To think punctuality is a sign of basic respect?

[CoralCrab]

I’ve always believed that being on time is one of the simplest ways to show respect for other people. If I make plans, I do everything I can to be there when I said I would - so I find it really frustrating when others don’t do the same.

I get that things happen - traffic, delays, life - but when someone is consistently late, it feels like they just don’t care. Like their time is more valuable than mine.

I’ve had friends show up 30+ minutes late to dinner without even apologising, colleagues who breeze into meetings 10 minutes after they start, and even dates who seem to think ‘fashionably late’ is a personality trait.

AIBu to think that punctuality isn’t just about being on time but about basic consideration for others? Or am I just being too uptight about it?

It's interesting, time blindness, according to google, means you have to plan a little bit harder. So recognise you have it and fix it, simple.
When you are consistently late this is tardiness. Also you are disorganised, have poor social skills or trying to make a power play. You are also dilatory and maybe sluggish.
I can't find any good things that are said though about it, so if you want to become less abhorrent to others then pull your socks up a bit.

I can think of two occasions when people assumed that they were so important that the world would respectfully wait for their grand entrance.....
I was singing for two weddings at a church which was a very popular venue. It was made clear at the time of booking that they had each been allocated a specific time spot, with a decent interval between the two for one congregation to leave before the second arrived.
The first bride was so late, that timeslot came and went. Early guests for the second ceremony were beginning to arrive,
At that time, there was a time limit at the end of the day, after which marriages were not legal (I believe this rather outdated rule has since been abolished; it dated back to a time when churches would be poorly lit when daylight faded, enabling impersonation and the like).
So the vicar had a decision to make, for the sake of the second couple, and he made it. Wedding one's guests, was moved over to the church hall to wait, while wedding two started only slightly late.
When this was over, the first group were allowed back in, and a furious bride stomped up the aisle with a face like thunder. She clearly thought that her arrival was the only event of the day, and was most put out to discover that things had moved on without her!
The second one was one of my Parents' Evenings. The letters had gone out offering timeslots, starting at 4:00, with a mid-evening break for me to gather my wits. A few parents came in at other times by mutual agreement, and amazingly, everybody else went for the first half of the evening.
Things were running beautifully until the 5:40 slot - no show, so I moved on to the next set of parents. 7:00 came; time for my break. There had been no message to warn that the 5:40 couple were delayed in some way, I was officially there until 9:00, but was there any point? I consulted the headteacher, who agreed that as it was by now more that 90 minutes since their timeslot, I could go home with a clear conscience. Apparently they were dumbfounded when they deigned to appear, about 30 minutes later.

Time blindness and actual blindness don’t even compare and I say that as someone who has had ‘time blindness’ but I’m now not late for anything, I may rush but I’m never late because I can see a clock and tell the time

Ypu still need to be there before 7.30 though. You need to be in the theatre, ticket checked, coat off, settled in your seat for 7.30.
7.15 is actually a bit late for comfort. If you don’t preorder interval drinks you spend the whole interval queuing for a drink instead of enjoying it.

Edit: just seen you don’t want to be hanging around ‘waiting for the thing to start’. Can’t you just chill with a drink the way you expect friends to when you are late to meet them?

No, you don’t genuinely believe that you can do a 30 min journey in 10 or you wouldn’t have said it as an example of what makes you late. You just don’t care that you can’t do it in 10.

Some theatres you definitely do. Lots of stairs, pinch points for moving or ticket checking. Anyway, wouldn’t it be better to just chill for a bit? Why so uptight about waiting in a nice bar with a friend before taking your seat?

Quite. You take your seat by 7.20 read the programme etc. 7.30 is the start of the production.

So is everyone else. That’s why they don’t want to chill while waiting for you to be late. Does your time blindness ever make you early?

Yes, it just seems to work one way, doesn't it?

Yes, funny that.

If you are such a precision time keeping machine, what makes you late for things?

It does tickle me that people are trying to portray persistent lateness as some sort of inalienable fact about somebody that can't possibly ever change and is unreasonable to expect to change lol.

If you told these people if they made it to this building at 10am every day for a week they would receive a million pounds or a brand new house, you'd be damned sure they'd be there.

People make an effort for things they value, and if someone is consistently late, they don't value you or your time.

I know plenty of neurodivergent friends who struggle with executive function, time management, organisational skills. They care about not making their friends feel disrespected and like utter sh!t, and about not inadvertently causing their friends a great deal of anxiety and stress hanging around waiting not knowing if or when someone will arrive.

One of my best friends struggles with this immensely due to being autistic and living with ADHD. They do all sorts to ensure they're ready when I come and pick them up. Setting multiple alarms with different labels for different tasks. Post-it notes on things. Getting dressed an hour before instead of 5m before because they know they will get distracted halfway through and start trying different necklaces on and before they know it it's time to go and they haven't even packed their bag or got their shoes on. Putting everything they need by the door the day before (keys, handbag, shoes, etc.) so they can just pick it up and go.

Because they're not a terrible person that thinks their time is worth more than everyone else's time.

I hate lateness and the excuse of time blindness. If you know you struggle with getting places on time, start using methods to help you manage your time. The very same people that use time blindness are the people that have a hissy fit if they are left waiting for someone or if their Doctor is running 5 minutes late, they are bloody well aware of time then. Lateness is rudeness no matter how you paint it.

