To suspect the "deal" between the US and Russia Greenland for Ukraine?

[FancyRedRobin]

The way things are shaping up I'm beginning to think the USAs negotiations with Putin were for USA to stand aside and let Putin have part of Ukraine and for Russia to support the US to take Greenland.

not all of the leaders would be perfect angels, so at a guess then its having the strategy to achieve it all etc

It’s like debating with a 5yo

Those countries would have to agree to the base, infrastructure and companies. You can’t just rock up and start building an army base in another sovereign country.

yes it is, but at least im taking part which is a lot better than the majority of the public

The idea of the United States successfully organizing a political coup against Canada to gain it as part of the U.S. is highly improbable for several reasons. Here's why:

1. Canada's Sovereignty and Democratic Institutions: Canada is a sovereign nation with a well-established democratic system, similar to the U.S. It has its own government, military, and political processes. Any attempt at a coup would be met with significant resistance from within Canada, including its citizens, political leadership, and military.
2. International Law and Relations: The United States and Canada share a long-standing, peaceful, and cooperative relationship. Both countries are committed to upholding international law, which strongly discourages actions like military coups or invasions. Any attempt by the U.S. to destabilize Canada politically would draw strong condemnation from the international community, especially from allies like the European Union and NATO.

Canadian Military and Security: Canada is not defenseless. It has a professional military and security services capable of defending its sovereignty. While the U.S. military is much larger, any attempt at a coup would likely lead to military confrontation, which could have disastrous consequences for both countries, especially considering the proximity of their economies and the interdependence they share. Public and Political Opposition: The people of Canada and the political establishment are overwhelmingly opposed to any notion of being absorbed into the U.S. Canadians take great pride in their national identity and autonomy. A coup would not only be met with resistance from Canadian institutions, but it would also spark widespread protests and civil disobedience. Global Consequences: The United States has historically maintained a policy of non-intervention in the internal affairs of other democratic nations. Engaging in a coup in Canada would significantly damage U.S. relations with other countries, including potential allies. It would also harm the economic and diplomatic ties that the U.S. shares with Canada. In summary, while the U.S. and Canada have a close relationship, the notion of the U.S. organizing a political coup to annex Canada is unrealistic. The political, military, and international barriers to such a move would make it unfeasible. Additionally, the strong national identity of Canada and its democratic institutions would provide significant resistance to any such attempts.

Even ChatGPT thinks you’re talking bollocks!

true

then instead of a coup, its the blackmail method then the leaders stay in power but concede to america

The scenario you're proposing—where the United States would blackmail a Canadian politician in order to take over Canada—is highly unlikely for a variety of reasons, both practical and legal.

1. Sovereign nations: The United States and Canada are sovereign nations with their own governments, laws, and constitutions. The idea of one country taking over another, especially a close ally like Canada, would be a massive international violation and would likely result in severe global backlash. Modern international relations, particularly among democratic nations like the U.S. and Canada, are shaped by diplomacy, alliances (like NATO), and respect for national sovereignty.
2. Legal and political frameworks: Canada has strong legal and political frameworks that protect its sovereignty. The idea of blackmailing a politician to undermine the country’s independence would be both illegal and highly unethical. Canada’s political system, based on democratic values and rule of law, would prevent such actions from having any significant impact.
3. Public and political resistance: Both the Canadian public and political establishment would likely resist any attempt by a foreign power to interfere in Canadian politics. Canada’s political institutions, including its parliament, media, and courts, would be very vocal in defending national sovereignty, and such a blackmail attempt would likely spark public outrage.
4. Diplomatic repercussions: Any overt action by the U.S. government to try to take over or even undermine Canada would result in a catastrophic diplomatic fallout, not just with Canada, but with other global powers as well. The U.S. would risk losing its standing on the international stage, particularly with close allies and global organizations like the United Nations.
5. Economic and military considerations: Even though the U.S. and Canada have strong economic and military ties, the consequences of such a move would be immense. Both countries are economically interdependent, and Canada is a key ally in global security. Any move to destabilize Canada would destabilize the region, potentially causing long-term harm to both nations.

