the hands of his mother and uncle, and conversion therapy at the hands of his community.

Homophobia and biphobia are very much rooted in strict mores about what it means to be a man or to be a woman. For a gay or bi man experiencing homophobic or biphobia that’s not just about disapproval of his choice of partners - it’s a disapproval of any perceived femininity. Whether that’s expressed through behaviour, mannerisms or sexual and romantic attraction.

So it wouldn’t hugely surprise me if this boy grew up constantly being told to hate any feminine traits he perceived within himself. Not surprising if that led to a broader dysfunctional perception of women and femininity more broadly.

Of course that’s assuming OP is correct in describing his behaviour but I don’t think that’s at all guaranteed.

I don't remember him ever being girly, he was more into nerdy but not feminine hobbies (which is why I think he's at least on the spectrum..), but I've never made him ashamed of not being into football ect. And I've made it clear his comments about women are unacceptable

I understand why he may be struggling and I honestly have apologised to him but it doesn't excuse him or give him the right to participate in hate speech in terms of women or religion. My daughter has heard his comments too but it's normalised to her and he's convinced her that he's the only victim in the world 🤦‍♀️

I'm not sure why people are assuming that the faith based counselling was bad. I didn't have a lot of resources at the time and my brother recommended someone from his local madrassah. I'm not forcing it or shoving it upon him now.. I should have listened the first time he said that he didn't want to participate but since then I've supported him in talking to camhs and other non faith based services. Nothing hateful happened when he was in the faith councelling

So what did happen during the "faith-based counselling"? Did they attempt to tell your son that his sexuality was wrong? Did they threaten or shame him? Was it actually a form of conversion therapy?

Is Muslim counselling particularly supportive of LGBTQ+ teenagers then? I thought Islam saw being gay as a sin. That's why everyone thinks it was the worst possible option for him.

I'm not sure why people are assuming that the faith based counselling was bad

Because after he "confessed" you beat him, then your brother beat him and then you sent him for "faith based therapy" It seems unlikely that this was going to be positive and supportive of him, considering your reaction to his "confession".

I fully respect if others don't practice any religion but I do.

Which is all well and good but in this situation your religion appears to have resulted in you abusing your son.

I fully respect if others don't practice any religion but I do

You can’t use that as a cover for abuse though. No religion should be a cover for abuse.

By the way...

Nerdy =/= autistic.

And you've missed my point - this isn't about whether he was ever very girly. It is about growing up in a community that told him that any displays of feminine traits by men is wrong and abhorrent.

Those displays could be in behaviours. Or in who they are attracted to. The point is that the message from an early age is that it is wrong or bad for boys to have any of those traits.

No where in all this has OP recognised what her son experienced as being abusive. That's a big part of her problem. She has repeatedly referred to her son as abusing her, but has never acknowledged that she has abused her son.

Exactly.
OP you are right to have zero tolerance for violence against you by your son.
BUT you have to recognise that he witnessed (you haven't said if he experienced) abuse by his father against his mother and direct violence on him by you and his uncle. All whilst he was a child.

He has learnt that this is how you behave.

I get the distinct impression that the OP would like some sort of diagnosis for her DS, in order to absolve her from the damage his childhood has caused him.

On top of that he couldn't even turn to his religion or wider family for help and acceptance.

On another thread OP said a few times she wants a therapist that will diagnose her son with autism AND narcissism.

@atmywitsend1989your language around his sexuality is concerning… “confession” “what he chooses” - people don’t choose their sexuality and neither is it something that someone has to confess to.
Conduct disorder etc has been mentioned here… I’m inclined to disagree. A child who was verbally abused over their sexuality and exhibits subsequent challenging behaviours does not have a disorder, they’re simply reacting to the environment they’re raised in and the behaviour of their care givers.
Not only are you failing to provide him with unconditional love and support around his identity, but you’ve also been obstructive to him receiving medication for his mental health… in what ways are you actually meeting this child’s needs? Because all I’m hearing is that your behaviour is abusive…

Making your son watch Adolescence is the proverbial shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. I disagree with some others that it's not a series for teenagers - many are saying it should be on the school curriculum. And we intend watching it with our 14yo ds.

But in this specific instance, there is clearly much, much more going on here. It could be a reaction to the trauma he experienced in his younger childhood. It could be radicalisation. It could be neurodivergence. But in all of these scenarios, improvement can only be based on addressing the root cause. Watching a tv series won't do anything positive for him.

Hi everyone. I see the point of view some people have but I think I've misrepresented myself. I'm sorry if I seem like an uncaring mum. I've looked after him without my ex husband for most of his life. He had a mostly middle class cushy childhood while I didn't and I worked hard to provide that for him. I don't approve with some of his behaviour and abuse but I love him

For why I suspect asd.. He's always talked about his interests a huge amount. He doesn't like eye contact with me and family, although he's better at it with my daughter and at school when he used to attend. As of more recently he's never had a job and seems behind in progress compared to most his age. He started arguing for independence in terms of going out by himself and after his 16th birthday he had been going out by himself since those first few months. I allowed him go out to get shopping at the tescos 5 mins away and I thought I was doing the right thing by allowing that.. until he was placed in the apartment with two carers because he wasn't safe and couldn't keep himself safe. That wasn't enough for him as he started going out at night without my permission even after going on walks during the day. That night he called me to let me know that he was engaging in self harm at a park one night, before he was put unded a section 136. He first asked for an inch and then took it a mile further. He is not. Fit for adult life even though he's going to be an adult in less than two years.

I suspect narcissistic personality disorder and conduct disorder because of his physical violence. He doesn't seem to care about anyone or anything. He has been extremely, extremely self-centered at times.. yes I know that teenagers are selfish, I have a teen daughter too but he takes it to the next level. I've broken down and cried to him twice in the past and said that I just cannot deal with his abusive language and behaviour and there was absolutely 0 change and very little reaction from him.

Sad really how little introspection the OP shows. I'd probably also avoid eye contact with people who have beaten and attacked me for my sexuality and have made it clear that they think that I am an abomination.

You are a terrible parent OP. It needs to be said and it's that plain and simple.

I'm so sad for your son that you've completely let down over the years and abused physically, verbally and emotionally. I hope he is able to escape you and your community, get support from his carers to build his confidence, make the best decision for him related to the medication that may be helpful for his recovery and get away from YOU completely. His sister seems to be the only person in your family open to supporting him and I hope they can rebuild their relationship.

You have zero self awareness, you can't seem to see that your behaviour has been the catalyst and I'm left wondering if its you that's the narcissist.

You just get worse @atmywitsend1989. You don't love him at all. Crying to a child is abuse. Not surprised he was self harming - look what you did to him. He's better off having nothing to do with you. Feel sorry for your daughter too.

Which disorder would you diagnose yourself with, due to your violence and abuse of your son? You might want to think about that.

I don’t think you’ve taken on board anything that has been discussed on this thread. Your son has been badly failed by all the adults in his family and community, you above all. He has lashed out, unsurprisingly, in the very ways you all have taught him. He has also self harmed, a cry for help if ever there was one. It makes me want to weep to think of this poor boy. I’m glad his sister supports him, that relationship may be what will save him.

I didn't show my anger when he called me that night, I only showed my concern. Because I felt a mix of emotions. He has self harmed in the past and I've just wanted to get him help.

It's night and I'm tired so I'm going to log out but I do want him to get help