If I got to the theatre at 7:15 I'd be quite happy to sit in the bar for a quick drink, but I don't think the others on this thread would be happy to. They're off to the auditorium to sit in the dark for ten minutes.

I reckon I'd enter the auditorium at about 7.28. Get in, sit down, curtain up. Easy.

How precise. You must manage your time very well. Very efficiently.

No, the lights only go down when the curtain goes up.

I had a friend who was always late when we met. Often 20 minutes but it was every time. One time she came in 15 minutes late and explained it was because she was five minutes early and didn't want to just sit and wait so she popped to the shop. I was annoyed so I said "but it was okay for me to sit here waiting for you?" and probably other things.

If I was ever later than her, which only happened on two occasions and one of them she'd just got the wrong day, she'd immediately call me to tell me she's there as if why should she wait for me.

We're not friends any more, not because of that but similar things.

I know lots of theatres where you would definitely be struggling to just get in and to your seat in 10 mins. 5 mins before curtain up is sensible to be in the auditorium (final bell is at 3 mins). Just FYI, since you are always arriving too late, the lights don't go down until the show/play is starting. You’ve given away that either you never go to the theatre or you always arrive after the show has started and irritate the fuck out of everyone else just so you don’t have to sit for 2 mins and wait. And yet you think people should be happy to wait for you in a coffee shop when you can’t get there in time. Proves the arrogance/think your time is more important point really, doesn’t it?

Given that it was me you initially replied to, I can say I probably would take my seat about 7.20, with a drink, programme and settle in to enjoy it. You're being ridiculous with your "sitting in the dark" and cutting it that fine does mean that if you get caught behind someone moving slowly or trying to get into their own row and waiting for people to gather up and stand you're then going to be late to your seat. I just don't get why that's preferable.

There is a lot of ADHD in my family, but we still all think it’s rude to be late. I think if you genuinely care about not being late, you can generally manage not to be, it just can take some work, and some planning. It’s sometimes a lot of effort, but it matters to me a lot too.

My Dc know what time they have to leave the house for school, and they stick rigidly to that. We have a clock in every room, and the other family members will all shout for a missing person if they haven’t appeared downstairs. At home we all look out for each other. We have an emergency box of snacks for if you mistimed and missed out on eating before you had to leave.

Reading about the time blindness thing, my mind is genuinely blown that some people can tell inside their heads how much time has passed. I don’t have a clue - but I do have a clock!
I know that I can easily start doing a task and get totally distracted by it - so if I need to be somewhere at a specific time, I just won’t start that sort of task. Or if I absolutely have to do it, I’ll set an alarm to remind me ten minutes before.
I have the radio on in the morning, so I get a time check every ten minutes or so.

These days I can use google maps to work out how long it will take me to get somewhere, and from that I can work out when I need to leave. I add ten minutes for contingencies. If I’m too early, I’ll wait in the car (or at the station, or bus stop or wherever). I’m seldom late for something I’ve planned beforehand - if I’ve not planned I can be an hour late easily.

I don’t know instinctively how long things will take - but I have a good memory, so if I take the trouble to time something, then I can remember it for next time. If I didn’t have a good memory, I suppose I could write it down.
Then working out when you need to start getting ready, get up, set off etc it’s just a question of maths.

Someone upthread said they "know it's a thirty minutes journey but believe I can do it in ten". What I don't understand is if you are consciously able to write that sentence then you DO know it takes thirty mins so if you fail to leave thirty / thirty five mins for it that is absolutely a conscious decision.

I agree. So many things can affect punctuality, and if you are meeting for lunch, does it really matter if the person you are meeting is late? If you have allocated an hour for lunch and have something you’re doing after, then you leave when you need to. If you’ve nothing planned for after lunch, then enjoy a quiet cup of coffee. If your friend is always late, make sure you bring a book or whatever. If you are in a meeting and people are late, start without them. If they are the only ones you are meeting and you’ve something else to do, cancel the meeting until you have the time to do it again. IME people who are late to meetings are rarely just turning up late for the hell of it, it’s usually because another meeting or deadline ran over.

The opposite of late people thinking their time is more important, is the ontimers thinking their time is more important. Worse, it’s the early arrivers complaining they’ve been there for ages. I won’t live my life as a slave to the clock. I genuinely don’t have the time to spare, to leave half an hour early “just in case” Sure there are times when it is vital I am there on time, but if I’m meeting someone for lunch, I’ll give a timescale, I’ll be there between x&y or around half past etc. If that bothers you, I’m equally happy not to meet you and have lunch by myself. Ontimers love to think they are virtuous but actually I find it controlling if someone is so fastidious about punctuality that they expect others to dance to their tune.

To suggest that people with ADHD apologise for something they just can’t help is abelist.

Nobody is expecting others to ‘dance to their tune’ @BoredZelda
More to the tune of time.
You say you don’t have enough time to arrive a bit early yet expect people to hang around waiting for you. Incidentally the person you are replying to there has made it quite clear she consistently and precisely arrives at the theatre at 7.28 so she doesn’t have to wait around for it to start, so I think she’s a pretty firm ‘ontimer’ herself, except when she can’t be bothered.

I’m not as bothered by lateness as a lot of posters on MN. Obviously the extreme examples would be irritating. But I’m not that bothered about friends being 10 or 15 minutes late or whatever for meeting up. There are so many nasty, two-faced, jealous etc etc people about that if I find a friend who genuinely lovely but sometimes late then I’m not bothered.