Wtf is wrong with people when it comes to hidden disabilities?

[Whatthebarnacles]

Full on rant incoming! Ready to be flamed in the depths on MN hell for this but it really is a hill I'm happy to die on so whatever will be, will be!

I'm absolutely sick to the back teeth of certain people on here who eye roll and sneer that those with hidden disabilities should be treated the same as neuro typical people.

Non verbal, lashing out? Report to police for assault - how dare they lay a hand on someone else 🙄

Can't sit still / constantly stims? Expel them from school - why should my "normal child" be affected?🙄

Stares and makes noises? Tell them you're uncomfortable and to stop immediately, we have the right not to be ogled.🙄

Can we please just stop it?! It's like the world's gone mad! All the years of effort to try and make people aware of hidden disabilities just seems to have crumbled an i've seen it happenn in here over the last 6 months or so more than ever. There seems to be an almighty wave of this incredibly farcical "BUT ME AND MINE" or "MY RIGHTS" just smash through the work that had been done and its depressing as shit.

Would you call the police or kick off on someone who spilled a cuppa over you then laughed? Or caught your face , if...

1. They were 4 years old? Nope, so why would you for someone with intellectual disabilities? You would talk to the carer. Rightly so.

1. If they had Parkinsons? Would you bollocks. Because you can SEE that disability and because its a physical one, then it can't be helped, right?

1. They were clearly ND?

There are countless people in here who would because, according to them, they do not have the right / there needs to be consequences / they're an adult regardless / i am woman hear me roar etc.

I cant get my head around the lack of understanding

And don't get me started on those who turn these things into "us women" need to defend ourselves. And faux outrage "would they have done it to a man? I don't think so!" Urgh. Yes... they would. A disability is a disability, a stim is a stim, a jolt is a jolt. Hair is dangly, splashing someone or spilling something is funny, stimming is calming on the inside whilst frantic in the outside.

Frankly, it turns my stomach. Why is the world so angry at people who are different at the moment?!

I can only presume that the number of people now having been diagnosed is pissing these people off. I've honestly never ever heard so much "just because they're xyz doesn't mean that..." in my life. See also "they need to learn" or "they should know"...

I fret for my son growing up in this. He doesn't stand a cat in hells chance.

YABU - Of course ND people, should be treated the same as NT people when it comes to differing behaviour, regardless of mental age or physical disabilities associated with their condition.

YANBU - MN is rife with it at the moment, I've noticed that too.

Annnnnd..... crucify me. GO!!

@Resttime You literally just made up a hypothetical example in which I, a neurodiverse child (who also happened to be severely physically disabled, though I grant you I didn't mention it in the comment you were replying to) decided to punch someone bullying me. Something I literally never, ever would have done in a million years. Just because you wanted to prove a point about how victimised little girls should never be allowed to defend themselves...

I gave an example of something that happens regularly in schools. NT child spends lots of time taunting a disabled child who doesn't know how to handle the situation and becomes unregulated. NT child goes home and tells Mum the ND children is horrible and violent. Mum encourages thier child to return violence because 'little timmy would never be mean to a disabled child, the disabled child needs to be taught a lesson'.

I'm not saying DC shouldn't use self defence when necessary. But escaping a situation should be what we encouage and revenge isn't acceptable.

@Resttime Do you honestly not see how you are contributing to stigmatising ND children?

Can you expand on that?

I’m ND. No doubt we have to move through a world that doesn’t offer us a great deal of support or sympathy. My needs for flexible working, personal space and to avoid overstimulation are frequently dismissed as preciousness. I am relatively independent; I shudder to think how much harder it must be for those who are not.

But if someone spills a (potentially hot?) cup of tea/coffee over me, or hits me, and laughs, there is a very real chance I would report that to the police. The fact that I am more independent and able to care for myself than others does not mean I’m required to tolerate that. Yes, I have a right to not be the victim of violence, and yes that right is every bit as important as the right of those of us with hidden disabilities of every kind to move through the world too.

