Wtf is wrong with people when it comes to hidden disabilities?

[Whatthebarnacles]

Full on rant incoming! Ready to be flamed in the depths on MN hell for this but it really is a hill I'm happy to die on so whatever will be, will be!

I'm absolutely sick to the back teeth of certain people on here who eye roll and sneer that those with hidden disabilities should be treated the same as neuro typical people.

Non verbal, lashing out? Report to police for assault - how dare they lay a hand on someone else 🙄

Can't sit still / constantly stims? Expel them from school - why should my "normal child" be affected?🙄

Stares and makes noises? Tell them you're uncomfortable and to stop immediately, we have the right not to be ogled.🙄

Can we please just stop it?! It's like the world's gone mad! All the years of effort to try and make people aware of hidden disabilities just seems to have crumbled an i've seen it happenn in here over the last 6 months or so more than ever. There seems to be an almighty wave of this incredibly farcical "BUT ME AND MINE" or "MY RIGHTS" just smash through the work that had been done and its depressing as shit.

Would you call the police or kick off on someone who spilled a cuppa over you then laughed? Or caught your face , if...

1. They were 4 years old? Nope, so why would you for someone with intellectual disabilities? You would talk to the carer. Rightly so.

1. If they had Parkinsons? Would you bollocks. Because you can SEE that disability and because its a physical one, then it can't be helped, right?

1. They were clearly ND?

There are countless people in here who would because, according to them, they do not have the right / there needs to be consequences / they're an adult regardless / i am woman hear me roar etc.

I cant get my head around the lack of understanding

And don't get me started on those who turn these things into "us women" need to defend ourselves. And faux outrage "would they have done it to a man? I don't think so!" Urgh. Yes... they would. A disability is a disability, a stim is a stim, a jolt is a jolt. Hair is dangly, splashing someone or spilling something is funny, stimming is calming on the inside whilst frantic in the outside.

Frankly, it turns my stomach. Why is the world so angry at people who are different at the moment?!

I can only presume that the number of people now having been diagnosed is pissing these people off. I've honestly never ever heard so much "just because they're xyz doesn't mean that..." in my life. See also "they need to learn" or "they should know"...

I fret for my son growing up in this. He doesn't stand a cat in hells chance.

YABU - Of course ND people, should be treated the same as NT people when it comes to differing behaviour, regardless of mental age or physical disabilities associated with their condition.

YANBU - MN is rife with it at the moment, I've noticed that too.

Annnnnd..... crucify me. GO!!

Oh give over, being a ND child doesn’t give you the authority on the subject. What a ridiculous point to make.

@Ma1lle It's a fair riposte to your hyperbolic attempt to imply that I must hate ND children and (for some unspecific reason) want to remove them from classrooms.

The reason you are making these absurd claims is because you can't actually counteract my reasonable argument that children should not be hurt at school. My view is that children shouldn't face violence in the classroom, and yes, that holds for both ND and NT children. Your argument appears to be that if a ND child is the perpetrator, it's okay. I don't accept that.

Don’t say it was ok, inadequate Sen provision is not ok. Children with Sen are still entitled to an education the same as any other child.

It is only a moot point if you want to be defeatist about it.

Not defeatist but if you want something done. Lobby for more Sen provision and funding.

Personally I think as many children as possible should be visible, within our communities and educated within mainstream schools. I honestly think this what is supposed to be happening and what leads to the best outcomes. There are of course rules about impacting others education but it doesn’t sound like they are being followed.

There aren’t rules. School staff are doing a superb job on next to no funding.

Starting a thread like this is only going to attract the vultures. The best thing you can do OP is to ask for MN to move threads to the SN boards. Most of the posters posting cruel comments wouldn't dare do that on the SN boards and the OP would actually get some decent advice. The vulturey people egg each other on. I've asked MNHQ to do that but they like the ableist comments quite clearly.

