NHS England to go is Keir being unreasonable?

[43percentburnt]

I don’t work for the NHS but have friends who do (and are increasingly looking at leaving - in some cases to move abroad).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cx29lrl826rt

Is the removal of NHS England a good thing? Or is this a Labour gimmick?

To include an Aibu for Keir -

Yes Keir - you are being unreasonable

Or

Good job Keir, please get rid of NHS England - you are NOT being unreasonable

He thinks he's emulating Trump and this is his DOGE moment. Sad that UK politicians always look west for their inspiration but never east.

This is going to be an almighty mess isn't it because t&cs and pay in particular are so different

Brava @IhateSPSS, and thank you

Surely all the jobs going to DHSC will be TUPE which means T+c remain the same for two years?

ETA It would be more accurate to say that NHSE as a organisation doesn’t deliver front line patient care than its staff doesn’t.

What about those of us who work in the North of England (Leeds) & can't work in Whitehall then? Plus what would happen to our NHS pensions? I bloody retrained because I wanted to work in health. Just speaking to DH (works in bowel cancer) & in the HSJ they said it looks like they are removing the strategic level so that providers and DHSC are in direct contact. Good luck to them...they will need it.

Yes sorry I wasn't clear, should have said we wouldn't stay on AfC.

This.

Two sets if staff doing the same thing is a total waste of money that would be better spent on treating people who are ill.

Kier cannot win. Try to cut waste to improve the NHS and people still moan.

Should cut more unnecessary doubled up costs. On balance he's doing a good thing with this.

What is the DHSS, is it the same as I remember in the 1980s or is it something different? Please excuse my ignorance.

Department of Health and Social Services.

Well said 👏 I work for an ICB too in a similar role, with similar experience. 24 years of front line experience in the nhs as a clinician before this.

The issue is that many people don’t know what NHSE do. They mainly work with ICBs ;that replaced CCGs) to ensure work programmes carried out in each region equitably, provide sharing of good progress and liaising with national medical bodies. They also undertake specialised commissioning for rare conditions where you need numbers of patients to see the big picture. NHSE doesn’t get directly involved in patient care and did delegate a lot of its responsibilities for example primary care to local ICBs.

i don’t work for NHSE at the moment but did until recently. The people who work there aren’t workshy people who aren’t working their best; on the contrary they’re very busy and trying to support the regions. Their work is ‘invisible’ as it’s all behind the scenes but it does hold a lot of things together… it’s a tough gig for the government to blame healthcare workers- managers for the problems with the nhs. It’s yet more smoke and mirrors, as mainly the issues relate to huge wastage from national politics and constant political change. I don’t understand why Keir thinks that mixing the NHSE functions with DHSC will make it ‘less politicised’ as DHSC is even more under the control of politicians. NHSE was supposed to reduce the issues with short term Ian in nhs policies and we now risk a rerun of that…

Absolutely nothing wrong with it "conceptually" but he's acting a bit like Trump/Musk in his approach to implementing it..... which is most definitely the wrong approach to such a wide-ranging and impactful change to a fundamental aspect of our social rights.....

When I first worked in the NHS in the 1980s,I remember working with a retiring ceo who was looking forward to “no more endless reorganisations”. I felt the same myself eventually. So many people like to complain about NHS management, but so few understand it, and plenty are in any case politically motivated. That often includes government, who find it convenient to blame those they charge with carrying out their policies.

I suspect this move came exactly when and how it did, out of the blue, because of a recent requirement for funds in the light of the changing political situation. As in the past, many of the roles will be recreated in a new guise eventually.

My role involves digitising manual processes. There’s so much waste, even within NHSE, it blows my mind.

people don’t see it as it’s something they’ve done day in, day out, for years.

paperless 2020 anyone?

So NHS England is being removed so that the control passes to the Department of Health. What what is the betting that a big chunk of the staff move over, as the same work will still need doing. There has to be some coordination and oversight.

In what way is this like Trump? It’s reversing a change that should never have been made in the first place.

You don’t understand patently the difference between NHS England a civil servant wuango and NHS Trusts. Why did you post if you haven’t read the articles correctly?

This 🤣

Labour are honestly the party of quangos so it's hideously ironic

The issue is that many people don’t know what NHSE do

Well, i found out something they don't do... give English men a life extending prostate cancer drug.

Keir? 🤣🤣🤣🤣

.... and got rid of plenty too.... quango's can do good, they aren't all bad.

I agree! They do have some amazing qualities and ideas when they are listened to. Properly. But that? That listening? Depends on the govt in power.

H9nestly, in my view you replace one with another. Except you lose the actual voice in between

Very few seem to be bi-partisan.....

Just no need for this.

The language being adopted to describe this change and civil service generally is exactly like the language adopted by trump and musk. Its really hard to see how telling public sector workers they are lazy and inadequate will improve productivity.

I really just think it's starmer trying to do things which will go down well with daily mail readers given his terrible approval ratings along with a need to cut budgets to meet Rachel reeves stupid self imposed fiscal rules.

People really are misguided if they think these changes will improve care. Sure there is some duplication between dhsc and nhse but not 50%, cutting icb budgets in half will mean stopping essential services and social care also seems likely to have finding cut further.

There has been zero indication there is a plan so far beyond some vague nonsense