What has become very insidious is the way in which a woman can start a MN thread about being made uncomfortable, being hurt or threatened by a man and someone will inevitably come along and pipe up that ‘oh, maybe he’s ND’, thus directing the focus of the conversation away from the woman’s real and immediate upset and towards the potential feelings of a potentially ND man. As a ND person myself I find it patronising and offensive on a number of levels.

We are all sharing this big rock with each other, and my own experience is that selfishness across the board is making that very hard to do.

The situation for those who are a danger to the public must change though.
If that means two people are required in order to be out and about then so be it. If a person has a tendency towards assault or aggression towards others then they shouldn’t go out unless the carers can prevent that from happening.
That doesn’t mean people have to be stuck inside, there’s lots of places to drive or go to with very few people. Its simply not acceptable to take people to places when as a career you know they might harm someone.

Lets not forget the lady knocked off her bike into moving traffic and killed. Had the attacker been properly supervised when out situations like that are far less likely to happen. It’s all very good excusing people because they don’t know what they are doing but that doesn’t help the victim…..

The alternative of course is more specialist schools and homes.

Shall we just reiterate that no one has said anyone should condone violence. No one has said it’s a good thing. No one has said disabled people adult or child should be allowed to hit anyone. Nobody has said we should just let people pull our hair, or assault us or our children. Some people have tried to explain capacity and possible avenues to explore, or what they would do in given situations. People have tried to focus on how violence should be treated rather than how a specific group of disabled people should be treated.

Where does the second carer come from?

I’m not saying any of this is okay btw…but where does that other carer come from?
Because that level of help isn’t there ime.

It is a society discussion - do we want to pay to ensure that these people can live near normal lives with more carers, or do we want to incarcerate potentially violent people at all times? Or is the third option - putting other people at risk - the most palatable?

The third option is most definitely not the most palatable when it comes to putting children at risk.

Well, if we’re incarcerating people who could potentially do harm I think people who break the speed limit, or who drink too much or do drugs come top of that list 🤔

Driving whilst on the phone?

Incarcerating children also puts them at risk.

Incarcerated children face a high risk of sexual abuse and rape.

Indeed!

The point is. If a person can’t be handled by one carer then alternatives need to be sought to protect others and potentially themselves

If children or adults require two carers in order to be safe in public then they will already be living in secure accommodation. The only difference is are they able to leave with carers and if the place they are living has facilities for them to live reasonably, eg get outside, within their security arrangements? It is likely that windows, outside doors, kitchen door, other people’s bedroom doors etc will all be locked. They may well sleep in secure beds.

This is vile thread full of people happily passing judgement about things they have little or no understanding of. A proportion of you are likely to become disabled at some point in your life or love someone who does. Let’s hope that more compassion and understanding is extended to them than has been displayed here.

This isn’t true.

Most caring is done by family carers.

As an example, some ND kids/teens/adults can be fine lots of the time, but melt down or lash out or flee if distressed. Like anyone really, except they can become overwhelmed far more easily. They may require two carers in those moments, not at other times.

They include people with no intellectual impairment. The idea that they’re all in ‘secure accommodation’ is ridiculous.

Yes I started to say the same but suddenly just gave up. Thank you for explaining to those that don’t know.

You really think they don’t lock their front door if they need two carers in order to be outside safely or if they might flee if distressed? Of if they are lash out that they will have access to the kitchen knives or their siblings rooms? Or are you talking about those with capacity in which case if they violently assault someone they absolutely should be arrested and imprisoned.

Don’t tell me most parents of young children don’t use window locks, stair gates and child locks!

A lot of people who disagree with you are themselves disabled. It's not as simple as "everyone who dissents from me is just vile and ignorant". There are genuinely many perspectives on these issues. It doesn't help to lash out at those who disagree.

Unless they actually have any meaningful experience of the sort of disabilities being discussed, then with the greatest respect “being disabled” is fairly irrelevant. I haven’t “lashed out” at anyone. Have you found the thread uplifting or insightful? Can you imagine what it is like to read if you are living with the kinds of challenges described?

Theres a frightening shift towards sexism, racism and ableism in the world at present. It’s up to each of us to be part of making the world we want to live in.

Using stair gates and locking a front door etc is quite different in tone from your previous comment though.