I know the thread you were talking about and it was clear the person was unable to understand their actions and the carer wasn't managing it, but then load of feminists piled on making it about them. It's not right to be hurt by someone, but some of the suggestions clearly showed people have very limited knowledge of disabilities or completely minimalised them. Another thread recently called a junior school kid with SEN a sex offender and was cruel about the kid and its parents when it was the school and LA messing up. I don't think it's acceptable to assault someone, but these people never blame the carers or government, they blame a disability which is hard to change.

It does make me laugh when people go 'if a guy with intellectual disabilities was jumping up and down shouting and pulling my hair I'd tear him a new one'. Yeah right,I'm sure you would batter someone who is clearly intellectually disabled in the middle of a cafe. Bullshit would you.

Ultimately MNHQ are terrible at managing these threads. If people were discussing homosexuality or ethnicity such a way the thread would get taken down, but it seems fine to talk about people with disabilities in this way and perpetuate negative stereotypes, especially children.

That’s incorrect. From the IPSEA website

If your child or young person has an EHC plan and you want them to attend a mainstream setting, your LA can only refuse if both of these two conditions are met:

1. a mainstream placement would be incompatible with the efficient education of others, and
2. there are no reasonable steps the LA could take to avoid this (this is set out in section 33 CFA 2014).

@Porcelainpig People say terrible things about homosexuality and ethnicity on MN all the time. Worse things than I have seen on this thread.

There's a large proportion of Mumsnet users who are seemingly jealous of/in disbelief that anyone actually is disabled. I suspect it's linked to a larger societal problem - shrinkflation, increasing gas bills, proposed higher taxes etc al - and anger at this. The fact wages have largely remained stagnant while interest rates have increased won't have helped. Then there's the issue some people simply can't get jobs - there's not an endless supply - and it's particularly difficult, neigh often impossible, if you're disabled. However, people don't consider the nuances of this. They all to often, seemingly without an ounce of sceptism or cynism, blindly believe the fed narrative that those who are ill are "benefits scroungers". It is particularly bad for people who are neurodiverse, I understand - the attacks on them have been shocking, but all disabilities are under fire. To me it hints of a government/previous governments who are scrabbling to save money and so are attacking the most vulnerable - and also, incidentally, those who least likely to vote for them/benefit businesses by physically returning to offices. As an addendum hidden disabilities are wide-reaching beyond the ones the OP mentioned.

I can assure you they're not.

@Tapofthemorning The "most vulnerable" are not those with hidden disabilities, though.

I can assure they are- as stats prove.

Not at the cost of 30+ other children's educations per violent child. They should be homeschooled until a place is available.

Are you a teacher?

Discussions around SEN should not be restricted to SN boards - these discussions are needed in the broader community if there is to be better understanding.

Yep. So many posts along the lines of disabled people are fine as I long as they are a) just like us normal people or b) locked up.

Chilling really when you think about where this sort of intolerance and scapegoating has historically led.

Who says? Not how it works,
places dont become available they just aren’t there And actually not every parent can home educate and all children are entitled to an education. Some outbursts may not even be the fault of the child.

Teaching unions are also speaking out about pupil attacks on teachers - often as a result of inadequate SEN support.

www.heraldscotland.com/news/24631565.education-scotland-broken-says-eis-fife-secretary/

So up the provision. Re the bullying and attacks on kids with ND and Sen what is to be done about that?

So how are the schools meeting the other 29 children's right to an education, some of who may have SEN themselves?

Violence has no place in a classroom. If a child is violent, they need to be removed for everyone else”s safety, disability or no disability (although the consequences for the child would of course be different depending on the cause and whether they can control the violence)

It depends. If violence is due to inadequate provision, teaching or bullying then actually no one they shouldn’t be removed. I take it you think bullies of children with Sen and ND should be removed too .

Yes, they should. Bullying should also not be tolerated.

But you didn’t answer my point about how the school provide the other children with an education - including non-violent children with SEN - when there is a violent child,

Lots of schools manage it. Ours does. We actually don’t have many children who are violent as we provide good provision and meet the needs of all children. Our SEN figures are far higher than the national average too.