While political manipulation, espionage, and other covert tactics do exist in international relations, the idea of a foreign country blackmailing a politician to take control of another sovereign state is highly implausible in the modern world, particularly between two stable and democratic nations like the U.S. and Canada.

the idea of using blackmail or coercion to influence leaders aligns with historical tactics employed by intelligence services globally. While outright coups have been more overt, intelligence agencies have often relied on subtler methods like blackmail, economic pressure, or psychological operations to achieve their goals without direct regime change. Here are some examples of how intelligence services have used such methods:

1. Economic Leverage: Intelligence agencies have historically gathered sensitive financial or economic data to pressure leaders into compliance. For instance, during the Cold War, the U.S. and its allies used economic sanctions and covert financial operations to influence governments in Eastern Europe and Latin America.
2. Compromising Material (Kompromat): The use of compromising information to blackmail individuals has been a hallmark of intelligence operations. The KGB, for example, was notorious for gathering personal or political dirt on foreign leaders to manipulate their decisions.
3. Diplomatic Pressure: Intelligence services often provide governments with information that can be used to apply diplomatic pressure. For example, leaked intelligence about corruption or human rights abuses has been used to force concessions from foreign leaders.
4. Psychological Operations: Covert campaigns to spread disinformation or manipulate public opinion can weaken a leader's position, forcing them to align with the influencing power's interests. This was a common tactic during the Cold War, employed by both the CIA and the KGB.

While Canada, with its strong democratic institutions and public accountability, would be a challenging target for such tactics, the concept of using intelligence services to subtly influence leaders is rooted in historical precedent.

I think even Trump is intelligent enough to know they can’t invade, take over, starve Canadians out or blackmail a politician in order to get Canada. And that’s not saying much!

to me the card to play is the intel services one

Canada is a member of NATO and Greenland is defended by Denmark, also part of NATO.

The last thing Putin wants is war with NATO. Trump may think he’s up for it (despite the DoD cuts) although I very much doubt it. If push comes to shove, the military and command have an obligation to disobey illegal orders. Acts of war against NATO countries fall into this category.

CIA is not going to destabilise Canada or Greenland.

I still think this is a distraction from tax cuts for the rich.

Who himself?

Well it seems AI can’t even agree. But my AI is better than yours so there. 😁

and I know my AI synopsis ties in with current political thinking more.

Trump will be dead from his age, obesity and general cholesterol levels long before Canada falls. The world just needs to ride out the next 4 years.

I think the CIA are more likely to organise a secret political coup against Trump and have him assassinated than do anything to take over Canada. Remember the majority of federal employees think he’s a fuckwit,

We’re talking about Canadian leaders - big on morals and principles rather than Americans If any Canadian leader was over sovereignty , he would be out of power immediately.

Rainingalldayonmyhead · Today 16:12

Exactly!

I have to say that for a supposedly university educated person, our amorous Leporidan hasn't done well on spelling, or punctuation, capitalisation, let alone sentence structure.

... Edited as posts appeared as I was writing.

He’s done really well at staying awake and posting for 24 hours solid though. You can’t knock his stamina.

Russian pretending to be from both the US and Britain, definitely using AI and translation app. The frequency makes me think there are a few of them working on these replies. It might not be an official thing, maybe just some bored university students with nothing else to do but infiltrate Mumsnet.

nah mines better lol, usually its the way its worded when requesting the analysis at times that can alter the outputs

And I need to think about what to make for lunch - temperature has dropped again - more snow forecast tomorrow ❄️

i apricate your views but if bored id be researching. i love here for the debates, even if my views are spooky

hot sausage rolls

We cannot be any clearer. Canada is a sovereign country. Sonia the US. States can’t just decide to leave because they feel like it. Not can the US just take over Canada because they feel like it.

All of this is the rantings of a lunatic without any legal basis.

Canadians are united, strong and resolute. We don’t want anything to do with joining any part of the US.

Indeed, forewarned and predictable...
If Trump persists in this destructive rhetoric, that would be the strongest proof that he is a traitor to the United States. And his cronies alongside him.